Undriveable 2021 TRD-OR - HELP WANTED

There may be somewhat of a mechanical dead zone in the pedal before any electrical input is generated. Remember, there was that whole fiasco with floor mats, so it may be a safety feature. Only way to tell would be to monitor the signal. I really don't notice anything, but I don't have a tune.

My truck rarely sees 6th gear unless I'm doing 75+ mph on relatively level ground with little wind. RPM's are still super low at that speed, so if it needs some power, it is going to downshift, usually twice -- 5th and 6th are both overdrive gears, but it likes 4th gear. I don't think the truck was ever intended to hold 6th gear for long periods of time, and bogging the motor is worse than running it at higher RPMs.

Much of this seems to be expectations and getting used to it. You can tweak a bunch of different things and make minor improvements, but the truck is still going to downshift, and it should. If you can't get used to it, you may have to move on to something different.

I've had a couple of 2nd gens and currently own a '17 4Runner (my wife's DD), so I'm familiar with how they drive. While they have a more "normal" shifting pattern, they are quite anemic compared to the 3rd gen. We recently did a trip in the T4R and there were times when I wished it would just downshift and give me a bit more power. So if you were able to tune in a more "normal" shifting pattern, I would bet the 3rd gen would feel even more anemic than the 2nd.

 

All I want is for the truck to let me use the gas pedal without downshifting, is that not possible?

I'll be honest. No. The truck is a quirky brick with a small engine. And we all want to slap tall rubber on it, making it an even bigger brick with a mechanical disadvantage. I think the mistake most people make is trying to compare it to other vehicles. It isnt like any other vehicle. It's a social outcast that you either love or despise. Tuning and/or gears might add a bit of politeness to it, but it's still a nerd at heart and always will be.

I say this as a hard core fan of the truck. I love it because its quirky and doesnt drive like anything else. Its not going to be fast. Its not going to be comfortable. Its going to wheeze, rattle and lurch. But if you accept the truck for what it is, warts, weird personality, and all, it really is quite lovable.


I skimmed through a few of your posts. I'm getting the impression that no matter how much money you sink into it, you won't be happy. And that's ok. It really is. Everyone has their preferred flavor of ice cream, and maybe the Tacoma isn't yours. I would suggest taking test drives in the 150 and a Tundra. Just go test them both. You might find something there that you like a lot better.

 

What’s your cruising speed on the highway? I haven’t seen it mentioned, but tunes may not be impacting cruise control mode, I’d check that with your tuner.

FWIW, one of the things my tune provided was a butter smooth TC unlock as well as downshifts. It holds gears longer, but will still unlock or downshift. When that happens, it’s just not an annoying experience anymore.

One of the potential downsides to holding gears longer is that sometimes the truck just doesn’t have enough oomph under the hood to deal with the load demand, so it takes a little longer to actually downshift.

I can cruise 80+ with the truck slipping between 5th and 6th as dictated by load.

I can’t comment on the OTT tune, I hear good things. I’m super happy with my tune from another vendor.

 

Well put. I think the part that's hard for me to accept is that a 10 y/o 3/4 ton work truck with 4x the miles could be that much better in almost every measure of 'driveability'. The brakes were better, the throttle response was better, the cruise control was better, etc., etc. I feel like an idiot for paying $20k to 'upgrade' to this Tacoma. I thought I would be getting something in between my CRV and the F250. Shame on me for not spending more time on the highway during the test drive and for assuming I'd get used to the way it drives. That's definitely on me.

I'm going to try to get the tuner to fix the dead pedal issue (probably just take it back to the stock tune). If I can get that sorted, I'll probably eventually get over the highway performance issues. Who knows, maybe, like you, I'll get to the point where I can find some joy in driving it. If I can't get the pedal issue sorted, I'll definitely be moving on. Hopefully the resale on these Gen 3's hold for a while and I can get into something else without taking too big of a hit.

 

you dont need a tuner, change the gears and your set. I run 33" with 5.29 gears and a smart cap. I tow a boat up a mountain and it has a lot of power.

 

I don’t think the blame is entirely on you. Toyota screwed the pooch on the drivetrain on these trucks and they have basically admitted that in various interviews.

My parents have a Highlander with the 2gr-fks and 8-speed transmission. Even when it’s loaded down it feels so, so much better. The 3rd Gen Tacoma’s problem is the transmission. It simply doesn’t have enough gears.

 

Fairly normal for these. I rented a '22 TRD OR for a few days before I bought one, and the shift strategy along with the screwy powerband drove me batshit mad.

I ended up finding a M/T, which is acceptable, but still screwy since the engine makes no torque under like 2500 RPMs.

 

With the error in the speedo from the 33's, I rarely take it above 66mph (true speed of about 70 mph), knowing that the faster I go, the harder its going to be on the engine/transmission. Unfortunately, I came into this truck completely addicted to cruise control. It's been a hard six months getting used to driving on the highway without it, but I just can't handle constant shifting when the CC is set. Maybe I need to start driving with headphones in?

This is interesting. I don't think I noticed a difference in the 'smoothness' of the shifting or TC unlocking after the tune. To me, part of the problem is that every time it shifts (or unlocks the TC), I feel it as a quick deceleration/acceleration event. Does your truck not do that?

 

hmm maybe the issue is only on the newer models, my 2019 is a beast.

 

I'm a bit lost on this one Vlady. As I said, more often than not, if I go up a slight incline while in 5th gear (manual S5 mode), the TC will unlock to boost the RPM, rather than shifting directly to 4th. It will often stay unlocked for quite a while (if I'm driving into a headwind, it may stay unlocked until I hit a decent). Do you believe this is abnormal behavior which is detrimental to transmission?

 

Are you lifted and on 33s as well?

 

I’m hitting a 5hr highway drive in a few hours and I’ll pay particular attention to those shifts again. I do know I have a slight annoyance after upshifts in the lower gears. It’s a *slight* bog down before rpm’s return.

 

Yes im on 33 tires, auto transmission. 5.29 gears is a huge upgrade.

 

OP, I just stumbled across this thread, and I can totally relate to your shifting issue, and with stock tires and a tonnou, the issue of shifting was UNBEARABLE while towing a trailer.

I have 2020, access cab, AT, 6ft box, 4x4. I live in the hills, and hated how much it shifted, empty even, was not fun and instead was troubling, can't be good for the transmission shifting all the time.

Towing it became PATHETIC, matter of fact, towing an enclosed car trailer (even with trailer empty) on the highway, required locking it in 4th at 5k rpm, or having it shift constantly in order to attempt to hold speed; and being wiling to go as slow as 60 mph, did not solve the issue; so 5k for hours at a time was the only option I had to save the transmission, AND the only way to maintain a speed, because all that shifting was perpetual, with loosing speed, downshifting, overshooting target, repeat, repeat. Could not adjust the accelerator quick enough to maintain a target speed, and Cruise made it terribly worse. I was going to sell the truck, but decided to SC instead. I can tell you that the truck is now very fun to drive, and tows a trailer with ease. The shifting is not exactly as I would like it, but there is torque available at all RPMs, shifting frequency is reduced by about 80% and it is pleasant while towing, and Huge FUN when empty. I now love the truck, and am keeping it (would be long gone, if it were not for the SC). I run YotaWerx SC tune, mild pedal response, Magie SC, larger radiator, electric fan and mechanical fan delete, stock tires and suspension.

for your tune, are you communicating with mZiggy for the tune, PM him if you have not already, he has been extremely responsive to all my communications, for YotaWerx. Also, they offer a tune with Gear Lock. This is intended for use on a dyno, to prevent downshifting when you mash the pedal, but I find it useful sometimes while driving (uses the ECT button, so can switch anytime); just be conscious to not be lugging when applied. YotaWerx also just released an update for the NA tunes, and updates are free; though I think it is impossible for a tune alone to get you to a happy place with that truck; it needs boost.

Also, instead of driving 4 hours for a tuner, flash the tune yourself, can be done pretty cheaply and is not difficult. Highly recommend doing it yourself.

I too have experience with dead pedal, but not on this 2020. I have a 2009, that is totally stock. The dead pedal on the '09 is so obvious, and exaggerated by that I only use it in the winter now, so I have to get used to it again each winter. Is in my face while snow plowing, until my foot re-calibrates. BUT I have zero dead pedal on the 2020, and I do not recall any dead pedal when stock, either. Maybe compare it to another truck on the dealer lot, with your hand method, to see if you need a new throttle pedal? Or I bet someone on TW can tell you how to check your pedal with a meter, and verify if it is a hardware issue. Or find one without dead travel and swap parts.

I must say, that the first year with the 2020 taco, was a huge disappointment, that was totally confirmed when winter hit, and I switched back to the 2009, (AT Access cab, 6ft 4x4). Despite some others experience, my experience was CLEARLY that the 2009 was a hugely better driving experience, both empty and towing the same trailers. In fact, i towed the new truck on a trailer behind the '09, for 150 miles of winding roads over the Appalachian mountains, to get it home (COVID issues); and was a fun drive. I bought both trucks new, so lots of seat time in the '09, and is the only comparison I have to the 2020. To me, 2009 was a TRUCK in stock form, Pleasant, solid, predictable; 2020 was simply PATHETIC, for me it did nothing well as a truck or as a car, until boosted. SC changed me from Buyers-remorse to Satisfied-customer. I think Toyota was distracted by developing EV, and released an underdeveloped truck, in the 3rd gen. In fact, given my experience; I am still surprised every time I hear someone that is happy with their stock form 3rd gen? To this I cannot relate.

With you comparing to a diesel, I cannot say that you would ever be as happy as I am, BUT SC makes a dramatic difference, and in my opinion, makes this truck drive like it should have from the factory, as well as making it a appreciable work-horse.

Best of luck in whatever you decide.

 

Thanks for the thoughtful feedback and for sharing your experience. I don't think I have the stomach (or the wallet) for an SC upgrade at this point, but maybe some day. I haven't connected with mZiggy, but it sounds like maybe I should. I did reach out to VFtuner to see what it would take to get set up to tune myself. I definitely don't want to pay for another license, but maybe since I've already had a tune, all I need to buy is the hardware?

 

You came from a truck that had almost 1000 ft lbs of torque at 1800 rpm to a truck that needs 4600 rpm to get a bit over 300 ft lbs of torque. You ain't gonna drive it in 6th gear on the same inclines your old truck did. The downshifting was perfectly normal for your truck as it came from the factory.

The bigger tires made the situation a LITTLE worse. But you bought the truck you bought, and nothing is going to significantly change that. You're either going to have to live with less performance or trade.

 

By how much do your rpms go up when you think tc is unlocked ?
If more than 300 rpms at the same accelerator input, the tune turns off lockup solenoid (SLU), AT2 temp starts climbing. The fluid coupling is being used to rotate the drivetrain. I was browsing service manual other day and saw the reference of 246°F for AT2 sensor. I observed the temp going from 198 to 220 in a few seconds when I played with settings. I dont drive tunes that use this method to gain a performance.
Typically, you lose 50 or so rpms when the lockup solenoid is On and the torque converter uses PWM to lock converter(ECU Lock Up Status =1) by modulating the pressure. AT2 temp slightly increases under the heavy load.

 

My original OTT tune (mild/medium) was the same way... nothing for the for the first inch of gas pedal and then it felt like half throttle much like your graph...

I went back to change it to light mild and the tuner I use said OTT just updated the throttle pedal input for the mild/medium tune to be much less abrupt... I have a steep driveway and with the original tune, you had to be delicate with the pedal to not rocket up my driveway...

The new tune/pedal parameters are perfect and even does well with 700lbs of stuff in the bed.

Just for info, I'm completely stock, stock tires no added weight except for my fat ass... 2020 TRDOR 5' bed... shifting is night and day better than the original tune I had but it will still shift between 5-6 with cruise on our little hills in Alabama...

Good luck!!

 

I had an old Ram (5.9 Cummins) briefly before getting my Tacoma. I can definitely see where you (OP) are coming from. I've had multiple Tacoma's in the past so I was likely more prepared for the huge difference in torque. I also opted for a manual transmission which helped.
My advice would be to move on if you need a torque-based platform, this isn't it.

 

I only wish there was a "love this post emoji"!! You are spot on, its supposed to get out of overdrive, both of them!