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Toyota Oil Filter (Made in Thailand) vs. the competition........

Discussion in 'Technical Chat' started by chris4x4, Nov 15, 2010.

  1. Jan 24, 2013 at 8:19 PM
    #461
    folmonty

    folmonty Active Member

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    Prop's to Chris the OP for going the extra mile and doing so much work to get this information.

    With that said, there's a whole other aspect to filtration that isn't part of this review. The key SAE standards for filtration are SPE (single pass efficiency), MPE (multi-pass efficiency), flow rate and capacity. While it's easier to look at filter construction and ID what "looks" best, that isn't the gage for filter effectiveness. Sq" of filter media really has no bearing on it either. In addition, many of the filters aren't even made by the name of the can. The industry has a ton of "co-manufacturing" to support the crazy parts proliferation which goes on daily. Many times, a manufacture that gets the OEM business will be the one who co-mans for many others. Not always of course just an example that this is really a cross fed industry. Most OEM's make no filter product what so ever. Wix makes stuff for GM, Fram for Wix, Purolator for STP etc... Springs vs. stamped sheet metal, cellulose media vs hybrid glass / cellulose, steal paper clips vs paper bonding and on and on. None of this means really anything in the end. It's all about those key filter ratings which differentiate the brands.

    None of this is said to undermine all the effort Chris put into this. It's just to offer a different perspective to an age old argument in the filter arena. Appearance vs function. The goal of this post is to advance the thinking towards the end result. Clean oil, good flow and capacity. That's it.

    Just sharing some industry insight nothing more.
     
  2. Jan 25, 2013 at 5:22 AM
    #462
    car78412

    car78412 Well-Known Member

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    I totally agree with your insight however until we can read about actual testing of the performance of these oil filters, the only thing we can rely on is the actual build, and quality of the materals used. Is anyone aware of any testing done by an independant lab concerning the effectiveness of these oil filters?
     
  3. Jan 25, 2013 at 6:16 PM
    #463
    Rich91710

    Rich91710 Well-Known Member

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    There's been a few spotty tests posted over the years, mostly Amsoil hype, but that doesn't mean it's not worth something.

    I'll look at the Amsoil hype charts, and just lay my finger over the Amsoil product references. They have no reason to lie in their comparisons between K&N, Wix, Purolator, Delco, etc...

    The problem in analyzing the results is how "bad" is "bad"? At what point can we say "This filter is a POS"? We don't know... all we can do is an empirical conclusion based on comparisons.
    In that respect, the better built filters tend to score higher than the poorly built filters. Referenced issues include consistency of bypass valve opening, bypass valve leakage, and IMHO, bypass valve leakage is as important as filtration efficiency... that's unfiltered oil!

    And to be fair, I'm not knocking Amsoil products... I'm just cynical when I go a Google search for oil/air filter testing and the first 60 hits are all different sites with the same graph and it's from Amsoil.

    Their products are great, and they are not afraid to admit that OEM air filters are more effective than their dry filters (which used to be AEM).
    I don't like their oil filters for two reasons... They use the same element in both long and short cans, and while their media is very high quality, when there isn't as much of it, you have a tradeoff.
    But my main gripe about their EAO filters is the lack of "flats" for a filter wrench for removal. Their oil filters used to be Wix.
     
  4. Jan 26, 2013 at 9:07 AM
    #464
    folmonty

    folmonty Active Member

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    Both you guys have valid comments. Testing filters takes some pretty sophisticated equipment. Some mfgs don't even own it but instead send product to a lab for analysis.

    From the last data I have SAE (Society of Auto Engineers) says the particles or contaminants the size of 10 - 20 microns are most harmful to the engines. Smaller the particles less so and if you stop the 10 - 20 it's assumed you'll catch the larger ones. Trying to get smaller particles will cause too much restriction allowing oil to "by-pass" the filter. Every engine has a by-pass, whether it's in the filter or the engine block itself. This is where the by-pass leakage you mentioned Rich, occurs. Restriction in one form or another. Neglect in the form of sludge is a really bad example. Also, when a filter blows, pops or balloons it's usually an indication the engine pressure relief valve stuck. This normally occurs after an oil change or on start-up from cold pressure spikes.

    There are lots of reason manufacture use different materials. One thing I learned is that most of them (mfgs) employ the same principles to other filters in their product offering. So saying that brad X is a so and so and brand Y is the best thing since sliced bread can come back to bite ya.

    Rich is also correct in the air filter product is a whole different animal. We can discuss that later. Gotta run....

    Enjoy the discussion guys!
     
  5. Jan 26, 2013 at 9:18 AM
    #465
    SoCaltaco65

    SoCaltaco65 Well-Known Member

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  6. Jan 26, 2013 at 1:57 PM
    #466
    folmonty

    folmonty Active Member

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    Wow, the extent this guy went to do this! That in itself is quite amazing. It was also done without apparent bias. Great cross section of product.

    Couple of observations -
    • The only test that really demonstrates filter performance would be the 30 Mu test.
    • Testing was done using only filter media not a mounted filter
    • Filter efficiencies for known OEM's were mostly grouping at C & D for the 30 Mu test - That's a red flag to me with regards to test procedure.
    • Many of the brands tested are "private label" products made by one of the major filter companies or duplications such as Wix and CarQuest (same)
    • Ideally the filters should be mounted on a test stand but this individual made due with media samples. Understandable.
    • Because of the extreme efficiency numbers of the 5 Mu test for Amsoil and Royal Purple I would conclude they both most likely allow significant oil to "by-pass" the filter because of high initial restriction. Key contaminant numbers to extract from oil are 10 - 20 Mu. 5 Mu isn't a significant number to trap. Comments pertaining to Wix on the 5 Mu test are a tell tail sign somethings not right. Wix makes a good to excellent product in all respects. No - I didn't work for them but knew more about their product than many of their employees.
    Most troubling thing these days is the move to foreign based supply chains and manufacturing. IMHO this is a significant problem for both manufactures and consumers. Yeah, we get or keep lower cost / prices but at what cost or QC? There are more product recalls these days because of this single issue. Just from reading through the pages of this forum the past few days we could use Toyota clutches for the manual trans as an example. A simple supplier problem in one critical component = troubles. No manufacture wants that! I don't know how many of the domestic manufactures have moved production abroad, let's just say every time in a parts store I'm the guy studying the box with a magnifying glass to see mfg place of origin.



    IMHO any OEM or major brand manufacture product will more than meet the needs of us inmates and our trucks / other vehicles. Wix, Fram, Baldwin, Fleetguard, AC and Motorcraft etc., all make OEM product. The one's I'd steer clear of are the private label product because they usually try to reduce product cost in some way to gain market share. They spec it, others build it. It's good for business even if they're competitors on the shelf.


    Thanks for that post SoCaltaco65. A great read. Feels like being back at work. I think chris4X4 and the guy who did this study should go into business. They'd probably make top shelf product!
     
  7. Jan 26, 2013 at 3:57 PM
    #467
    GuyWithCamera

    GuyWithCamera Well-Known Member

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    Anyone know anything about the TRD oil filter? I've been using it the last 4 oil changes but know nothing about it aside from what the box says.

    It looks similar to the K&N...
     
  8. Jan 26, 2013 at 11:10 PM
    #468
    Rich91710

    Rich91710 Well-Known Member

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    K&N and Mobil-1 are identical except for the nut welded to the top.
    I would suspect the TRD is the same filter as well.

    It's a good filter. It is still made by Champion Labs, and the only oil filter made by them that I'd use. The rest of the Champion line (Supertech, STP, AC Delco, and a bunch of others) now use the "E-Core" construction, which is a plastic "cage" core supporting the media, and fiber endplates.
    The thing is not made any better than a Fram, and there have been a number of reports of the media collapsing into the core support on 5.7 GMC engines.

    Bosch used to be made by Champion. Bosch bought Purolator, and moved production of their filters to Purolator facilities. This was at the same time that Champion changed their design (and when the Delco "Duraguard Gold" was discontinued), so any Bosch filter is decent regardless of which company made it.

    Personally, I'll use OEM, Pure-One, Bosch, or Mobil-1.
    Mobil-1 is too expensive for what it is. The Pure-One is an equal filter for half the price... but the OEM filter is also just as good for 1/3 the price of a Mobil-1.

    My non-Toyotas generally get Pure-One or Bosch.
    I still have a few Pure-One boxes left in the garage for the Rav4, but after another 3 or 4 oil changes, she'll be on OEM.
     
  9. Jan 28, 2013 at 9:55 AM
    #469
    BlackSportD

    BlackSportD Well-Known Member

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    Awesome write-up. I didn't do an empirical test myself, but started to religiously use Toyota filters after using various different filters for the wife's tC and always putting to memory the oil colour/darkness during the oil change. The oil seemed cleanest the time a toyota filter was used. I'm a fan of OEM spec in most situations so added together, I'm a pretty big stickler about using OE/Toyota oil filters on all my rides now.
     
  10. Feb 16, 2013 at 3:28 PM
    #470
    Ntenna

    Ntenna Member

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    Wonder how the TRD HP filters compare to the standard Toyota filters?
     
  11. Feb 16, 2013 at 3:40 PM
    #471
    Rich91710

    Rich91710 Well-Known Member

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    They're just a private-labeled Mobil-1/K&N.
    Made by Champion Labs.

    Good filter, not worth $10+
     
  12. Feb 16, 2013 at 4:07 PM
    #472
    Lucario Runner

    Lucario Runner Resident Truck/SUV racer

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  13. Feb 16, 2013 at 4:34 PM
    #473
    Rich91710

    Rich91710 Well-Known Member

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    That could be good for Fram, or bad for Champion.

    Champion moved to the Ecore design around 2004 or 2005, same time Bosch bought Purolator.
    With that move, Bosch pulled their production from Champion and moved it to the Purolator facilities, and retained marketing rights to the Purolator name.

    BUT... the Mobil-1 and K&N filters remained Champion's "premium" product and did not move to the Ecore design.
    I can't imagine that Mobil-1, K&N, and especially TRD, are going to accept standard Fram production design. Fram will likely retain the premium design, and add it to one of the premium Fram branded filters, and move their traditional production to the Ecore production.
    They likely bought Champion to get the Ecore patents, being similar to their own design, yet even CHEAPER through the use of the nylon cage core rather than a steel tube core.
     
  14. Feb 16, 2013 at 4:48 PM
    #474
    cre814u2c

    cre814u2c Member

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    my 2013 Tacoma came with a 90915 20004 oil filter . oem
    Can i use a 90915 YZZD3 ? oem

    V6
     
  15. Feb 16, 2013 at 4:55 PM
    #475
    Rich91710

    Rich91710 Well-Known Member

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    Yes
     
  16. Feb 16, 2013 at 5:04 PM
    #476
    cre814u2c

    cre814u2c Member

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    Thank you
     
  17. Feb 17, 2013 at 4:10 AM
    #477
    Ntenna

    Ntenna Member

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    Got mine for $8 on dealer discount, but looked familiar, so not really surprised! Now add a Fram purchase of Champion, so back to the stock filter! J
     
  18. Feb 17, 2013 at 1:32 PM
    #478
    Rich91710

    Rich91710 Well-Known Member

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    Fram would be stupid to fuck with the Mobil-1/K&N design.
    Champion didn't make any major changes to the design when they went to the Ecore (they did move the bypass valve).
    If Fram changed the design, they'd lose the Mobil-1 and K&N contracts.
     
  19. Mar 4, 2013 at 10:25 AM
    #479
    BlackSportD

    BlackSportD Well-Known Member

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    I'm putting one of these Magnafilters inline with my OE Toyota filter. Opinions? IMO for an old motor its probably overkill, but on a brand new car/engine, rebuilt motor or one with new parts (cams, bearings etc) I would think it helps a lot. Does the OP want my old unit once I'm done with it to cut into it?

    Pic of it testing the fitment to my filter-

    2013-02-27 10.15.41.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2013
  20. Mar 4, 2013 at 10:30 AM
    #480
    chris4x4

    chris4x4 [OP] With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine. Moderator

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    I've never felt those offer any more protection on an aluminum engine .
     
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