SOLVED! Post 2853 Leaking Injectors, Dealer Techs Rock! Extended Cranking after Engine Swap 3.4L 5vz

Good grief I hope you're wrong too!

I remember way back in early Dec when I was "interviewing" them on the phone, and I asked about sensors being swapped over vs. replaced. He said the only thing they replace in regards to sensors is the knock sensor, or actually, I think it was just the wire for the knock sensor? Not sure, but I AM sure they weren't replacing any other sensors. Had no idea at that time that this was not OK.

How can we tell if the timing belt, water pump and idlers were indeed replaced, like they were supposed to be, and like we paid for them to be? Are these things that are fairly simple for our current mechanic to look at? Don't want to pay him a bunch of labor time to look at this, but sure would like to know.......

 

Because these 3.4 motors have such long life's, most mechanics will write the miles that the belt was changed at, on the timing belt cover with a paint pen. The belt is to be changed every 90,000 miles and this is a good way to remember when the next belt change is due.

My first belt was changed by a Toyota dealer, I've used this methods since. Is there a tag or writing on the belt shroud that may indicate yours was changed?

 

Actually, that was one of the first things I noticed when we initially picked up - that the sticker/label you're talking about said some mileage or date that was way old and outdated. But, like an idiot, I didn't bring it up, because that was back in the "honeymoon" phase with those VERY NICE QUALIFIED mechanics, when we desperately wanted to believe they'd done all the work correctly, and the whole female thing - I felt like I would look stupid to point out a detail like that and would be shushed/dismissed. My husband is saying he thinks we could just have our mechanic pull the timing cover off (2 bolts he thinks) to see if all of the items you mentioned are indeed new or not. Does that sound right to you? Would be worth it to me to have him look at this for us if it's not going to be anything very labor intensive.......

 

You are correct, the easiest way would be to remove the cover. Your mechanic would be able to do this pretty easy. It might be a bit more than removing two bolts tho.

 

Got it, thank you. Will ask him to take a look when he calls next time. Ya think he'll be able to tell just by looking at them? I hope so......

I can't believe we are even having to question things like this. It's just ridiculous for the amount of money we gave those guys. Wow. So sad that they clearly took such little pride in their work..........

 

He will be able to tell at a glace.

Starting to get post happy on my end. Drinking and grilling...again. As I've said be skeptical of everything I write

 

Ditto here.
Till tomorrow

 

Thanks you guys!

Same here, just got back from a nice little hike with our 4 legged kid, picked up a bottle of Johnny Walker Red to try for first time, gonna pour a couple glasses of that and I might actually bake a dessert for us to eat for once.

How bout that!

See you tomorrow on the Jen's Taco Crisis show, season 17, episode #1194.

Happy Saturday y'all!

 

Enjoy the whiskey...it will be better tomorrow!

 

That's red is fine as a mixer, but neat, no thanks. Still will get you relaxed if you are on a mission, if you know what I mean

 

a nice little mix I like to do is get a half gallon of vodka and a gallon of hawaian punch then evenly split the vodka half and half into two empty gallon water jugs then top off with tap water to finish filling all the way up.

ends up tasting like straight punch with nothing in it but your stumbling around in no time

 

Jen, did the shop supply the engine for the engine swap?... or did you buy it elsewhere and have them just do the install?

Keep a tally on what you've spent after the original shop finished and sent you on your way. You may need those documents for whatever legal reasons that may work out to be in your favor down the road, once the problem is solved.

 

Holy hell. When should I show up?

 

this stuff is dangerous because you cant even tell it has any alcohol in it until you start bumping into things I make it for those who don't like the taste of alcohol in drinks

I also wanted something so I could drink that was cheap and nothings cheaper then no name vodka if you can get past its bitter taste and the punch does that nicely.

you get 2 whole gallons of party punch for about $15 and its mixed about 40% vodka, 40% punch, 20% water, so its not going to take much to make you smile. the water also gets rid of that pucker after taste normally left behind by the punch

 

I am disappointed the mechanic who swapped motors didn't change all the easy to get to sensors. One sensor or relay is getting heat soaked and failing. I haven't spent enough time on the wiring diagram to get it right, but pulling sensors, testing cold and testing with a heat gun might show the bad one. Changing motors in old trucks can often be a challenge

 

I found this article that could be relevant if it winds up being that EFI relay going bad. The article talks about a DME (digital motor electronics) relay, rather than an EFI relay, but after some googling, it sounds as if they essentially serve the same purpose. I thought this article was really a good read - has some easy to read charts breaking stuff down based on symptoms, then tells you what to go after based on those symptoms. Not even sure if the info in the article is applicable to our situation, because the whole thing is peppered with "DME" and I ain't never seen that term when reading about the Taco before.

Do you guys think the general concepts in this article would apply to Taco? Here's the link:

http://www.clarks-garage.com/shop-manual/ts-01.htm

Under the section labeled "Engine Difficult to Start When Hot," it says:

"One of the first signs of a failing DME/Fuel Pump is difficult hot starting. Quite often when the DME/Fuel Pump relay starts failing the car will start without problems when it is cold. However, when the car has been operated at normal operating temperature for a while, it will refuse to start when the car is shut down and re-start is attempted while the car is still warm. After the car is allowed to sit and cool for some period of time (usually 30 minutes to 1 hour), the car will again start without problem. If you experience hot start problems, try making up and installing a jumper for the DME/Fuel Pump relay (FUEL-05 under "Emergency Repairs") to see if it solves the hot start problem. Realize that you must attempt this while you are experiencing the hot start problem for the test to be valid."

The other section that interested me was "Engine Idles Rough When Cold" - not 100% we had this issue, but I do feel there were times that the idle seemed to jump around a bit when we had her home.

"On startup when the engine is cold, the DME temperature sensor tells the DME computer that the engine (coolant) is cold. This causes the DME computer to supply a much richer mixture to the engine (a hot engine atomizes fuel better). When the DME temperature starts to fail, it normally sends a higher than normal temperature signal to the DME computer. The DME computer in turn supplies a leaner mixture to the engine than that which is normally required. So, the engine runs rough (lean) and if it gets bad enough, may not run at all. Check the cold resistance of the DME temperature sensor"

Also, my husband found this article http://www.sdsefi.com/techtheo.htm Nice easy read about EFI systems. I didn't read the whole thing yet, but just glancing over it, my first impression was holy crap, there's a whole lotta sensors that could be the culprit here.........yikes. Hoping for the relay - cheap and easy. Fearing it's a sensor thing though.

Kinda like hetkind's point - just pure disappointment that this could very well wind up being a sensor thing that could be a real bear to pinpoint. After those guys had all this stuff apart, with easy access to it, and we would have gladly said yes if they'd recommended replacing any - to avoid exactly where we are now. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

File IFR, thanks for the advice. You bet, I've been documenting it all, from the very first day this all started. I am a details person and have an entire notebook filled with details of every conversation I've ever had with MY MOST FAVORITE MECHANICS EVER as well as tallies upon tallies of what's been spent, and giant bulging files of receipts, warranty paperwork, etc etc etc. And now our new mechanic is going to be taking photos as he finds things amiss. Plus, the place that just did our injectors gave us back the two failing injectors that SHOULD NOT HAVE FAILED ONLY A COUPLE WEEKS AFTER THEY WERE SUPPOSEDLY CLEANED AND TESTED. And our mechanic is saving all of the old parts he's replacing for us - bad hoses that were simply reinstalled, etc. His words on that one cracked hose that carries coolant were:

"Imagine if you guys were in some remote area on a trip and this hose started leaking coolant?!? I can't believe those guys put this back on!"

Yep, I will continue documenting EVERYTHING til this is all over.

Koditten, I agree about the JW red - a bit harsh to drink straight, but with some gingerale, it goes down pretty smooth. It'll do, but def. getting J & B or Buffalo Trace next time. How was the grilling and drinking last night?

Keakar and Peerunner, are you guys puking right now? How did your vodka punch party turn out?

DP, did you mean ditto on the grilling and drinking, or ditto on the getting post happy? Or all of the above? Either way, I like your use of this Thinking maybe you WERE drinking, as I've never seen ya use that guy!

Happy Sunday Tacoma World! Hoping for an update from our mechanic today, might call him pretty soon if we don't hear anything. Will keep you posted!

 

he definitely priced it like a first class professional shop yet did it like joe bob working under a tree branch for an engine hoist

she did her best and believed she found a good guy but in the end we just never know who we are hiring to do things until you actually experience what level of work they do for us

if I were her I would definitely (after its all over so she knows the full extent of everything) I would go on angies list and give a full review of this guy and the kind of work he does

 

Hey man, don't diss joe bob, he didn't do anything wrong!

JK. I agree with you that it looks that way 100% at this point. Although, I'll say it again, until we have ALL OF THE INFO and are absolutely most definitely at the end of the repair mode, I don't think it's fair of me to make assumptions. People do make honest mistakes. Clearly, some of the stuff we've found at this point was just sloppiness/laziness. But because I'm trying my hardest to be fair and reasonable about the whole thing and not jump to conclusions (not easy, trust me), I think it's POSSIBLE that some of the stuff was laziness, and some of it was honest mistakes, rather than just intentional deliberate dishonesty. And we really won't know for sure til it's all done.

 

well at this point it looks like he charged you to wash and wax your car and did just that but when delivered you found he left the tires and rims covered in mud

and don't forget, the little things he didn't do don't mean much except as far as most profession mechanics would care enough to do "everything" right and not leave dirt and crud and worn or damaged nuts/bolts behind after taking it apart, so the engine is something I think you can and should have 100% confidence in.

 

** and Yelp as well.