Long Travel BS Thread

If you go to that companies website you usually can get it cheaper than the Amazon price and they have free 2 day shipping. Windynation.com

 

As my esteemed Tacoma colleague has stated , and is correct.

https://www.windynation.com/products/1-0-gauge-black-red-welding-cable?variant=43801095995614

 

You guys are super helpful thank you

 

I have got a dumb question for y'all. How come we don't see front long travel arms made by anyone with rubber bushings and ball joints, with travel limited by the factory style shock top out and bump stop bottoming? I've done a tiny bit of looking around and it seems like all of the various kit setups require custom coilovers and limit straps, and they all run uniballs and poly bushings so the price climbs out of control. I live somewhere with seasons and would rather not have to replace those bits after every salt season, plus the idea of dropping 20k up front is always scary. I've seen ball joint LCAs for sale that do caster corrections by BTF, it just seems odd to me that nobody has taken that idea one step further by going a little wider and packaging a long travel ball joint UCA with it.

Is it just because once you're buying extra travel most guys are going for every inch?

 

1. The things you are mentioning do not really affect travel #'s
2. JD Fab does offer the option for OE bushings & ball joints on some kits
3. The reason people go to poly or delrin or uniballs is because it is a huge performance & durability upgrade, that factor is not causing a price jump. OE bushings cost more that a set of off the shelf poly bushings & there is no reason you can't use your stock bump stop locations every kit is designed to use those ? it is highly advisable to get a better bump stop though
4. All of the kits do require a different coil over, there is zero point in getting longer arms but still using stock coil overs you would be adding travel capability and then immediately taking it away. A stock coilover is only 5" stroke and a LT coilover is 8"...there are a lot of other factors such as static, compressed and extended lengths
5. Limit straps are not " required " but you should honestly use them even on a stock set up, they prevent all of the force from your rebounding suspension going 100% to the coilover
6. JD fab offers sealed uniballs and sealed bj's

 

I like all these answers, thanks! My only follow-up is #4, can't you just mount the coilover closer to the bushing pivots? It seems like you could mount those coils at the factory distance or closer even, which would need less shock travel, but would necessitate stiffer shocks and springs to deal with the motion ratio and hit desired wheel rates. Basically you'd match OEM downtravel angles, but get more wheel travel from the extended lever arm.

 

You want the shock angle to match the travel of the arms
If you scoot it up like you’re suggesting, it would work in very short intervals
Maintenance on those shocks would probably blow cause the heat buildup would boil the oil inside in a pretty short turn

the motion ratio of the shock would basically cook it

 

I hadn't even considered heat buildup, that makes a lot more sense. Can you elaborate on "You want the shock angle to match the travel of the arms"? Is there a specific measurement here, or moreso matching the demands of wheel rates, shock heat/load, and control arm strength?

 

The way it’s determined is by cycling the suspension
In most cases you get an arm where a smarter person has already done that math
But in rare cases
You have to tab the arm yourself and the way you determine the shock placement on the arm is by cycling the travel of the whole suspension until all parts travel and cycle clean/efficiently
Ideally you want like a 50/50 placement
But some CARS run it further away like 70/30
Additionally
Most schools of thought want you to get somewhat of a straight up orientation on the shock as opposed to it leaning over super hard like old sand cars

 

Someone way smarter in here will likely dress up what I’ve said later since I’m pretty dumb compared to our real builders in here

 

I'm doing what I can to look around at places like Race-dezert.com, and I think I've found what I'm looking for, it seems like most people aim for 1-1.5 motion ratio, never straying past 2 because the shock load/body diameter requirements become prohibitively large. Admittedly this is into racecar stuff and my mind is more focused on a daily driver, but that explains why LT systems seem to always stretch the shock mount and arm, you'd be climbing past 2 and need mahoosive bodied shocks, even for a DD first, wheeler second. I'm still curious about a system using OEM shock/coil configs for the primary and a longer/lower ratio shock/bypass for the secondary but that's pretty clearly suboptimal compared to a proper matched kit with both shocks using the same MR.

 

motion ratio aside, most LT shocks are running a longer stroke than stock-width coilovers can provide, so you're limiting travel one/both ways [up or down travel]

 

you’re over thinking an entire industry with decades of tried and true design principles… rule of thumb - if an entire industry does not make what you are looking for = you’re wrong

 

Yup, sure am, love being laughed at for it too!

 

That's where that question was coming from, it's really easy to make a lever arm translate 5" of motion into 15 so a stock style shock wouldn't limit travel, but if you can't make shocks/springs handle those loads then there's no point. It seems like ratios over 2-1 are just asking to destroy normal sized stuff, and there ain't no way you're fitting 4 inch shocks that would live in that space lol.

 

The Camburg Trail LT series kit does just that.

https://camburg.com/products/cambur...s-suspension-long-travel-kit-cam-310154-k-gry

 

Not sure how I'd missed that, but it sure does. That's a neat bit of kit.

 

I don't agree with this mentality but to each their own. Just because it's been done a certain way, doesn't mean it's the best.

I find that people are pursing performance when they go to LT, so sacrificing certain performance gains isn't appealing for the amount of money you're spending.

It's a newer kit. I haven't heard much feedback but they designed it with the exact same concept in mind.

Personally, I'd rather just sell my OE length shocks and purchase an LT spec for the performance aspect but that's just me.

 

Yeah there's two parts to this idea that have been bouncing around in my head. The first is getting extra performance, and the the bit that's already been done plenty, the formula is already out there as @Evenflow so elegantly pointed out. The other half is the maintenance half. I live in and daily a vehicle in areas with seasons, and occasionally hit trails that have mud pits and such. The idea of needing to replace unsealed joints every year or two kinda sucks so I'm really interested in stuff that's both rugged and gives actual performance gains, even if you're only getting 70-80% of the gains you would otherwise get from going full monte. I'm not looking to hit whoops like a trophy truck could, I'm driving the wrong platform for that lol. Just add a bit of capability to an already capable vehicle.

 

I would like to say tho…
A dirt king upper arm
And a stock lower arm
With a properly tuned king OEM replacement SMASHES
It is good for 99% of the stuff UP TO where you’re actually beating the suspension off the truck from holes