Is the hybrid engine a bust?

Don't care. A Toyota PHEV truck is coming. Do with that info however you wish.

 

eh that fair you like it I don't its all subjective anyway. Hopefully though Toyota actually makes it look presentable and not that hot garbage that is the cyber truck I have seen 2 of those now and I just don't get the appeal its ugly as sin.

 

Even a coal power plant produces and delivers energy to your house at an efficiency that’s at least double what burning gasoline gets you. And that’s a literal worst case scenario for power generation.

…But don’t let facts get in the way of your feelings, sweetheart.

 

2024 Trail Hunters are averaging 15.8 mpg over 13k miles combined on Fuelly.com. I'm averaging 18.8 over 9k miles on my RRaptor. I respectfully disagree with your assertions.

 

PHEV ≠ BEV

 

We don't know the details of that dataset of seven trailhunters. How loaded down are they? What is the use case? Do they use it as a generator at camp like I do? Loaded down just tooling around my home base right now I am getting 17.2. I am sure you are aware of so many variables. That is why I just don't pay attention to Fuelly.

Edit: When I was travelling Mojave road and camping and bothered to keep track of fuel, I was getting around 14. That was convenient because Baker is halfway and I could get an accurate measurement.

 

It's a truck, who gives a shit about 0-60?

 

I have to second this. I’ve been a 3G for over 5 years. I test drove a 4g hybrid and the power gains are obvious the second you pull out of the dealership driveway, it pulls continuously and way more than the V6 ever has. The transmission is by far the biggest night and day, its is easily as smooth, probably smoother shifting, than my IS500’s 8 speed. The swap overs from motor to E-motor and back with the engine restarting is almost imperceptible unless you’re looking at the RPM gauge.

Go to the dealer and drive one, you will be surprised. I’m actually considering the upgrade as my truck is my daily.

 

I’d assume a Plug in hybrid 4G will look exactly like all the other 4Gs. The plug in rav4, Camry, Prius, Lexus NX, RX all look like their hybrid and gas only counterparts except for a badge and another door on it that looks like a gas door.

 

Sales figures for a lot of things are a bad marker to determine/say what's "best." Mc Donald's sells the most hamburgers, but they are by no means the "best." The F150 is the best selling full size truck; it's not the "best." And the list goes on and on.
The only time that sales figures can be used to determine the "best" is if you happen to own whatever thing's sales figures you're quoting... And then you're just trying to convince yourself that whatever you bought is the "best."
Buy what you like & like what you buy. It's really that simple.

 

Butter on hot glass. So like cruise control in the rain? Sounds terrifying.

Anyway, I read the first page of posts, which is all that ever matters on this forum, and this is the major takeaway:

I am philosophically destroyed by the concept of making my own tater tots while camping.

I am spinning like a falling cat with buttered toast strapped to my back.

 

What folks don't take into account is that Ford includes their "fleet" sales in the overall reporting figures. It accounts for up to 60%+ of sales. For most, if not all, these fleet trucks are cheap and plain-Janes. Most of these purchases are done through large competitive bid processes. Cheap prices = increase sales...

 

"Hybrids are unreliable and cost more to maintain"

*laughs in 2008 Prius with 250k+ miles..

 

I’ve seen one with over 400k miles. Battery was obviously getting to be toast but it ran and drove fine. Change the battery with a remanufactured one for $1200 it’ll probably do another 100k

 

If Toyota offers a 4G with the hybrid and long bed in a trim lower than just the TrailHunter, I would be seriously inclined to trade up. But I will say, my non-hybrid does great with everything I've thrown at it already from towing to hauling to cruising. I can pull most hills at freeway speeds with the engine casually loping at ~1700 RPM. I used to drive 3/4 ton and 1 ton diesel trucks back in the days when my family had large toyhaulers to drag around, and that torque is what I loved about them. I figured the hybrid would offer a similar driving experience to a diesel, but my non-hybrid does pretty well! Since its paid off, I would have a hard time justifying the trade in, so if / when Toyota offers it in a SR5 Long Bed, I will have a tough decision to make.

I'm also watching the Hybrid posts as well, as my wife's Highlander Hybrid has suffered from an unusual issue with the brakes when switching from regen to friction - the lag had gotten very noticeable and it leaves the driver with a little scare - feels like you lose the brakes entirely for a second or more. Found a TSB online in a Highlander forum, and my local dealer fixed it, but now a few months later, it's reappeared and we have it back in the shop for that again. Its bad enough it has us thinking of swapping it for a non-hybrid version, or a Honda Pilot, but we're hoping the dealer can get it fixed, since we love that vehicle.

 

Yea, I was really interested in the hybrid until the LB was paywalled behind a trailhunter, so to a certain extent this is cope. Despite the defamed 0-60 metric, the hybrid only improves power-to-weight by 8.4%. As others noted, a light tune can far exceed that improvement and without all the heft. But, if they expand the LB to i-FORCE MAX OR/Sport/SR5, I'd definitely consider it.

 

I made the exact same point a month ago in another thread and got totally trashed by the illuminati here. The Raptor has more HP, gets better MPG, and is a LOT faster, without the weight and complexity of a hybrid system. The Tacoma hybrid is just a porker with bad MPG.

 

I work in heating and cooling industry and I like to know where you get that fact from because last I checked coal is less efficient in power and heat production then gas which is why we don't have coal furnaces anymore but to also add to your misleading comment even a simple google search would tell you that Gas is more efficient in power production then coal by 35% but hey what do I know?

 

Seven data points of Trailhunters on Fuelly averaging 15 mpg suggests to me they are being used as intended. As offroad RVs. But that is just a wild ass guess as your observation that THs really only get 15 mpg driven normally just because they are pigs. Both of us don't really know, because we aren't them. So many variables. There are wildly disparate results here at TW just between similar trims.

I only had mine stock for a day and half. Computer said 20-21 mpg. Didn't fuel so don't really know if that was accurate. Fully loaded and on a trail and camping I don't really keep track. The time I had a camping mpg w/o highway miles that I tracked was halfway on the Mojave road. I got around 14 mpg. I think I was going downhill. I have a weighed down rig because that was the intended tool. Around my home base now, I get over 17 mpg.

TLDR; apples and oranges. Seems TH owners are using them as intended. Not as just a trophy truck.

 

I think that you two are talking about two different metrics: thermal efficiency vs specific energy. That is an apples to magnets comparison.