2012 v6 at DCSB engine knocking @ 1500 rpm

Oh yes I have all the time in the world and really have nothing better to to then listen to some one whine, suggestions have been made by my self and others you seem hell bent on getting rid of your "piece of s#@%" so what is the hold up?

 

The hell it is. When you start at the bottom rung, and that gets you nowhere, you keep going up the ladder. And up. And up. Until you get someone to actually listen and make positive things happen. Period.

As for not having a dog in this fight, the Tacoma is one of his responsibilities. How the hell you figure he doesn't have a dog in this fight, I don't know.

You drop 30k+, end up with a POS, and then talk to me and everyone else in the same boat.

 

Collaborative effort to:

1. Get the problem addressed and remedied, or
2. Resolve it on our own.

Your suggestions are stupid and redundant. They've been followed and tried. They don't work. Repeating "use high octane gas" 15 times is pointless when people are already doing that.

This is basically the same course of effort and events that got the Tundra (07-09 or so) rear 'bounce' issue fixed. Think those owners were happy? Toyota just felt like denying that problem for upwards of 3 years.

As for the hold up, arbitration hearing isn't until 10/17. A decision won't issue until 10/27 or thereabouts. Depending on the result, litigation is the next step. That's going to be a 30-60 day process, at least. It takes time. You're free to no longer read the thread, of course.

 

The chief engineer isn't the one who's going to do anything about your problem, it would be a business decision by Toyota. That's why I said you're crying on the wrong shoulder.

As far as spending $30k and ending up with a POS, I've got the same truck as you, pal, and I can promise you that I've got more money sunk into repairs than you at this point. I don't disagree with your frustration, I just think you're wasting your efforts going at the engineer.

 

So who do we call Ghostbusters?

 

We're not talking about repairs, we're talking about a defect that Toyota needs to address.

 

Just got back with the results. I need to compile the info into useful info and I also need to compare some to toyotas factory expectations (expected value @ rpm) and I can't do that till Monday. But basically from what I can tell and again I won't know exactly till Monday but the timing is WAY advanced and long term fuel trim is around. 9.4 increase and that indicated a lean condition. So poor timing and lean fuel = high temp/ pressure cuasing a ping. I couldn't scope the knock sensor so without that reading we are still a little blind but I can get that reading later I suppose. Anywho give me a bit to post up the actual numbers for you guys. Maybe one of you can read them better than me.

 

O2 sonsor: @idle3.313V @2k rpm 3.215

long term fuel trim: 9.4% increase

short term fuel trimidle3.1-2.3 @2k rpm 3.1

timing advanceidle 15 dgrees adance @2k rpm 29.5degrees

I didnt have alot of time to do this so i couldnt pull all the info I wanted but I did get some good stuff and also I did this in nuetral not out on the highway unfortunatly.

so the timing is insanely advanced and im running 89 on this tank. I have no idea why it would be soooooo advanced but 15 at idle and almost 30 degrees at 2k rpm is something ive never seen. the fuel trim indicates its running very lean all the time and that to me is something to take note of. Ill have to referance this info to what toyota says is supposed to happen and see what that brings to the table. but very interesting data. i might be able to use an even more accurate tool at a later time but we will see.

 

Thank you for doing this. I can add a little data for highway testing:

At about 70mph in 5th, the engine is turning close to 2k RPM

Timing advance there, under coasting conditions ranged from 29BTDC to 35BTDC. Under moderate throttle, advance drops to 17 to 22BTDC.

I think the golden data is at 1500 or so. That and below seem to be
The sel-imposed "lugging" range.

LTFT here is +6 on bank 1(pass. Side) and +7.3 on bank 2. STFT I can't accurately capture. Those trims are at 70 turning about 2k RPM.

Water temp ranged 181 to 190, ambient air temp 66 to 74F. I couldn't get intake air temp.

Two other useful data points may be ambient air pressure (in PSI) and MAF readings. My interpolated PSI (via ScanGauge) is 14.4 at 10 ft above sea level. Comparing to local airport altimeter pressure corrections, ambient pressure should read 14.73 psi when I was driving this AM.

This was all visual observations of the SG while taking my rabbit hound to the vet. I can't log data.

You kick ass, man.

 

Hell, I guess so.

It's not about crying on anyone's shoulder. When a dog is bad, you stick his face in what he did wrong. If he keeps thinking gophers are rabbits, you give him a reminder. And you keep reminding him till he learns.

Toyota is being a bad dog. I'm going to rub their face in this until they learn. Sweers oversaw the Tundra "hop" fix. He can put his tail between his legs and do the same here. This isn't about being "bro", it's about fixing a problem. If that means I gotta be an asshat or a dick to Toyota, I'll sleep fine at night.

Those who expect us with this problem to roll over and play nice? No way.

 

Hey the sqeekey wheel gets the grease. So if bitching gets it fixed so be it. I'm all about responsibility and if there is a problem with a 30000$ truck that has low miles and has been dealer maintained it's there problem to fix

 

Customer Service, as I said before...

This is not an engineering issue... The engine is engineered just fine, this is a production issue. If the engineering was wrong, all of the engines would be screwed up. Seeing how there is only a small handful of engines having this issue means something is happening in production. If it makes you feel better writing to the engineer, great but this isn't his issue. You should be pounding down the door of the people who handle quality assurance and quality control for the engines.

Like I said earlier, I agree with your fight and would be furious as well but going at the wrong person doesn't get you anywhere.

 

you could be right...and that engineer could fwd his email along to the right person... The worst thing that could happen is they ignore him

 

Agreed, I still think it's poor form to post the engineer's e-mail on an open forum.

 

Anyone ever pull plugs out and notice a white/grey soot on them?

 

Did you see earlier in this thread where I posted a pic of one of my plugs? I think it's a ways back, but you might compare, for laughs. Mine had a sooty-looking appearance (whitish) on the ground strap. But our definitions of "white/grey soot" might differ, too.

As for those griping about posting Mike's email address, you really have some delicate sensibilities.

How many business cards do you think this guy hands out? How hard do you think it is to find his email address on the Internet? If you can use Google, you can find it. Do you think akio.toyoda@toyota.com gets much spam, and that his email address is never used?

I could see it being over the line to post his home address, pictures of his family, personal email addresses and personal phone numbers. That's creepy. This is his work email address. He's put himself out in public (does plenty of interviews and PR-type things), he's the head engineer of the platform, and if anyone can cause a problem to be looked at, or make the information known to another relevant party, he can.

Do you really think your form-based emails to customer service at Toyota go anywhere meaningful, other than into their own departmental database? They may run statistical analysis against them (X for bigger seats, Y for diesels, etc.), but that's about it.

If something isn't right, it needs to get fixed. If a wheel is going to squeak loud enough and long enough, it's going to stop being ignored. The bigger the squeak, the sooner it gets a new bearing - so to speak.

 

I have noticed in my rig that the fuel gauge goes down ever so slightly every time I drive it. to make matters worse, if it goes down all the way, the truck will not start until I add more fuel.

im just checking in on this thread as I haven't been in it since the early pages.

without visible engine damage, a cel, or anything else, good luck with your ventures. I get the feeling that what you are experiencing is inherent to the beast. your engine pings, jet engines whistle, what are we to do? without an actual failure, you are going to here the same thing from Toyota, and eventually, a judge.

all your trim and timing numbers mean nothing without an ase tech verifying them on proper tools.

 

I am using industry standard tools and had 2 master techs present while gathering data. They were very interested in what I was doing. With pinging damage is inevitable. But I have not stated that I have fully identified the cuase. A lot more investigating needs to happen. But if anyone thinks that Toyota will recall or anything of that nature out of the goodness of there heart your severely misguided. Every time it takes a class action law suite and those have to have hard evidence to the problem. Now if we can identify the problem and get the ball rolling then great. But the more likely is that we will find the cuase of the sounds and it will be nothing to be conceded about thus putting everyone's mind to ease. But I'd rather know then not know, you know?

 

Do you have access to a set of knock ears or chassis ears? I do, if I drive 110 miles. There are some good Youtube vids of mechanics running ears and capturing sound from them - could make a good comparison.

 

I don't have engine ears. I wish I did that would make my so much easier. I will deffinantly be investing in those. What I'm going to do is start measuring things. I'll look back to see your spark plugs and compare to mine. I'm also going to take notes on what cylinders look like what. Also going to check valve clearance to makes sure they are good to go. And if I have the time and it get to this point I'll pull a head off and see what's happening. But I highly doubt it will get that far. I really want to find the cause of this strange noise