Long Travel BS Thread

It’s all in how they are setup. But to say all manual brake setups require more input is absolutely false.

Also, that 350lbs is at the master. Not the pedal.

It’s really no different than me making my steering tighter with the swingset to require more input.

 

Without vacuum or hydro it’s all about mechanical advantage and a lot of manual setups will allow for multiple pivot points to get the leverage optimal.

 

And properly sized/proportioned hydraulics. Lines included.

 

Yes working backwards from the surface area of the calipers.

 

oh I'm not arguing that at all. the booster makes a difference to how much pressure boost there is 100%. I'm just saying that the caliper itself doesn't care whether it gets 200lbs of force from manual brakes, or an electric booster, or a vacuum booster.

Legitimately 350 at the pedal. It's crazy. most people can't push an f1 pedal all the way.

This video is super interesting if you're into f1 at all.

 

First off. The caliper most certainly does care about the input force between the 3. As the internal pressure of the caliper will have a wide variation.

Second off, when talking about f1 (why were on the topic of f1 in an off-road group, I’m not sure) But these drivers also see immense negative g’s under braking which does assist greatly with the input pressure. So maybe it is common place for them to have a heavy pedal considering the constant change of forces.

 

Seems like the harder you push the pedal to get 100% braking, the more control you’ll have over how much of that total amount of force you can apply. I.e. a small total force will be too hard to get the muscles to learn to apply the perfect amount. Might even be that they figure the max force a driver can apply over the course of a typical race without being fatigued and go from there.

 

I love f1, lots to learn there, even for offroad!

Maybe I'm wrong, but I can't understand how the booster affects the caliper at all. It just multiplies pedal force.

super simple example with completely arbitrary numbers:
lets say full manual brakes with a 2:1 ratio as an example, you input 200lb and the caliper sees 400lb
vaccuum boost, you input 150lb and the booster adds 250lb, the caliper sees 400lb
electric boost, you input 100lb and the booster adds 300lb, the caliper sees 400lb.

how is the caliper reacting differently? It's seeing 400lb of pressure regardless of the pedal/booster setup. The booster has changed the pedal force required, as well as the pedal feel, but the caliper doens't matter.

obviously if you input the same pedal force to manual, electric, and vacuum, the multiplication and pressure at the caliper will be totally different, but that's not what I'm saying. A caliper can go from not squeezing to full lockup regardless of which system is used.

 

I think this is it for sure. if the pedal is too light, you can't consistently hit the same braking pressure every time for each corner.

 

Do the brakes work? Truck stops? Sweet, its a fucking Toyota who gives a shit about brakes stopping 1 foot less.

 

I'm very happy with my braking.
Running stoptech on all wheels.
Think the trd's electronic brake booster is important.
I'm kinda heavy with my setup when I go out for a week or so and it has no problems handling it.

 

Is this an unironic "stopping distance doesn't matter"? I'd agree if I trailered by rig but I'm not a Jeep owner.

I had to go through SD the other day and when some idiot decides to come to a full stop in the middle of a highway at 75 for no reason at all, I suddenly gave a couple of shits about my stopping distance.

Brake upgrades are a lot more than 1ft typically.

 

It’s not a 1:1 ratio from master input to caliper is the point. There are way too many variables in play to say they would all react the same with the same input. Caliper pressure/input are the two most important things. Caliper pressure dictates clamp force. You could input 100lbs of force and end up with 500lbs at the master and 1200psi in the caliper.

 

Is it normal for my steering wheel not to return to center easily after installing a +2 all pro kit? I tried adjusting the cams but it feels same if I add caster or not.

 

What is your caster/camber/toe at?

 

RE: brakes - Get the dual diaphragm booster from a Tundra it makes an HUGE difference. If you have a rear disc conversion with a Sequoia or Tundra master adapted it is a plug and play swap and it is a night and day difference

 

Same. They made such a massive difference with all the weight added to the truck. I havent had a single issue with them either and they never heat up or fade plus they shaved 11lbs off each corner.

 

Idk the numbers but basically like stock. When I add some caster it gets worse. The kit calls for stock camber, toe and 2/2.5 caster

 

Sounds like you need to get it on a rack and report back with actual numbers. Because it’s probably not in spec.

 

I have found that uniballs don't like to recenter as nicely as ball joints, just cuz they are tighter tolerance and more friction, especially when new, even when alignment is set up properly, so that might play a part as well.