Mil Spec or not?

I get into this with my dad every time I see him. I am in the police world where we get a lot of new technology; plastic guns are the norm. He is ex-special forces and believes that the military only has the best stuff. We both have AR-15's and he will only get the GI issued aluminum mags. I believe in the magpul P-mags. He has a thing against plastic. I am a firm Glock believer and he hates them too. He swears up and down that anything that isn't "mil spec" is worthless. (I mean actual mil spec, not advertised, though I don't think he knows the difference anyway, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.) He told me last night that P-mags are just flashy useless tech stuff that doesn't work in the real world and is basically for mall ninjas. He continued to explain to me about the rigors of some shooting course where the mag gets beat up a lot and he thinks an aluminum "mil spec" mag cannot be improved on. The only thing mil-spec means to me is "made by the lowest bidder." I would rather have a cache of P-mags and glocks then aluminum GI mags and M9's any day. I offered him one of my P-mags to abuse in any way he wants, as long as he does the same to one of his aluminum GI mags.

Pistols are another story, we won't be banging them around any time soon. interesting note; he has a Sig 226, Ruger SR9, and S&W 29, none of which are "mil-spec," not for our military anyway. Also both of our AR's are bushmasters, his is a 20" M16 style and mine is 16" M4 configuration, neither of which are mil spec.

At the end of the day, "mil spec" means a reasonable item that meets a pricepoint. From what I can tell, technological improvements on weapon systems emerge from the civilian world, not the military. They have to get their money out of the old technology.

Thoughts? What does mil-spec mean to you? Is "tactical tupperware" a vast improvement or a passing fad?

 

I use to think the same way as your dad, but the more tech. improves the better the plastics get. ya back in the day all the poly stuff sucked, but now that stuff is almost un breakable. I dont think i ever seen a P-mag break. but i most definatly have seen a gi mag get destroyed lol

 

i got a buddy whos been to the Stan a few times he doesnt care too much for the plastic mags either...

 

i have never had a issue with p mags....even if i did im sure magpul would make it right. there such a great company

 

Mil-spec is pretty over rated. SOME mil-spec items are "tougher" but I think companys use the term mil-spec as an ad ploy. I mean the HK416 AR didnt even pass the "milspec" testing and it's an HK! Government contracts are all about low bidders and buddy buddy politicians rubbing elbows with their bank rollers.

 

the M9 is garbage.

i havent had experience with the pmags, but when i think mil spec.. i think of my military days where everything i had was abused beyond comprehension before it was issued to me. i was then expected to shoot straight and be able to eat off the disassembled pieces. i actually got a rifle issued to me with a bent barrel. the armorer just shrugged and said good luck.

advertising something as mil spec in my mind is just a ploy to get so called "mall ninjas" excited about something because the people who it was said to be designed for engage in the real thing.

that being said.. that shit aint glorious at all.

no offense to yall with your hooked up and modded out ar-15s... to each his own i just dont get it. a close friend of mine has taken all kinds of tactical shooting courses blah blah blah.. home defense and preparedness is one thing. fantasy is another.

 

i agree the M9 is a big pile of shit! i havnt shot the accual m9 yet just the civi version (92fs i think) really no that great of a gun. I hope the military will switch from the m9 to the sig sometime while im enlisted lol

 

Wow.. were you issued that in the sandbox?

and I love seeing gunstores with military surplus ARs, like who would buy this shit? lock the bolt back, slap the butt stock and the bolt closes.

 

lol or the fact that its prolly got 10000 rounds through it and no cleaning LOL

 

Clean what? you just keep it lubed up, right?

 

All "mil-spec" means is that the product (whatever it may be, from weapons to sealant), has met the atleast the lowest specifications the military says a certain item has to have in order for them to purchase it. It does not mean in any way that the product is the best or cant be improved on. The military certainly does NOT purchase all high quality shit. As an aircraft maintainer I see it everyday.

 

I admit that many of you have a lot more knowledge than me on this issue. I bought a mil-spec AR because the lower, upper, and other parts are suppose to fit on other mil-spec parts. Maybe that's a little marketing that I got suckered into but it's worked.

As on plastic mags, I love them. They don't dent or crush if dropped. I own 10 Lancer brand mags and they haven't given me an ounce of problems. http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/Lancer-L5-AR-15-Magazines-p/lancer l5 30 smoke.htm

 

Mil-spec is not a bad thing when it comes to ARs. Milspec ARs is like you said, its all about fitment. I would buy MilSpec parts too, because they are designed for a "looser" tolerance fighting gun not a competition rifle. Dont keep a Comp gun clean and it will start failing on you. milspec AR parts are more common too.

the mil-spec labeled accessories are what you have to watch out for.. lights mags, mag pouches, tacticool gear

 

Aluminum mags are trash the spot welds on the back seam break causing a wider mag that doesn't sit right in the mag well. I haven't used p mags but that's my take. Also the springs are trash and have to be cleaned every couple days if you want them to work right in "austere" conditions. Just my opinion your dad could prolly kick my ass

 

psshhh lube is for pussys lol

 

lol no pun intended

 

Haha KY is water based therefore not good for gun. Dont know personally how gun lube feels on.. well.. my gun.

Anyways I saw this picture a while back, similar idea to our milspec debate

 

im opposite, never shot the civ version. no desire too. i carried a pos m9 for long enough

this was actually one of my favorite tricks as a boot.

it sure looks like it most of the time. imagine being all retarded about weapons cleaning and always having a perfectly clean well oiled rifle.. and then they stage you in kuwait prior to iraq. the sand is so fine its like dust.. and that oil holds it. holy m-fin shit, im surprised those things ever fired. i guess thats an actual tribute to "mil-spec" it can survive a bunch of dumbass marines and in a desert no less.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

 

This reminds me of all the nerdy guys all dressed up like this at gun shows