Spongy Brakes 2009 Taco.

I agree with (almost) everything mentioned above.
The improvement these posters mention re SS lines has everything to do with brakes being bled in the process of installing the lines, not the fact that they are a different material.

 

^ what are you even saying?

 

Me?
What don't you understand?
In order to install SS or braided lines, you have to bleed the brakes.
Bleeding the brakes removes the spongy feel and excessive travel.
Then someone gets in the truck and says 'these new brakelines are much better than the factory lines...everybody should buy these' when they would have gotten the same result by just bleeding the factory lines.

Or, are you questioning why I agree that these trucks would see minimal improvement from rear discs?

 

I believe the theory with stainless lines are that they deflect less under pressure than rubber lines, and in turn, will have less wasted energy...more of the energy created by depressing the master cylinder will be transferred to piston movement. In theory this will give you 'better brake feel.'

But, at least all of the stainless lines i have seen are simply a loose stainless braid over rubber lines.

Edit: I don't buy into the hype that SS lines would be even noticeable to a street car/truck. I agree with bleeding the old fluid will make more of a change...it breaks down with over time because of the high temperatures created by brakes.

 

On a side note to that....
If you have air in the lines, pumping the brakes is a bad idea because you're breaking up the bubbles into tiny little bubbles that are harder to see when you bleed the brakes.

 

The improvement of SS brake lines has nothing to do with bleeding the brakes.

Rubber lines can & will expand under pressure. When they expand, you lose pressure (spongy feel, pedal goes does farther).

SS brake lines do not expand under pressure thuse resulting in more pressure to the brakes with less effort at the pedal.

 

Um, no.

This is correct.

 

They don't lose pressure, some of the pedal travel will simply go into "expanding" the lines. Unless you have a leak, pushing the pedal will always increase the pressure in the braking system.

SS will expand as well, just at a different rate.

 

Honestly, I never gave that a thought, other than I didn't feel I had air in my lines. Still glad I made the switch, though. In any case, when I decide to lift my ride (3" or so), I won't have to extend my lines. Oh, and the stronger line comes in handy when changing to larger tires.

 

There's a guy who works for Goodridge who posts on TN...he'll tell you exactly what Jan said.

 

This is absolutely a correct statement......

 

The expansion in the lines will be instantaneous. The system isn't going to pressurize and then have the rubber lines expand (causing a drop in pressure)...they are going to expand when the system is pressurizing. For a given pressure, the rubber will have a certain amount of deflection. They behave like a thin walled pressure vessel.

 

Right. But, the amount of that deflection is less with a SS line, therefore less pressure is wasted on the deflection. Therefore, you don't have to stomp the brakes to compensate for (instantanious) pressure loss due to rubber lines...less effort to do the same job b/c less energy is being wasted.

In other words, the brakes are still getting the amount of pressure they need to operate with rubber lines, you just don't have to waste as much leg to get it to stop in the same distance with SS lines...b/c there is less pressure drop in the line, instantanious or otherwise.

 

Bill, I 100% agree in the principle that stainless steel lines will have more pressure than rubber lines given specific pedal travel. What I was disputing is that rubber lines technically don't "lose pressure."

 

I noticed this first thing (along with hitting my head on the headliner getting in/out) when I tested out a 2009 TRD Sport DC SB 4x4 and a 2009 TRD Off Road 4x2. I hoped it would go away soon but I wasn't sure and didn't know if anyone elsewas ahving this problem. Sounds good to let it just wear in and stiffen up or get teh brake lines bled...upgraded lines can be added later.

 

Nope, rubber lines don't lose pressure (you are correct) but they do cause additional pedal travel due to increased expansion of the material. I have used SS lines (actually the inner cores are teflon) on my bikes for years and they simply produce an immediate, solid feel and eliminate the sponginess. If you were to change the lines on a tacoma with SS ones there would be an improvement in "Feel", not braking performance, etc.

 

I see. And I agree.

Absorb would be a better word. The same amount of pressure is reaching the brakes regardless of brake line material, it's the amount of force required to reach that level of pressure at the end of the line that varies. While the rubber line might not "lose" pressure, more pressure is required to operate the brakes and balloon the rubber lines than is required with a stronger line that won't steal/rob/absorb any pressure (or as much I should say). So, with SS lines, it takes less pedal to get the same end of the line line pressure b/c you don't have to compensate for stretching the lines.

Does that make any more sense?

 

Well put.

I can appreciate eloquence when I see it.

 

lol!!:d

 

You're not loosing pressure.

The rubber can't handle the pressure - thus - they expand. Technically causing the rubber lines to be slightly larger in diameter which uses up more volume of fluid.