Thinking of buying my first firearm- opinions?

Sounds like good sound advice here and your choice of the 9mm is plenty for self defense. Lots of people say bigger is better and those are the same people that say you need to use a .338 Lapua to have a chance a killing a deer. The best round for you is the one you can afford to practice with and are comfortable with if or when the time comes.

Also the recoil on a 9mm is very manageable with most guns and that is not always the case with some of the larger calibers or even some of the lighter guns and compacts. I know you said you not afraid of recoil but to much recoil will make the gun no fun to shoot and with most people to much recoil affects accuracy becasue they are flinching when they pull the trigger.

 

whether birdshot is a good idea for home defense is debatable - that's a whole other thread topic ..

shotguns are subject to restrictions too, including federal; ...i wouldn't be surprised if there are still folks who buy a shotgun w/ a 22" barrell, and ignorantly saw it off to 14" when they get home (which would be illegal)... ..then you've got magazine plugs, etc,.. especially for hunting regulations...

if you want to rely on a firearm for self defense, ..i'd prefer a gun/ammo combo that meets the FBI recommendations for penetration... thus, i'd pick a handgun chambered in a service cartridge (9mm, .40, .45ACP, .357SIG, etc..) over birdshot..

collateral damage is a concern w/ any firearm - the way to limit the risk is w/ your own discipline/training; "aimed fire" at known bad guy (i.e. you have good IFF skills), and use of cover/concealment, and appropriate ammo type selection... this means "low-light" tactics as well - "move-flash-move", "spot-fire", etc... if you have some training for this under your belt, a handgun is a good tool under these circumstances IMO

 

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... ^^^ ... Some excellent advice ... Sub'd ...
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Yeah wiley is very knowledgeable. As are many others on this site about firearms. I find myself checking this thread more than the 2nd gen forum.

 

I have a few toys, but my favorite of my Mossy 500's, the JIC Marinecoat 18" pistolgrip. Also have an AR-stock style riot one with sidesaddle shell carrier.


And Favorite sidearm


Always good to have a good 22 as well

 

Agreed.

Most people have never tried to clear a house before with a shotgun. Holding the shotgun and opening a door in the dark can be tricky without practice. If you don't have a tac light mounted to the shotgun, you're really screwed because both hands are full. It's just easier with a handgun.

For civilians, they should not be worried about penetration, but over penetration. A good quality self-defense round is all you need/hollowpoints. It will expand and all the energy will be absorbed in the intended target. Use the one that cycles well in your gun and groups the best for your gun.

 

If you want a handgun...

I always always always recommend either a glock or something with a decocker (look at the H&K USP 9mm or 40mm) to new gun owners. Also, http://www.budsgunshop.com is a great e-tailer. They have great sales, and I check them everyday. Stay safe!

 

Thank god someone mentioned buds gun shop lol....I'm gonna apologize in advance but I've been eying this thread for a little bit now and ill try to lend my experience as well as I can.

For starters I was still in diapers when my grandpa dropped a single shot .22 in my hands and started teaching me how to shoot...he left me with a wealth of info and reference material and a mountian of ammo when he passed away as a retired professional shooter. Now for the first issue ur going for ur first handgun or ur first gun in general? If its ur first gun period I would suggest taking the American standard from history and starting with a .we rifle. It's the first thing any country boy usually shoots and its the first thing a hunters saftey course puts in ur hands and for good reason. U have got to understand the basics without complicating things with all the features of a semi-auto handgun....after you are comfortable with the rifle platform then move on to a revolver....yes the lowly revolver....its safe almost immune to malfunction and another step in the chain of basics that builds on the lessons u learned on the rifle...after that...and considering wether a revolver would fill ur home defense needs (more on that in a minute) then go ahead and check out the semi-auto pistols. Just my input on how one should make the steps of familiarizing themselves with guns

 

I usually recommend a revolver for a first firearm. Less moving parts and maintenance, also usually a bit heavier causing less shyness to recoil. I think a 357 mag in a 4 inch barrelled revolver is the most versitile firearm available. It will shoot 38 special rounds which are very comfortable to shoot - much lower recoil and not as loud, and a very good all around home defense round. It will also be capable of shooting the magnum loads for thase moments where you want to feel manly at the range or genuinly might need the extra power - many guys out there hunt with the 357 (usually with longer barrels, but this makes them less convenient to carry around). The 2" barrelled snub-nosed revlovers are good with 38 specials, but much of the powder in the magnums are blown out of the barrel before burning. Thus my 4" recommendation.

I love my 1911 in .45, my Bodyguard .380, and USP .40, but my wheelguns are my favorites.

Go shoot some guns and see what you like - don't buy something because some joker said it was cool. Also, don't buy a first handgun that's too big for your girl to shoot. Use this as an excuse when the guys call you a pussy.

 

Now for the home defense side of things...I spent 6 months on a term paper in college doing research and study on external and terminal ballistics and for starters stay away from the hype surrounding 9mm...this round was designed by Germany and later refined by NATO as a military combat round designed to penetrate light body armor and soft obstacles...for home defense let's analyse the situation and pick something that fits the bill....what will your Target and environment be....judge for urself here...man sized Target and in ur home so 25 yards max....ok barrel length is almost a non issue now....with a slight amount of practice u can drill someone easy at 25 yards with a .5 inch barreled .38 special. Ok so now what is ur targets terminal ballistcs characteristics....adult with probably a t-shirt or at most a nylon puffy winter coat....ok now we have something to talk caliber and cartridge with....no body armor, so ditch the 9mm cuz all its gonna do is make a 9mm hole and probably not cut anything....this results in low stopping power and energy imparted to the target, also endangers anyone behind the target....if the round exits ur target u no longer have control over it and uve also just wasted energy that could be used to neutralize the threat. Since were talking about an urban environment wr must consider drug use in the assailant. These targets are known not to respond to 9mm rounds very well. So stopping power...the problem is keeping ur slug in the target so 9mm has to much velocity u can answer that with .380 auto or 9mm kurz(short) this round in hollow point form have the highest shots in target to death ratio according to some national police studies. 380 is also plenty cheap now for druggies 380 is still a little light on stopping power so let's answer the penetration problem without dropping the velocity. The only answer is to increase diameter. 45 acp is one of the most devastating rounds ever made. A step up from this and into the revolver world is my personal home defense weapon .45 colt this thing with a shoulder hit will remove limbs...drugs or no drugs a 1-3 inch wound is gonna end the target. The key to this home defense strategy is ending it quickly....on average we all are not combat trained...we need a situation to be resolved as fast and simply as possible...to that end I suggest making a choice that after one shot will either kill or incapacitate the assailant. Lol my 45 colt in a dark room even if I don't hit the target (not likely I hope) will have such a flash and a report that neither I or the target are going to be able to do much. Giving me the advantage of knowing the environment better....if I do hit him its game over.....with a Springfield 9mm xd the same situation is likely (assuming the worst that the attacker is on 4 grams of meth) then I'm probably gonna have to empty the first 15 round clip into him at range, find the other clip and approach to make a head shot before the junkie is actually done.

 

I'm not sure I agree with some of this, although it doesn't really matter. I'll put my comments though just for funs sake (no trolling or flaming, just good clean forum fun).

I know most body armor including the current generation of US Military armor included in a TA-50 is only built to stop shrapnel and small arms UP TO 9mm (without SAPI plates). I've personally tested this and it stopped my 9mm (target rounds FMJ) and someone's .380 they brought. It did not stop the .45 the 5.56 (rifle so N/A) or the 5.7 we shot at it. This is just the flak jacket not including the SAPI plates (we didn't test them cuz they cost too much for the real deal ). So as far as travelling through a target (bad guy), and then the wall behind them possibly hitting a family member, I would think the .45 would have way more penetration. I shot a TV one time with a 9mm dead in the center and it didn't come out of the back of it. I've never shot a person with a 9mm (or with anything for that matter) so it's hard for me to tell off of my experience. I feel that if I shot a person cranked on whatever drug they want in center mass with my 9mm, they are going to die almost instantly...especially with the home defense rounds I have loaded in my weapon right now. I've seen a lot of combat injuries because I worked in a combat hospital in Iraq and I can tell you that people generally drop and are very incapacitated by any amount of shrapnel or small arms damage...from my experience. I wasn't the person putting the metal inside of their bodies, but I saw very close to the immediate result. I will tell you though that someone I knew in Iraq operating as "other coalition forces" (secret squirrel) favored the .45 in combat to any other handgun caliber and carried a specialized 1911 in addition to his rifle.

TL;DR - The type of ammo makes a huge difference, I feel that a 9mm would be better for home defense than a .45 especially considering that a smaller person (ie woman) might be the one shooting. 9mm can be more fun to shoot and cheaper as ammo is much cheaper for plinking also with a 9mm.

There is room for the .40 cal, I've read documentation that showed it had more knockdown power than the .45.

Just try shooting the 9mm and the .45 and see which you liked better at the range imo. cheers

 

I agree u have to have something that u will practice with and for the ladies this usually means low recoil....however my 45 colt is a more comfy recoil (acording to the women who have fired it) than most 9mm autos....I was referencing the terminal ballistics studies I have read and evaluated at the gun range with 9mm and like I said it was designed in between ww1 and ww2 to penetrate helmets in use at the time and the heaviest clothing of the uniforms in service at the time (the only real body armor of the day at that point) as far as .45 cal rounds they have up to 1.3 inches of expansion surface area to dissapate energy with while 9mm in most rounds other than fmj and bonded hollowpoints tend to fragment...this breaks up the kenetic energy transfer and induces less shock to the mass being struck....just to put up some real numbers

These are all figures from federal premium ammo

.380acp jhp muzzle energy 200, 25 yards 182
Velocity is 1000 fps and 953 respectively with a 90 grain bullet

9mm luger same bullet design at 147 grains 326, 25 yards 311
Velocity is 1000 and 976 respectively
(a side note here....these bullets are the same exact diameter....here is ur overpenetration data...a heavier bullet moving faster with the same surface area is going to go farther)

.40 s&w 180 grains 400 at the muzzle 377 at 25 yards
Velocity is 1000 and 972
This is better than 9mm luger but similar recoil

.45 acp 230 grains 414 at the muzzle 397 at 25 yards
Velocity is 900 and 882
This right here changes everything ...a big jump in bullet mass and a drop in velocity plus an increase in initial and the available expanded diameter mean this round is going to impart more of its kenetic energy in a shorter distance and that's where the misconception about published ft pounds of striking energy a cartridge has comes from...a .22-250 has insane ft pound numbers but its moving at 4k ft per second and is less than 1/4 inch in diameter....has alot of energy but its gonna bleed that energy slowly or fragment more likely considering the velocities involved.

.45 colt I only shoot buffalo bore and federal doesn't make a hydrashock round in this so we will sub my ammo choice here just for giggle factor
Heavy .45 colt +p 260 grain jhp muzzle energy is 1870 pounds 1676 at 25 yards
Velocity is 1800 and 1704
This is the limb removing beast hidden in my night stand....lol come at me bro

 

lol, no thx, i'll keep my limbs. You expecting the juggernaut to break into your house???

 

Competition shooters consider 40SW to have sharper recoil than either 9mm or 45acp.
I always roll my eyes when somebody picks .40 as their entry to centerfire handguns.
I carry 9mm everyday and have never felt undergunned....9mm will stop any argument that .40sw will solve.

 

hold on, time out for a second... i'm hearing a bunch of anecdotal info being thrown around about which cartridge is "better", "stopping power", and even "removing limbs", ..

there is a lot of misinformation floating around the web, ...especially for 9mm, since a lot of the older data were from accounts using ball ammo or poorly designed hollow point ammo - this is outdated info.... modern 9mm hollow point ammo, for the most part, should be just fine for SD purposes... penetration depth (sufficient) is an important consideration, and was studied heavily by the FBI, following the "miami shootout", FBI says 12-18" penetration depth is ideal, ..mainly because oblique angled shots (which are likely to occur given chaotic, fast movements during gunfight) require more penetration to reach vital areas and get through muscle, bone, etc.. "stopping power" is a nebulous term as terminal effects cannot be measured as "black-n-white", but shades of "grey"..

i'd recommend folks take some time to read up and bust the myths - AR15.com has put a lot of effort into this, pulling info from various respected sources including FBI and various authors who've looked into the forensics..
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_16/503947_AR15_Ammo_Forum_FAQ.html

also, here's a nice chart to show you that there is less "differences" than you may have previously thought:

 

While this is alot of great information, please remember that this is my first handgun.

I am not really thinking about having to blow someone's limb off just yet. This pistol is mainly just to get my gf and myself acclimated to having a gun, shooting at the range as something fun we could do together and if the situation ever arose to defending us, I have a feeling a 9mm with JHP would be better than nothing.

 

9mm is a good choice IMO..

 

Wow I didnt know .45 can tear limbs off? Why bother with a .50 cal rifle when a .45 pistol can do the job?

 

A .22 is better than nothing. Really I wouldn't feel under gunned carrying a 9mm but my first choice is my G22 .40 and that is only because it's the handgun that I've done 80% of my training, plinking, and drills with. I'm sure this has been said but your best bet is to hit up a gun range that rent's out its guns and pick a few that feel good in your, and wifey's, hand and shoot them until you feel comfortable purchasing it. I'm just going to assume that you're new to guns henceforth you and your wife need to get some gun training and I don't mean a friend who has a gun I mean a professional. Your local DNR office should have a safety training class, around here they are free but up in NC and GA they charge about $10 which is a small price to pay compared to yours or someone else life if you were to mishandle the gun and it go off killing or injuring someone. You can never train to much with the gun be it safety classes, different drills, or just target shooting every little bit helps. Personally I like 9mm and .40 but that is purely subjective because those caliber's are what I have shot the most of and feel the most comfortable with.

 

9mm is a greater starter caliber, and yeah if in defense im sure it'll do the job , with possibly no limbs on the floor