Blind shock tests

That's good feedback, and not the first time I've heard that. We just didn't want something obtrusive on the screen the whole time, so like @Veet-88 we just put it at the bottom during the rankings at the end of each segment.

 

Yeah, I'll probably send them off for a re-valve before installing. They've been sitting in a box for a year.

 

Run after market treat springs, does anyone just change the shocks?

Concentrate on data, don't mess up on the accelerometer data, don't forget that one of the test shocks has been modified.

Skip the junior high humour, skip the in truck oohs, ahhs that come across as pre pubescent girls discussing the latest taytay fashion.

Give us data. Probably most annoying from this episode is the supposed baseline description. Flat out lazy.

 

I feel the opposite. There are good technical shock videos out there and you can take a nap watching them. Ride quality is subjective and watching in vehicle feedback with words and expressions we all know was much more enjoyable and relatable. Seeing the truck/occupants bounce around and react tells me much more than someone’s shim stack. I’m not that smart.

It’d be really sweet to take the same shock and revalve it for each run to see what changes what. That would be huge for someone like me to get their feet wet in the ins and outs. Anything to help customers convey what they want out of a shock and its tuning.

 

No reason to dumb it down.

 

While I wouldn't mind some additional data and explanation so I could possibly learn more, I think "dumbing it down" is smart. Although I would not have used that terminology. I don't have a lot of experience with off road suspension, or trucks. For me, it was nice to hear their commentary and opinions on ride quality and what was actually going on with the shocks to cause it. For someone like me I probably got more from the video because of that. And, I'll be interested to go back later and watch the individual videos to see what more I can learn

 

No, you just missed the whole intention of the video and decided to take a shit on it so you could feel superior today.

 

Gee man, if you wanted to see certain things so bad maybe you should do it yourself instead of crying about what someone else did.

 

There you have it, ignorance is bliss.

 

Hard to please everybody. That's why the deep dive videos will come out where we talk a lot more technical.

The point of this video is that we test them blind so there can't be any bias. so all we can talk about is how it feels, as we don't know what kind of piston/valving the shocks have.

The deep dives are done after we know what each shock is so we can talk about why each shock performed how it did.

Lots of learning with how to make everything happen, lots of logistics. Sorry you didn't like the free video

 

Also the rear leaf springs had an icon AAL in them which is the most common setup for this level of shocks

 

An interesting note (without giving too much away). I was so impressed by the winner of the mid-budget category i bought a set of the same model shocks tested on the tacoma, for our personal tundra... and they were absolutely awful. My genuine belief is that they simply re-used the tacoma valving in a slightly longer damper and shipped it for the tundra.

So pumped to see more Ride Shocks out there. I've often wondered how a shock would look if it was designed by folks who actually worked on them. For anyone reading this you should check out some of the reels they've posted the ride quality speaks for itself: https://www.instagram.com/rideshocks/


As a note on the Fox 2.5s... The last 3 trucks I've built have ran their IBP's, and the suzuki samurai i tuned with the fastest avg mph in the desert section at KOH 2 years in a row with 0 issues has 2.0 race series on all 4 corners, which enabled it to hit a blistering 36 mph avg lol. They have a good product although objectively their stock valving can be very hard to live with. A friend of mine does production welding for Fox and when i told him about the line-up before our original test he said he would put money on the fox 2.5s we had being the worst by far, which was sort of the reaction i got from other employees as well.
Anyways i was planning on shooting a 3 part series on slowly fixing the fox 2.5s starting with the easiest first (drilling a bleed hole), but then life got in the way. I installed the fox 2.5s with 700 lb/in springs on a customers tacoma with a different piston and custom valving and he texted me on his first wheeling trip raving about the ride quality.

I wanted to list some notes about each shock here for folks who have read this far and want to know more, there will also be deep dive videos posted soon:

1. Bilstein 5100
I did not expect these to win, when trying to figure out rankings i was going from worst to best and 5100s were the only ones left so i threw them in there. It was a complete guess... im just glad i didnt get shocked on that one haha.
I think theres a reason they are one of the most popular aftermarket shocks ever... but we honestly try not to sell that many because folks want to put "upgraded springs" or use them outside of their design parameters. This is the same reason i have never installed a set of 700 lb springs on 6112s for a customer, outside of the heavy load variant 6112 that are valved for and designed for 700s.

2. Fox 2.5
I sorta cleared it up before. Honestly if you're going to buy application specific foxes it's really worth having them custom tuned to start with because they're also more likely to show up to you actually charged with nitrogen and the correct amount of oil and not to show up drop shipped from fox with 7k dollars worth of shocks loose in 1 big box with 10 cents of foam in between everything and all of them damaged during shipping.

3. Dobinsons
This has been my experience with these shocks on all applications I've tried so far unfortunately, they seem like they could be a very good product... particularly the coating seems super robust and i'd guess it holds up in the rust belt, but the ride quality is very poor.

4. Eibach
I had high hopes for these but they did really disappoint, if they did some blind testing and revalving they could have a good product. I recently rode in their stage 2 on a 4runner with similar results.

5. OME
We did test the OME fronts with 5100 rears (off camera) which was significantly better and completely livable. The OME rear is a twin tube, i can easily compress it by hand and it's truly frightening to off-road with. OME production will be largely taken over by another shock company soon, however they still decide on the individual parts used so don't expect quality to increase.

6. Spacer
The stock springs are very close to coil bind at full bump as is, this setup will break things. If you want a lift but to maintain at least stock ride quality and its just for looks just do a drop bracket/spacer lift. A drop bracket is also the only lift outside of long travel that will actually effect what size tires you can fit.


These tests have taught me a lot, at this point I've personally tried over 20 full sets of shocks back to back in the same exact spots at the same speeds. I want to thank Overland Outfitters for giving us the opportunity to do this, it's such a unique education and has really changed my view about suspension and challenged some of my incorrect preconceived notions. I also don't believe ride quality is subjective anymore after all this


I want to also say that although i am friends with many folks who work at shock companies, i have never been given free shocks. If anything it's the opposite where i am sponsoring them by constantly doing free warranty work for some reason. I've also never been told not to say something negative, i have been encouraged to point out when things go wrong by employees at all levels.
I do work with Bilstein sometimes, i've built a lot of their company vehicles and we've hosted them for a women's day event... however from a business standpoint i was hoping they wouldn't win. Right now they have 18 line items for the tacoma that we sell, only 3 are in stock, and 1 of those is only a left side of a rear shock. It would have been convenient if something that is in stock won, so we could pay our bills lol. Take the 8112 for instance as great as they are, as soon as we get a stocking order its sold out in a week for that part number and then its another 3 month wait for a new batch to be made... I have some part numbers that have been backordered for almost a year on them as well.


I can't wait till i can spill the beans on the mid budget results, frankly i was worried all these shocks would ride exactly the same at these price points and was really surprised at just how different they feel.

 

Before the thread gets too long, these videos have been some of the most informative shock videos I've seen and particularly like the blind aspects. I'm looking for new shocks this summer and hopefully you'll get the Bilstein 8xxx's in stock when I'm ready.

Usually it's "pay more - get more" but sometimes it's pay a lot more to get a little more and that's what I've been most concerned about. Although you didn't test back-to-back or even on the same trails (?) as the series a year ago, it does look like pay more was indeed get a lot more.

I couldn't tell if there was much on-road difference between this set of shocks. I'm like most people where although I think I go out as often as I can, the vast majority of my miles are on road doing mundane things.

 

I'm glad they tested this the way they did very rare that we get an unbiased opinion on what's available out there today.

 

The level between a king 2.5 or bilstein 8112 (or any tuned 2.5) and a 5100 is going to be pretty drastic I would say. The 5100 impressed against its peers, and equalled the fox 2.5 with a bleed hole drilled in, but if we took the time to tune the fox properly, I'm sure they would have done much better than the 5100s.

The other benefits of something like the fox2.5 is the tunability, that they can be rebuilt, that they will handle a lot more heat and abuse without fading, and they are a lot stronger (have seen a few snapped 5100s... Probably from driving them like we were in the video haha)

I think in this case it's pay more get more, IF you pay for the right thing. Not all brands are the same, and that's where we are trying to help with these videos. Something else that doesn't show up in most reviews is how easy it is to work with a brand like king for example, as far as buying any part for their shocks, and how easy they are to work on. Other brands are not always as easy to get parts for. I've had a lot of problems with fox and Elka shocks showing up for a customer, and upon opening the box, they are sitting in a puddle of their own oil with no nitrogen pressure. I've never personally seen that with king or bilstein. Being in Canada, trying to get parts to fix the foxes was impossible, and they wouldn't let me warranty them, it had to be the customer, but they don't really have a proper warranty service in Canada and it took around 6 months to get BRAND NEW unused fox shocks warrantied. At least Elka always sends us out parts or new shocks right away.

Something I would really like to do is a more detailed test of the kings, fox PES series, 8112, electronic controlled icons, the new ride shocks, the new dirt king shocks, the elkas, ads and whatever other adjustable high performance shock we can get, with a temperature gun, proper data acquirement, etc. longer running, and spending time getting the adjusters dialled in. Obviously this test couldn't be blind, but I hope that @WEW and I have proven at this point that we are just looking for performance and don't have any brand bias as far as caring who performs the best. We are just as curious as anybody else.

I would absolutely love to put them all on a shock dyno too, that would be super interesting. Maybe we can find somebody who has one that we can use for a week.

 

I'm loving everything I'm hearing here. This type of info (and data!) is so helpful for those of us without the means/time to try a bunch of setups. I'm not in the market for new suspension at the moment but love learning more and at some point I'll need a new setup and all this info will be massively useful. I hope those that do need new suspension now are going to give back by buying from you guys.

Thank you and keep up the great work!

 

Thanks for the correction, some appear to be clear standouts in their categories. I'm also super excited about your next round of test. I've been shy pulling trigger because of the steep cost of buying the wrong set. That said, y'all should start a go-fund me or patreon. You have already saved me money.

 

I am surprised as well. Coming from the Eibach stage 2R (which rode like utter dog shit in my opinion) to the Dobinsons MRR's. The Dobs ride so smooth on the road and off the road. Granted the mrr's are adjustable, I have not heard one single bad review about the IMS's.

 

I’m looking forward to the deep-dive on each of the 6 setups, I wonder when it’ll go up

 

Looking forward to this series!