Upgrade shackle hangers or not? Alcan Springs/FWC

Not sure. There were no marks on it, it was just cockeyed. I did use the truck to its fullest potential with a camper though.

 

Dedeckera?

 

Good eye!

 

Lol, well there you go! Would love to see a pic of that to see wtf was going on there.

 

I got nothing to share it was years ago. But a lot of people bend their leaf spring brackets!

 

I’ll give you more than one. A lot? Not with you there

 

Well, I got the Alcans installed. They did an amazing job getting the load correct. I told them my scale weight, 0” lift with factory rake when loaded. They sure nailed it!

Haven’t had the opportunity to drive it yet but I’ll report back.

 

I was also worried about the clearance between the sumos and the frame, alas, should still be very compliant. Still haven’t pulled the air line from the air bags, good riddens!

 

Looking good! Gonna do new shocks?

 

That’s the plan, thinking falcons. Haven’t been able to commit to the trimming and drilling necessary so I think I’m just stalling at this point. Any other suggestions for the load?

 

I bent my stock hangers a little bit. I have a Vagabond Drifter with buildout, so, some extra weight, but nothing like a FWC. But I hit some of those big speed bumps on the highway in Baja a little too fast and I think that’s what did it.

I was just looking at my buddy’s truck and he has a slightly bent hanger too. Roof top tent and HC rear bumper only.

You can drive with slightly bent hangers and not notice it, and it might not even hurt much. The thing that sold me on Hammer Hangers was talking to a retired couple who are touring the world in their Tacoma with a FWC. They bent their hangers badly enough that the shackles were scraping up against metal.

 

@05w/FWC Congrats on the SWIFT, As FYI, there is a FWC thread here where you can get opinions from other FWC owners:
FOUR WHEEL CAMPER (FWC) THREAD!! | Tacoma World

In my case (fully loaded Fleet) I went with Deavers Stage III and kept my original airbags but decreased pressure to a low 10 psi. Rational is at normal height, the leafs will carry the majority of the load for normal highway driving but when offroad if/when I fully compress the leaf springs, the airbags will progressively carry more load (but not full load) with goal to distribute the load equally at 3 points instead of 2 points.

 

Agreed, that’s why I put my Sumos back on, so I get that same distribution. I think by the time I’m compressing the sumos a lot of the weight should be there and not on the hangers, but I will be watching that closely to decide whether or not to make the upgrade.

I prefer to change as little as possible until I know it’s 100% the right move. I drove the truck all last summer with the FWC with airbags and cradles and it wasn’t quite adequate, hence the leaf upgrade. I’m going to drive it a bit and see how things go. We don’t have any long trips until July, so plenty of time to make the swap.

In the meantime I’m having the Magnuson installed next week. Seems like they’re pretty reliable and I found one brand new in the sealed box for half off. I just couldn’t pass it up! That one didn’t have to make sense, it’s just for fun!

 

I don’t understand this obsession with leaf spring hanger upgrades, especially in the context of high speed handling. Assuming the goal is to reduce lateral movement of the rear end during cornering, I suspect highly that the weakest link is the tire sidewall, not the leaf spring hanger.

 

There is a whole series of components that contribute to lateral movement — not just for cornering but also during bump absorption while driving straight. One issue with shackle hangers is they act as levers on the frame rails, twisting them and transferring force to other parts of the vehicle (e.g. bed mounts, and also anything mounted in the bed or on bed rails), and when the hangers bend (or are permanently bent), that moment arm increases quite a bit. I have a crack in a weld on my Vagabond Drifter camper that came from bed twist, probably from one frame rail twisting independently of the other, which was probably exacerbated by my OE (at the time) hangers.

1. As you said, the tire sidewalls give, but when the sidewalls give, that absorbs and contains twist and lateral movement before it reaches the frame rails.

2. The bushings between the shackles, the leafs, and the shackle hangers compress and give, but when they do, that absorbs and contains twist and lateral movement before it reaches the frame rails.

3. The leaf springs themselves twist, but when they do, that absorbs and contains twist and lateral movement before it reaches the frame rails.

4. The bushings on the shock absorbers compress and give, but when they do, that absorbs and isolates movement before it reaches the frame rails.

5. Finally, the shackle hangers themselves bend, both outward and upward, in both bumps and in cornering, and when they do, they directly transfer side-independent force directly to the frame rails. That is the issue that aftermarket shackle hangers help alleviate. Especially with a cross tube, this side-independent twisting motion is eliminated.

So really, the aftermarket shackle hangers serve to contain the twist, compression, and lateral movement to the more flexible parts of the vehicle: the tire sidewalls, the bushings and the leaf springs, all of which are engineered from the start to absorb that force.

I follow a builder who took this a step farther and eliminated the rubber bushings on his leaf springs, replacing them with greasable metallic sleeves, which made his rig noisier, but forced all that twisting, compression, and lateral movement to be contained at the leaf springs. (Note, he was already running with a reinforced frame.) He was really happy with the amount of *predictability and stability* that modification produced for his rig, and he is in no way a fast or aggressive driver.

We see this same approach on higher-end coilovers, which eliminate the rubber bushings in the lower shock eye in favor of greasable heim joints. It all adds up to more predictable and stable handling, and reduces failure points, especially for long cycles of the suspension.

I believe the Xrunner addressed this torsional stress in a different way, with additional cross bracing for the rear of the frame.

Sporty cars and rally cars likewise often have a cross brace that connects the tops of the coilovers, to better control flex there.

All this said, it might not serve as a worthwhile upgrade for lighter trucks, but for trucks (like mine) running at GVWR, or above that, as in the case of a FWC, (or for trucks driving fast over uneven terrain, such as desert whoops, or even trucks blitzing forest service roads with potholes, or even trucks hitting the unnecessarily huge speed bumps on the highways in Baja at night) the upgrade can be really beneficial.

Again, I talked to a retired couple with a FWC who had bent their hangers so badly that their shackles were rubbing on metal. In these cases, the hanger upgrades are definitely worth it.

In short, the hanger upgrades may be analagous to gusseted spindles up front. But arguably, especially with a lot of weight in the rear, the hangers will bend long before the front spindles do. (While I know of several people who have bent their hangers, I only know of one person who has bent a front spindle, and that was by hitting a stump submerged in a water crossing.)

(Edited for additional info and clarity.)

 

I think @gudujarlson 's point was there is a lot of other deflection going on before your hanger deflection comes into play. As you said, tires, shock bushings, leaf spring bushings, leaf spring twist will all happen at lower forces than a hanger will deflect. Once those have all deflected enough to transmit enough force to the hangers, then you will start deflecting the hangers/frame rails. So there are lots of opportunities to increase lateral stiffness short of doing anything with the hangers, arguably with a greater impact, if that's your goal.

To cause a hanger to permanently deform, seems like it would take a big hit with a very stiff leaf pack. My intuition (and lacking evidence) is that when hangers are "bent", the frame rail is actually twisted. In which case the cross bar might be the most important addition.

For me with day to day driving, the change in hangers and the cross member was imperceptible. But it's probably good insurance given the weight over the rear axle, stiffer leaf packs, and my propensity to drive too fast in the desert. That said, I had 20,000 miles on the truck with the Drifter, HC bumper, and lots of off road driving, and my hangers were right as rain when I pulled them off.

 

I know some folks running Falcons on a Jeep and a Sprinter. No first hand experience though.

For that much weight and spring, I would say 2.5" with a remote reservoir. Compression adjusters are really nice for getting things dialed in, especially if your load or driving conditions fluctuate. I've got ADS shocks and have been really happy with them. I don't think you can go wrong with Fox or King, you'll just want to get something that is valved appropriately for your setup, either from factory or through a third party like Accutune.

 

I have a stock weighted truck, and I would absolutely recommend upgrading the hangers. The ride quality and handling increases were amazing with the Archives. With your weight and the camper, I would also add bed stiffeners to keep everything where it's supposed to be and reinforce the whole rear end setup. I added them as well just as a pre-emptive maintenance since I like to flex my truck out whenever possible.

You don't really understand until you drive when them. Then it all make sense. You can flex the stock hangers by hand which makes the rear end of the truck very jittery. Upgrading them is the closest thing to a control arm upgrade you can do in the rear. Soooo much improved ride quality and handling after they're on. Huge benefits with no downsides. If you can't feel how awful the factory rear end setup is, then they're probably not for you. To the rest of us, they are a fantastic upgrade.

 

Update!

Well, I got to take it for my first drive with the new Alcans around town- wow they are so smooth! It rides smoother than it did stock without the weight. I still have the TRD OR Bilsteins and haven't replaced the hangers. I am planning to do the shocks for sure to tighten it up, but it still feels totally acceptable as is. Regarding the Falcons, what has made it hard to pull the trigger is you have to drill and cut the shock hood to make them fit or get wheel spacers if you don't of aftermarket offset to clear the piggyback. I've been meaning to call Accutune, but just haven't gotten around to it. I have a feeling something I'm going to run into is that since I don't have a lift, there may not be a shock with correct length that they sell; TBD.

I really like the idea of the cross tube with the hanger upgrade. That makes sense, except I will never add a swing out tire carrier. We've got a bike rack and I think adding 300lbs just to have a cross-tube would be moronic with already having the camper weight. Maybe the answer is no spare and carry tire plugs and a pump...? Would save weight... ; )

Also, I did drop it off for supercharger install today!