Looking for front end wreck at low speed ( 8-15 mph)

Hi fellow Taco lovers ! I need the taco community help ! This is a little long intro but bear with me ….. My son (18) has a 2021 Taco crew cab - this past Sunday he was in an accident at a 4 way stop at low speed as he had just entered the center of 4 way stop then the drove in front of him ( I am guessing 8-15 max mph)(airbags did not deploy). He had come to a stop ( verified on our life 360 app) and unfortunately T boned a 2022 Honda HRV/CRV being driven by a man who was in his late 80’s ( his wife of similar age was in passenger seat)that I suspect ran their stop sign at 20ish mph , passing in front of my sons Taco and resulting in him hitting the passenger side doors . The couple were transported to hospital due to age but had no obvious injuries and did not seem distressed on seeing them. Their car “looks” bad and is likely totaled but the side crumple zone on the Honda did its job… my sons taco front end also blew apart as designed , we will see what the body shop says with the insurance but it hopefully is fixable . Once he took off the damaged parts it drives fine. My son has no injuries thankfully. Now comes the reason I al asking for help. My son was ticketed for “running the stop sign “ and careless driving , IMO because he is an 18 year old and the damage to the car and his truck look dramatic - and I get it ( I inspect wrecked cars for buyers as a side gig ) - but - I need to gather some examples of front end damage to these trucks at low speed impacts to show the court when we go to the hearing . There was no camera footage of the intersection and the cop who wrote the tickets would not even entertain me showing him the gps track of the drive and speeds showing there was no way my son ran the stop sign . Just his opinion at that moment . So thank you to any of you made it this far ! Any pics and info would be helpful as I try to build a file to have on hand for court . Thanks truck friends ! These tacos are great trucks !

 

Unfortunately in this situation with no camera footage and no witnesses IMO the court will side with the police officer that worked the accident. IMO it’s probably best to lick your wounds and move on.

 

Can you not present this, "gps track of the drive and speeds showing there was no way my son ran the stop sign" in court?

 

The key word here is “I suspect” the OP does not have evidence to prove the Honda ran the four way stop. Even though his son came to a complete stop that doesn’t mean the Honda wasn’t there first had stopped and had the ride of way. IMO it’s going to be very hard to beat in court without more evidence.

Just because the couple was in their 80’s doesn’t make them at fault nor does being 18 make the OP’s son at fault age has nothing to do with it.

 

I'm just some guy sitting on the toilet and the Tacoma looks like is almost thru the intersection. Presuming the stop sign, not pictured is at the rear passenger side of lader 4.

 

X2.
Quite likely the office will be considered an "expert witness" in court, despite not witnessing the event.
Life 360, not so much.
I'd move on before wasting time and effort, and then topping it off with court costs when this loses in front of the judge.

 

Still might be worth taking to court might be able to avoid or lessen any points or fines. Might even get the opportunity to plead not guilty if the other party does not show.

 

This sucks for you guys. Tough situation. This is why I recently installed a Dash Cam. Our public auto insurer has moved no fault insurance in the last couple of years. From what I hear they like to assign fault 50-50 regardless of the situation if there are no witnesses. He said she said can be tough to prove either way. The dash cam will really help in those situations.

 

You never know, maybe the judge won't show up. lol

jk. But, I have known what has to be a dozen folks over the years that took their traffic tickets to court, and don't recall a one that won.
But you're absolutely correct, anything's possible.

 

Thanks for the input this far. I am going to consult with an attorney about this but was hoping to find comp pics of these trucks on lower speed front end hits to show that these are made to blow apart like this at low speeds and am looking online for similar on the other persons brand vehicle . Yes I will be presenting the gps info and am waiting to see if Allstate will provide me with copies of their own speed and tracking system they have on my sons phone as well to corroborate that he did not “ run” the stop sign . He was a quite a few feet into the intersection when the Honda passed in front of him - there were no brake marks from either party to show point of impact . I am going to do what I can to provide supporting data /pics that can help his case . He has no prior tickets or at fault accidents . He was rear ended last year by some jackazz on his phone who did not brake at all and impaled and to totaled his Hyundai sonata on our very robust tow hitch - the taco suffered no damage in the rear from that impact amazingly Lthough did have front end damage that was repaired from his truck being propelled into the suv in front of him - no fault of his

 

I don't think there's a case here. Last time I got a traffic ticket I did go to court with the intent to get a reduced sentence or keep my license clear. Got lucky and the State's witness did not show. The hearing was at 3pm and on the other side of town from where they patrol. I don't know how it would have gone had they shown up.

 

Man, sorry to see this but be glad everyone is OK. Truth of it is no one deciding what happens next was a firsthand witness so they’re going off of what is available now. Hopefully you can get GPS info to mitigate your sons liability but as you stated he’s the 18 yr old so bias already having an effect with the officer.

That said the point of impact being dead center on the Honda won’t help him either. That’s usually a major factor in determining who coulda/woulda/shoulda and likely not in his favor here.

Feel for you, been there with one of my kids before so really mean that.

 

If I was the cop I’d write up all involved ….there's more to stopping at a sign than just stopping. Have to make sure it’s safe to leave the sign.
Op, I’m sorry a post like this was necessary, and am glad your son is fine.

 

NO other witnesses at all at the time???

 

I contested a speeding ticket (going 35 in a 25) and in court the cop said they decided to drop the case as the neighborhood was vacant houses and they were updating the speed limit there to 35- that took a day off my work, an hour drive to court, and 4 months of worry. I really didn’t win in the long run.

 

I really suggest cutting your losses and moving on. Yes you can hire an attorney but with all probability you will be throwing good money after bad. I think your son was traveling at a >speed than 8 to 15 mph but for you the burden of proof will be on you to prove he wasn’t. You have already used the words like “guessing” and “I suspect” neither are in your favor. JMHO

 

Forgive me but the title "Looking for front end wreck at low speed ( 8-15 mph)" sounds like an ad in the craigslist personals.

 

It has nothing to do with the damage and everything to do with your son hitting them in the passenger door. GPS may say he stopped, but without video evidence or an eyewitness, there is no way to prove that they ran the stop sign or that he looked both ways and 'didn't see' the other vehicle before leaving the stop sign. (Things happen) And TBH, his age isn't helping.

When it comes down to it, it's his word against theirs and the cop is going to report it as he sees it: a broadside. The courts will side with the officer's report.

 

I'll be honest. I scrolled to the pictures first, then went back and read the post.

Before your description, the pictures alone absolutely look like the Tacoma blew the stop sign. Regardless of ages, if I was walking up to the scene, I'd absolutely place the blame on the Tacoma.

I think the reality here is "what difference does the truth make?"

From my perspective, very little. For the Honda driver, it was a lucky shot. For your son, not so much. But because your son stopped at the intersection, the onus was also on him to check for the cross traffic that they're complying with the same laws he complied with. There's absolutely no road law that requires leaving a stop sign as fast or as soon as possible.

Even if there was drone footage of the entire incident, the fact of the matter is that your son hit them, not the other way around. So if he fully stopped as legally required, from my perspective, he either wasn't paying attention enough to what the other vehicles were doing, or went off an assumption that the other vehicles would be stopping, and left the stop sign at full speed. Because that's exactly what most young people like doing when trusted with 300HP steel pillow.. It's exactly what I did...

I can definitely tell you that amount of damage doesn't appear consistent with someone that fully stopped at a stop sign, and then reasonably accelerated away. It genuinely looks like he was going for the gold medal, and at risk for 3rd place.

Due to that nature, correcting the reality for your version of the truth(there are always multiple versions of truths. The officer didn't need to lie on his report to state what he saw, he more than likely reported what he saw as the truth, no different than any parent immediately seeing their blood relation as faultless in a situation), is likely going to be a fools errand.

This is one of those cases where it's an unfortunate lesson for your family on expectations and rule compliance of others. The best outcome is that no one was seriously hurt. It's time to lick your wounds, learn and reflect on the experience both inward and outward, and move on, hopefully better for it.



And for the record, this was my intersection learning experience. I remember being angry for some reason that in hindsight, definitely didn't matter, and I was busy romping on it, bang-shifting my way through 2nd and 3rd gears, somewhere around 40mph when I went through an intersection that I wasn't required to stop but cross traffic did have a stop sign.

Except this time. They had somewhere to be as well, and blew the stop sign at around the same speed. I was on the brakes and around 25-30mph at impact when I realized they were going too fast to stop for their stop sign.



That mistake, on my part for going as fast as I was, as well as inherently trusting other people to comply with road rules, cost me $10,000 and a 3 month old car.

But you can bet I always watch what traffic is doing at intersections now, and act according to them, not necessarily the rules of the road....

 

2 of the worst age demographics for drivers.

Try and figure out who was in the intersection first. The second is at fault (I believe this is correct).