Crank Shaft Damage

The crankshaft is hardened, the harmonic balancer isn't. The galling you see on the end of the crank is material from the harmonic balancer. Cleaning up the crank and verifying the diameter with a micrometer should do it.

The shop screwed up, I'm sure they won't again.

 

Ive seen a few damaged keyways cut-outs in my career, it happens...
They keyways wont stay put securely.....
Theres a shit ton of vibrations & truama that goes on at the dampner level....
pulses from ac compressor, cylinder firing, all sorts of drag from all the other accessories, etc.
Theres a reason it has such a huge center bolt & torqued to an extremely high spec.......

Yes were hoping the bolt does its job & the keyway is just for alignment purposes....
But shit happens, ive been in the industry for so long, nothing would surprise me...


If it was my vehicle I would be more involved, get actual legit hi-def pictures of the damage first hand & make a decision off of what I saw, not what they were telling me to make the job go away as cheap as possible.
Is the crank keyway slot in the crank damaged or not, we dont know.................................

I do know for a fact theres still stress on that keyway regardless of how tight that bolt is...

 

You're right, we didn't see the keyway or the key. That does concern me. What Toyota saw was a big $ repair bill that wasn't their making. Of course they were going to press for a crank. Whether it needed it is anyone's guess. My guess is the galling can be cleaned up and all will be well. Crankshafts are hardened, keys are hardened, harmonic balancers aren't. It could pound the keyway out, my guess is no. Keyways aren't replaceable, keys are.

This shop isn't going to get burned a 2nd time. He admitted their problem and is going to make it right. If he found after getting it back to his shop that it needed a crank, then I'm willing to bet they'd put a crank in it.

 

I 500% disagree....
You guys have a bad attitude when it comes to dealers & they always gouge, try to hit a home run, etc...
Last thing that tech wanted to do is install a crank in that old engine..............
I truly feel he saw something as it kind of clearly states in his notes....
If the tech felt he could have been a hero & correctly repaired it, he would have...

If that job came through my stall & all it needed was a little clean-up, a new keyway & dampner.....
Thats would I would do, thats a home-run, why sell him a crank & expose myself to even more liability....

Theres no right or wrong here, just another perspective from someone who's been doing it forever...
Only time will tell & even then, may see an issue down the line when torn apart again.

They could have even JB welded the keyway back in if the crank was damaged, just to make it go away.

Ive seen similar damage & the edge of the keyway slot was damaged, wollered out, so the hardened theory doesnt always hold true.

 

example...
hardened metal....

hNygNglTZEc

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/WZXOSRuSSV8

 

I understand what you're saying. What I've seen with dealerships is they will go with the path of least resistance. I don't believe that a tech is going to have the leeway to spend any time analyzing that crank enough to confirm it's bad. Dealer management will always err on the side of not having that truck come back with another problem. Throw parts at it. I've seen it happen and had a friend tell me stories.

This came to them with the knowledge that another shop created it. They have no incentive to save the customer one cent.

The independent shop has the freedom to take an extra hour or two to check everything over closely and make the call.

 

example of butchery in progress............

I think im done here & got my point across


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yJNRP68ajk

 

Apples and oranges. Anyone that would think that crank is salvageable should have their head kicked.

 

disagree.
I call all my shots, not my manager from behind his desk...
I know more than any manager, if you can reasonably fix the car inexpensively why not try.....

Techs that are inexperienced, clueless, scared, get managers to make the calls.

Tech could have also said, hey mr customer, lets try a repair by installing a new keyway & pulley....

You need to understand theres risk & may result with end of the day you will be coming back requiring a crank....
But I feel 75% confident I can fix this without a crank, that dent happen either.

We dont have pics, so its ALL speculation at this point.

Im done, ive already beaten the dead horse, I go my point across.

To the OP, truly not trying to scare you...
I scare myself cuz ive seen everything so many times at this point, I trust nobody & want to see with my own eyes...

 

Post all of the videos or pics you want. We didn't see OP's crank and have no idea the condition. As I've been saying, alomst every dealer I've had experience with in the last 20 years is going to throw new parts at that all day long. There is no incentive for anything else. Service manager sees nothing but $$$$$.

You may be a great tech, I have no way to know, but you are knowledgeable. Dealer management is another story completely, I'm sure you've experienced that too.

 

I was out of town when all this was happening. The only reason I took it to Toyota in the first place was because it is 3 miles from my house and I had a flight to catch early the next morning. Figured I could drop it off have a slightly more expensive fix from the dealer and have my vehicle ready to go when I got back in town. I was camping in a national park and had limited service to deal with asking for photos and getting exactly what I wanted.

Yes it's a bummer we don't have better photos of the keyway but the owner did show me the original key and it wasn't all that bad. I was also shown the original crank pulley and HB so I have proof that it was all replaced.

They f'ed up big time damaging the crank from a simple timing belt job but I do believe they are honest. Like I said before they owned the mistake and made right on their wrong. How to right that wrong is debatable but that's what they went for. I asked for at least 5k mile guarantee to be written on paper but he gave me a "gentleman's word" you could call it, that if I had any issues related to crank that they would take care of it.
At that point, I would have them buy me a new engine and not touch my vehicle again.

 

Think the shop should of documented what they found originally and contacted you immediately

I bet they NEVER make that mistake again.....bitter lessen learned for them


I believe the JB would of had half a chance on a timing gear keyway
....but no way on the main pulley.....just asking for trouble

because the fit between the pulley and the shaft is so tight....you loose feedback on the feel when mounting

anything you can do to facilitate those two sliding easier together would be a big plus

and I'm not addressing the OP on this.....just other DIY's that venture here.....slow and careful
this is dangerous territory.....especially with a brandnew HB

Over tightening the alt belt is the No1 killer of HBs.....dont do it

modern rib belts dont need to be super tight like V belts of the old days

 

You guys are going to love this one. Shop swears they didn't put a sleeve on the crank. Sure looks like a failed sleeve to me.

 

I wont say it.......
I wast trying to be Negative Nelly.....
but ive seen lots of hacks & I was making a stink about this cuz it really stunk to me.....

So now what!!!!
You want pics of everything they do, you tell them to their face that you dont trust them.......

 

I couldnt tell you if its a sleeve or not.
That ripple at the 1:00 position is in the dampner hub, not a rippled sleeve...
Not sure what the aluminum foil is about.....?
But what the story, why is it apart again?
Where is it an now?
Back at the same shop or back at the dealer?

Not sure what going on, correct me if Im wrong, center crank bolt threads destroyed?

Safe to say it didnt make it 5k...

If you need another avenue, opinion on repairs as if I remember youre in Poway....
Action Cylinder Heads in santee, owners name is Richard.
He may be bit rough on the phone but he knows his shit....
Theyre a machine shop, engine rebuilders, they do R&I work too...

 

Haha it's okay, I'll say it for you... You were right.
After about 300 miles started to notice a "droning / grinding" noise.
Took it to a different local shop to get a third opinion at this point. They originally thought it could just be fan bracket. I asked them to tear it down and check the crank while they were in there.

This is what they found. I went there today and took this photo. They haven't taken the crank pulley off yet to inspect the crank and key but I suspect it won't look good.
I sent this photo to the original shop and called them. I'm a nice guy but I'm pretty irate at this point. The conversation went back and forth. I'll call them out now, Sean at SD Auto Service swears he didn't put a sleeve on the crank and that the crank is not my issue. Sean further states that the droning noise was going on before they did the timing belt job. Sean's offer was to pay for HALF of the job for another shop to replace crankshaft but he "really doesn't think it's going to solve my problem."

 

Are you more confident with the guys at the shop where its at now?
Are they confident in putting a crank in it?

 

That ripple at the 1:00 position is in the dampner hub, not a rippled sleeve..
I have no idea what a sleeve for a toyota crank looks like...
That foil crap is shady hackery though...

The wadded up foil could have been the sleeve & its all coming apart again....

 

Just curious, if you think it might not be a sleeve then what else would it be? You can see where it has square edges on that metallic looking metal oozing out of the pulley.

At this point they are paying for a crank replacement or a new engine. And I plan to have it done at Toyota or swap the motor myself. I'm not accepting the offer of half the cost. If he's not willing to pay the full amount then I'm getting BAR involved.

 

I got buddies that work at the BAR, worked with them for majority of my career, fished with him many times......