Lunchbox locker..?

Hey guys I've got a 98 ext cab 2.7L 5-speed taco. I'm wondering about installing some type of a lunchbox locker. I will be mostly onroad with weekend excursions into the woods. I live in the northwest and go to school in Pullman. Lots of wet/snowy slick on and offroad conditions. Good idea? Bad idea? Suggestions for locker? Lemme know. Thanks guys.

 

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I put a lock-rite in the front diff of my '97. It works great and is quiet. I have manual locking front hubs, so it doesn't affect pavement driving at all.

 

I personally wouldnt go for an auto locker. I am sure most are fine, but I just think it better to spend the extra few hundred for a manual electric locking or an ARB air locker.

 

I'm on the poor college kid budget lol... My front end has auto locking hubs so idk if that would matter, it really shouldn't being as an auto locker is only engaged under power i.e. 4WD correct? Also being in the snow\slick conditions would it be more beneficial in the front..?

 

Incorrect. A lunchbox locker is working ALL THE TIME. You don't engage it or disengage it. It's always locked.

The only way to get around that, is having MANUAL locking hubs where you can disconnect the front wheels from the axle shafts (on the front that is). No way of disconnecting it on the rear wheels.
The lunchbox lockers replace your spider gears in the rear differential.

The lunchbox lockers have crazy characteristics as they pop/bang during regular street driving. They have to unload the torque load.

Do some more research about them & their on-road characteristics and where to put them (front or rear) and why.

The best all - around lunchbox locker that I've heard from many offroad enthusiasts, is the AUSSIE locker. http://www.aussielocker.com/

 

You dont want one in the front . As janster said they are engaged all the time. I know from exp. On wet slick surfaces you hafta un-lock one hub for it to drive worth a damn. Being from fla i have no idea about icy, snowy surfaces but i can't imagine it being very pleasant to drive. If you can live with load/unload noises they are fine for the rear

 

What I ment by engaged under power is when an auto locker is installed in the front, for the front to have "power" 4WD needs to be engaged. Auto lockers are "engaged" under power and "ratchet" when they aren't, i.e. when installed in the rear the locker is engaged while your foot is on the gas, and it ratchets in a turn with no acceleration. The ratchet\engage action is what causes the clunk\bang\pop, etc. I understand what they are and how they work. I just need advice as to what one to get and which diff to install it in..?

 

Definitely install in the rear unless you have manual locking hubs, then definitely install in the front.

 

Being in 4WD has nothing to do with it.

If you have manual locking hubs - then, you're OK.

With Auto hubs - the axleshafts & wheels are always turning and will turn the ring gear (with open diff) inside the differential. With an auto locker in there, everything can turn including the front driveshaft.
I don't have experience with this myself, but enough research I've done in the past - I'd go with an ARB (selectable) style locker in the front.

 

Janster I understand that everything is engaged and turning up front but... there wouldn't be power to the front without being in 4WD ya know what I'm sayin'..?

 

When making turns, the two front wheels aren't gonna be turning at the same rates. The inside wheels will cover less distance than the outter wheel. Since the axle shafts are turning on both sides (with ADD vehicle), there will be a torque variation that the lunchbox locker will need to deal with. I don't have experience, but the locker will surely pop/bang and perhaps limit your turning radious due to that torque load.

Do some GOOGLE research. These lockers have weird street characteristics and even worse snow characteristics.

Obviously people have installed them. Some people hate it while others get used to its characteristics. Research research research

The only good thing, if you don't like it.....you can remove it and put your stock spider gears back in without any other headaches to deal with. But ultimately....for the front...your best, most reliable, SAFE option is going with a selectable up front (like an ARB).

 

Removing that front diff is a PITA. You should definitely take Jan's suggestion and research the crap out of the subject before you go sticking a locker in your front diff.

 

Yeah I know that the IFS shit is a PITA... I had already pretty much figured on just the rear anyways...

 

I realize this is old, but there's some bad info here.

Janster stated, "Since the axle shafts are turning on both sides (with ADD vehicle), there will be a torque variation that the lunchbox locker will need to deal with."

When in 2wd, whis will not occur because the ADD will disconnect the passenger side from the diff. So, in 2wd there will be no binding issue. There will however be some clicking, but there will be much less of it vs when in 4wd. The front drive shaft is also going to see a lot more movement in 2wd. That's probably also not such a huge deal. The problems occur in 4wd when the ADD is connected. There will probably be some times on the road (in town in the snow) when it's going to bind and bang, as well as just fail to disengage and you'll get understeer. That wouldn't be a big deal for me, but I live in a small town with three stoplights and very slow traffic. If i lived in a bigger town with more significant traffic to contend with, the understeer might be a pain in the ass. The really big thing imo that will suck will be hwy handling in 4wd, especially with a manual transmission. When in corners, only the inside tires will get power. The outside tires will get zero power. This probably isn't so bad when accelerating, as the truck will just have more of a tendency to understeer. I think this can be overcome by just learning how it handles. Not a big deal to me. The actual dangerous stuff comes when you engine brake around a corner in 4wd with a manual transmission going around a steep downhill icy corner on the HWY with log trucks in the opposing lane. Only the inside tires will be braking. It doesn't sound like a good time to me. I noticed this effect instantly when i put a lunchbox in my rear diff. It was unsettling at first, but I got used to it. However, the nasty effects caused by braking on only one side are going to be much worse in the front axle than in the rear. So if you have lunchboxes in both diffs, I'm guessing engine braking will be pretty sketchy.

I really want to put a lunch box in the front of my truck, but my truck is a daily driver and my commute includes steep curvy grades that are bad enough in the winter without the truck trying to do cookies whenever i let off the gas in the corners. Maybe someday I'll retire this truck to be a dedicated trail truck. But till then, I'd only consider putting a TT or selectable up front. I especially don't want a lunch box up front with my wife driving my truck every once in a while. She's a bad enough driver without the truck handling unpredictably.

 

All this talk about a front locker for someone who drives mostly on road and takes a few trips in the woods and on snowy roads?

I just have to ask if a front locker is even necessary. Probably not... Have you noticed situations where you have a severe loss of traction on one wheel?

Honestly, good tires and careful line selection are more useful than lockers, at least at first.

For something that spends most of its life on the road, I would consider a limited slip, or a selectable locker. More expensive? Yes. But well worth it.

 

I haven't read any of the above, but I installed a lunchbox locker in my 5 speed and regretted it every time I turned a corner. Heard it works great with automatics cause of the torque converter. Finally ripped it out, sold it for $100, and got an ARB locker installed.

 

jbrandt, I live 10 miles from this guy. I'm guessing it's his daily driver, and that he also uses it for hunting. Snow comes early some years, so he'd definitely benefit from a rear locker. I think he just didn't realize a front locker should be done only after many other mods aren't working for you.

Namad_Pilot, I have one in the rear on my 5 speed, and I love it. But, it's definitely not for everyone. My wife hates driving my truck now (which is fine with me). I didn't like it so much at first either. It's not the clicking or banging, or its tendency to light up the inside tire. It's the slack in the drive train that is obnoxious. Parking lot driving becomes a chore. If you're not careful, it will turn into a bucking bronco. And this isn't due to the locker failing to disengage. It's purely due to the slack in the drive train. I got used to it, learning to feather the clutch sometimes, and just getting better about gear choice, clutch timing, and gas pedal control. If you want your truck to drive like did from the factory, they definitely aren't a good fit for you.

Around here, just the rear locker suited me great for a long time. There aren't any trails to drive in the summer, so it's purely for utility purposes (I work in the woods daily). However, I'm finding myself doing more and more driving in deep snow (1-2'), whether it's for work, hunting, or just driving around. I constantly find myself digging holes where i would have been able to keep forward progress with a front locker. Watching the front tires, they are constantly switching power back and forth. A fellow logger I work with has lunchboxes in the front and rear of his tacoma. He said he loves it and that it's not as bad as people say. He usually knows what he's talking about. But he jams gears for a living, so his tolerance is probably higher.

 

This paragraph is so spot on it's scary. EXACTLY my experience, I just didn't want to write it all

 

Had a lunchbox in the rear of my 99 Prerunner many years ago, was the single best mod I did to that truck for wheeling aside from eventually upgrading to a 4x4.
It was an auto though and I lived in a dry climate...it could be downright squirrelly in the rain. I hear they do not pair as well with autos.

Someone commented up above several years ago in this thread that a lunchbox locker is locked "all of the time"...that is not true. If that were the case you'd essentially have a welded rear, would you not? Lunchbox lockers are disengaged and lock up when one wheel starts to slip, as I understand it. The clicking/clanking you hear around turns is the sound of it not engaging.

Maybe there are different types of lunchbox lockers, I dunno...but mine certainly was not locked 'all of the time'. I just didn't have complete control of when it locked which is what makes them less desirable than selectable lockers.