Who is responsible for the problem (Story)

I had something interesting come up at the shop recently, and I wanted to pose the question to all of you and get your opinion. Below is the situation, you tell me what YOU would do if you were the truck owner (By the way, the vehicle isn't a truck, just using a Tacoma as the vehicle)

Your transmission goes out (For whatever reason) and you have found that it needs to be replaced. At the moment you can't afford a new one, nor rebuild the existing one. You decide that the best route is to get one from "Pete's Salvage" and take it to "Randy's Auto" to get it installed. You drop off your truck, and the salvage yard transmission at Randy's and he calls you later saying that the transmission swap is complete, but that there is a bad leak coming from the bell housing/torque converter area. Randy says he will need to pull the transmission back out to find out for sure where the leak is coming from, but he suspects the front seal.

You call the Pete's Salvage Yard and Pete says, "Randy's should have replaced the front bushing and seal before they installed it."

After calling Randy he says that a transmission sold from a salvage yard, with a 90 day warranty, shouldn't need ANYTHING replaced before it is installed, and if that was the case, Pete's should have told YOU to have the bushing and seal replaced before installation.

I'll tell you the end result of how things went down, but I would like everyone's opinion on what THEY would expect if they were the owner of the truck in question.

 

This...

Pete's should have told YOU to have the bushing and seal replaced before installation.

 

That sounds like a cluster F. Best case scenerio I can see for the owner is the salvage yard warranties the transmission but that would mean the owner would have to eat the shop time for the second go. I'm not a transmission expert by any means though, perhaps it's common practice to replace certain seals when swapping in a used transmission, or at least should have been suggested to the vehicle owner before doing all the work (or possibly a way to check/test the seals before the transmission was installed)

 

90 day warranty. Seems to me that petes salvage has the responsibility.

 

But most of those salvage yards will only warranty the parts. Install is usually on the owner of the vehicle.

That being said, if Pete's knew there was an issue, and didn't say anything, I agree that they should pick up the tab for parts and labor.

 

Not too familiar with tranny installs, Is it common for those to be replaced before install? Are they a one time use? and did it look used before install?

 

To answer a few things noted:

There is not general procedure to test a transmission for leaks at a general automotive shop. This requires a transmission dyno/leak tester, which is not the type of equipment a general auto shop carries.

I personally have installed well over 100 used transmissions, and never had to replace a bushing or seal upon install. Not sure about anyone else who has installed transmissions of course, so this is only based on my experiences.

Care to expand on that a bit? Explanation of WHY you think it is Randy's job to do so? Or for those who say it is Pete's fault, why?

 

Tough one. Pete's Salvage yard should pay for/ supply new seal, Randy's auto should eat the labor for not having the forethought to inspect and replace if necessary (at Pete's expense with 90 day warranty) "external" input and/or output, pan seals, etc.

 

Seems to me if its not something normally replaced on install everytime like a one time use seal. Then that would fall under the 90 day warranty?

 

That alone tells me that Pete's is to blame, in my opinion. Based on your story, Pete's knew the seal was bad and needed replacing but didn't say anything to anybody (unless he did in fact tell the vehicle owner, but I'm assuming he did not since it was not mentioned in the initial story). If Pete's knew the seal was bad, he should warranty the transmission through the 90 day warranty and pick up the install costs since it's not fair to force the owner to pay twice when Pete's knowingly sold him a faulty part.

 

I'm having trouble seeing why you wouldn't replace common, cheap seals when doing a tranny swap. That is on par with swapping in a used motor and not taking the time to put in a $9.00 new rear main seal. Doesn't make too much sense to me.

 

when i put them in,they get installed just like they come.

 

Because every repair shop has every available equipment available?

Pete knew the problem before it was given to Randy's. That alone should justify that he's to blame.

 

I think Randy's should be held responsible. Without seeing what the supposed 90-Day Warr. covers (typically mechanical part failures) it is hard to assume that Pete's should be held liable. I know bench-testing a tranny is difficult, but at the same time, anyone who buys a salvaged/used part especially a transmission is accepting the risk.

The transmission is salvaged NOT REBUILT, and I agree with Pete's Salvage by advising the bushing and seal should've been replaced prior to install. That is pretty much common-knowledge. As a "professional" mechanic/shop-owner, it would be foolish to install a salvaged part w/o replacing the most-commonly worn components to insure a leak-free transmission. Apples-to-Oranges, but to me that's like having a shop replace your top-end and reusing the old head-gasket or intake man. gasket/seals regardless of the condition....

Crappy situation all around, but to play the finger-pointing game will only make matters worse. Hopefully one of the parties involved will step up to make things right regardless of who they "think" should be responsible.

 

As an aircraft mechanic, we dont have bench testing tools to test items before they are put on. That is performed before we get the part. To say a shop is required to have every tool and bench test tool goes too far. now if you throw it in and it doesnt work. Then you go back to where you got it from, either get a new one or have that one fixed.

 

This is on my opinion side here, but if that were the thought, then would you expect Randy's to also replace to rear seal, and the pan gasket as well as the front seal? I'm not being a smart ass here, just asking for serious input on your basis for your comment.

No general auto repair shop could be in business if they were required to have these specialty equipment pieces. A transmission dyno/leak tester is in the 40k range, and not something a general shop would have. The ONLY place I have ever seen one of these is in a large transmission builder facility like Jasper Engines and Transmissions. I have never seen one in a dealership, nor have I ever seen one at a transmission repair shop either.

With that theory in mind one would say a general repair shop should also have an engine dyno, which they don't. THOSE things are expensive!

 

You call the Pete's Salvage Yard and Pete says, "Randy's should have replaced the front bushing and seal before they installed it."

 

Correct me if I am wrong, but the hilighted part of your post says "anyone who buys a salvaged/used part especially a transmission is accepting the risk. " and since the owner of the truck bought the transmission and brought it TO the shop, then one would assume your post indicates the owner would be responsible.

I had missed this part earlier, and to clarify, NOBODY said that Pete knew the seal and bushing were bad.

The seals (assuming if one is expected to replace ONE common seal, he should replace them all) are in the $50 range, including the bushing. Installing the front seal and bushing require partially disassembling the transmission to remove the pump and press out the bushing.

 

I think the best solution is to gather everyone for a face to face, a calm discussion of what happened...I think blame could be spread to more than one person...

It would be interesting to know whether the salvage yard person told the buyer it needed a seal, you see where I am going here?

Good luck, sometimes you give up some for more down the roadie...

 

The customer did call Pete after Randy notified the customer of the leak, and that it was most likely coming from the front seal. Pete told the customer that Randy should have replaced the front bushing and seal before installing the transmission in the first place.