What have you done to your Tacoma today? 1st Gen Edition

Measure the narrowest point in the socket and the diameter of the ball. Curious how much material must be removed for the ball to pull out.

 

Very interesting. Basic intuition has been any play is bad news. But what I'm seeing is that even minor play has some life left, how much life, well that's up for debate. I haven't checked mine in a while, maybe my wheel isn't about to fall off after all.

 

Based on that image, it looks like you would have to wear through a whole lot of material for the ball to have enough room to pull out! Like into the metal

 

Getting a little freaked out on the lower ball joints, y’all putting in time. I just change them every few years or so preventatively, no wheel offs…anyone gone/thinking uniballs? Uniballs worth it?
https://www.chaosfab.com/product/1996-2004-Toyota-Tacoma-Lower-Uniball-Conversion-OE-Tie-Rod

https://anonymousfab.com/products/tacoma-4runner-lower-uniball-conversion?variant=40029876813847

 

I'm running the Total Chaos lowers, but I'm torn on recommended them. If money isn't an object, then they're great, but if you're up to date on maintenance and swap them out once a year or every other year, then you're golden. If you want my 2¢ on them still. They've been great. I personally really like them. I definitely recommend red loctiting the stover nut if you decide to go that route. Out the gate, I had a problem with mine starting to come loose, but customer service has been awesome with Total Chaos. I wheel my truck pretty hard and since I rebuild them with new components and retorqued them with red loctite, I've had zero issues.

 

As a guy who’s worked on houses for a long time, it’d kind of like recommending windows- you can buy vinyl which will likely last a long time, or you can pay triple and install clad aluminum which will look great the rest of your life. At this point I’ve bought enough replacement lower ball joints to not even purchase the Total Chaos, so I gotta question if at the south side of my 40’s, am I gonna continue to use this truck to the point of justifying them vs throwing a couple more sets in over the next several years.

 

Yep. I can totally understand you there. If your plans are daily driving and camping, then OEM/555 balljoints are good enough. If your plans are to start wheeling and pushing the truck, then I'd say send it with the uniball lowers.

 

Is this the material that wears and causes the ball to get loose in the socket?

 

I'll measure tonight.

Agreed. All the liner would have to be gone and some of the metal I believe.

I don't think so, but I wonder if that's what's causing the touch of vertical play for those of us that are hard on our rigs.

It's the grey liner that would have to wear out to cause a problem.

 

And to be clear - I am far from an engineer, cut my LBJ apart for the heck of it, and throwing out wild ass guesses after going through many sets of joints.

If you want to gain some real knowledge, and see a much better cross section, see @Dirty Pool 's post here:

Ball Joints

 

I'm running the Total Chaos LBJs. Not 100% sure I'd recommend them though. They make the steering really sketchy. It's not a big deal on the trail, it is a big deal on the highway.

I keep lubricating them and I was hoping wheeling would break them in. I've now done Niagara Rim Trail twice and Rubicon once on these things and there is no, real, discernable difference... they are still tight and make steering sketchy.

If you are wanting to change from tie rods to heim steering links, would be the only reason I would say they are worth it. (I would absolutely NOT recommend the OE tie rod version) I'd be pissed if this was still my daily driver. Fortunately, that's not the case.

 

Sketchy as in too sensitive?

 

Sketchy as in it doesn't want to return to center. It's too tight. When I make a correction, I have to make another correction to correct it back... if that makes any sense.

On the trail though, it's great. But when I hit a groove (example) on the freeway, it gets stupid. Rolling up 80 to Rubicon with all the tire chain grooves in the road, was not fun.

 

Any idea how much caster you have? That affects return to center a lot... even if the uniballs were entirely loose if you had a ton of positive caster it wouldn't want to come back to center it would fight to stay where it is.

 

I have all of the caster my 333 Fab alignment plates will give me. Don't know the degree because I don't even try and take it to a shop now, because my camber adjust is in my upper control arms now, with the Solo LT.

BUT... when I installed the TC LBJs that was the ONLY thing that changed. The steering was fine before, not so fine after. It has to be the LBJs. Also, when installing the LBJs I already noticed those Uniballs are SUPER TIGHT. You can barely even get the LBJ to tilt to get it to line up with the bottom of the spindle. I mean it takes A LOT of force to even move it around.

If the LBJs themselves changed the caster at all, it would have been a decrease in caster though. Because I rub at the back of the wheel well slightly more than I used to.

 

The other thing to consider is you will likely have to replace the uniballs even more frequently than a ball joint.

They are not protected by anything.

They are constantly getting dunked in everything as they are low.

It's just a Teflon liner keeping it lubricated. Soon as that's worn down or ripped out from dirt getting in there. They are done.

2nd gens have had this as an option for years. Most that run uniball lowers and wheel on a regular basis are on a yearly swap out.

 

Have you reached out to TC? They were helpful when @cbechtold had problems with his set.

 

Understood- one of the main reasons I went to uniball uppers besides over flexing the stock ubj with extended travel coilovers was the ease of service, I didn’t have much luck using pullers/ball joint presses to get the oem style out, I either have to mangle the old ball joint or pull the spindles to put the ball joints under a press. I’ve just gotten somewhat used to the noise and admittedly thought the uniballs would last longer, but oh well.

In the case of the lowers, seems like it’s way easier swapping oem lower ball joints, just replace the bolts at the same time, which would be a consideration for me. Having to remove the lower ball joint then press the uniballs out since I’m imagining they’re going to be a complete bitch to get out since like you said, they’ll be constantly doused and the Total Chaos ball joints are milled from steel.

I’ve had good luck just swapping oem every few years or so, since the truck sees less abuse and I don’t daily drive it anymore, the interval will be even longer.

 

Seems like everyone has had this same problem with these LBJs. Not sure there is a fix other than letting them wear in. I kind of figured there would be a difference on the way home from Rubicon.

Wonder if they have any insight. @TOTAL CHAOS

 

Along those lines.
Neglect/ignore a side loaded uniball and it will eventually pull out. This guy fully admitted to thinking ball joints were no longer a worry. It failed around 50k.



This members OE joint clearly shows the galling of metal on metal after the liner wore thru. This does not happen on a 555 type joint because the ball/seat is machined to some degree of concentric "fit". Unless it's allowed to run "dry", then all bets are off.


For what it's worth the 555 joint has more "meat in the seat" than OE.