Toyota Hilux Diesel

I just spend couple of weeks in Swaziland and had a pleasure of driving a Hilux 3.0 D4D with a turbo. What a pleasure. Unfortunately its not available in the USA and i do not see it in near by future. Runs on ultra low 50ppm fuel so no black smoke and its also as quiet as a petrol version. Power is plenty. Wish one could have one in here.

 

I hear Ya Unski ,
I would love to learn the REAL reason why Diesels are and were squashed in the USA ....
I'd be willing to bet that it has something to do with money ?

I worked in refinerys , and diesel is the easiest to refine hence the cheapest to make along with heating oil and I believe jet fuel. Diesel is more cost effective than gasoline , better power more mpg's. Europe , South America , etc. all run diesel as their main fuel . (Jeep Wranglers , Chrysler mini vans and more are All diesel in Europe .... Can't get a gas)
Gasoline , which is the last thing to come off the cracking process ( the waste) cost more to refine and is less cost effective mpg wise. So those other country's are selling their waste to the good ole USA , at a cheap price.
Back in the late 80's GM made a diesel for their larger vehicles , like the Big Delta 88 , while idling the car would say , Dick -Dick-Dick-Dick-Dick , loud and a total failure performance wise and mechanical wise , smokey and loud , a costly car to own. Failure !!
I wonder if it was intentionally made to fail to turn the public off and scare them away from diesel power , as part of the long term money scheme ???
If everyone used the Benifits of diesel what would the world do with the gasoline ?
If gasoline is good .... Why do all the heavy haul trucks use diesel ? Because it's not cost effective .... No Power !
My VW TDI gets over 40 mpg around town , a 1980 VW diesel was getting 55+ on the highway .... My gosh if everyone would have driven them the Big Oil Company's would have lost Trillions in profits !!!
Although diesels are making a small come back in a niche market , I believe there is an overall behind the scenes conspiracy to keep em out of the picture .
Been driving the VW diesels for years and years , my buddy and I would see who could get the most mpg's for the buck and noticed that when the 1st Gulf War started , diesel became more expensive than gasoline for the first time . due to Tax , to help pay for the war .
Goods are hauled by truck , haulers pass the cost onto the retailers who pass the cost onto the consumer .... Everyone PAYS for the war .... And the profits of those who Benifits from war ... Halliburton , Dick Cheney , Bush's , and countless other "Big Shots" etc. ( not the common folk)
Once the prices were up above gasoline , it further turned the public off of wanting a diesel.
OMG ! I'm not paying that much for fuel !! People don't T-H-I-N-K .... They are lazy and run with emotion .... If you average out the cost of running 10,000 miles diesel vs gasoline , taking into account mpg's you are waaayyyy ahead with diesel , even at the higher cost.
I based this on my average 42 mpg's diesel vs 24 mpg's gasoline
Over the period of 10 years I saved $16,000 dollars using diesel !!! Haha !
Let's not forget the longevity of the properly maintained Diesel engine ... I expect 350,000 out of my TDI ( check out "Fred's TDI forum" )

This is just my take , or thought on WHY .....it Boils down to $$$$ out of the pockets of lazy dumb , emotional , poor folk , and into the pockets of the "Smart Rich Folk" .... Who ...
deserve it for being smart and not lazy and dumb : )
If the consumer would stop buying , China , gas cars , or anything that we bitch about ... Things would Change .....

 

Toyota did have a diesel on the market here decades ago, they run till the bodies rusted away. Another nice Toyota i was able to try was a Rav4 with a diesel. MPG close to 50. My current Tacoma here is a real gas guzzler to say the least. Just had a frame and lots of other stuff underneath replaced by Toyota due to excessive rust. Otherwise a good truck. Talking about diesels and MPG, New Mercedes E240 diesel with twin turbos beats Prius on MPG.

 

So, I idle my tractor for twenty minutes ( which I do in cold weather) and come out to find soot all over my car. Diesel is one dirty fuel. So dirty, that it is very costly to to make clean regardless of the power it makes. Europe has lower polution standards and is so depended on the cheapest fuel available ( they don't have the natural resources) they supported diesel for years with lower road taxes; it is a non comparison with the U.S. We could can lower our polution standards. We can do all sorts of things to bring diesel over here....including seeing cities and pollution levels rise like they were years ago because of the auto. If you think that gasoline pollutes, wait till you start seeing a plethora of diesel powered cars in your cities. You diesel lovers will then have your diesel powered Hilux......in exchange for more years of respiratory problems. If you think bio diesel is the solution, remember the accommodations busses have to make for it's use. Letting your truck sit with bio in it for a little while makes ethanol problems pale in significant. This stuff is meant for a high turnover rate.

 

New diesels are extremely clean burning. They use the 50ppm or less diesels. Your days when diesels were puffing black smoke are long gone my friend. New diesels actually pollute less than similar gasoline ones. Do your research.

 

Apparently it's not so rosy:
http://www.autoblog.com/2015/04/11/clean-diesel-not-clean/

I like diesels, by the way, so I'm not trying to be contrarian.

 

They may burn "cleaner," but they waste so much more fuel with the regen process. A regen takes about 2.0 gallons of diesel every few hundred miles depending on driving. Just taking 6.7 Powerstrokes alone; (ford has sold over 600k, but just use 500k for simplicity). At a low rate of 2 regens a month per engine for 500k trucks, that's an extra 2 million gallons per month of diesel wasted just to try and make the air "cleaner."

 

Are you talking about the big rigs or just small cars??? Big difference.

 

Define similar.

http://www.torquenews.com/1083/toyota-explains-why-there-no-2016-diesel-tacoma-coming

Toyota doesn't share in your sentiments. They say the cost to treat them can be as much as $3000'more. That doesn't sound like it pollutes less. There is more to polution then just particulates? That enough research ? Toyota engineers are the experts on bringing your diesel to market.

 

Look at the Mazda 6. They planned on offering a Diesel for it in 2013. You still can't get one in north america. They have it in Europe where the standards are lower.
I personally think that Toyota will be watching GM and Nissan sales with the Diesel in the North American market and if people are paying the extra cost for the diesel then they will follow suit. Problem too is the cost for a midsize with a diesel would be $3-5000 more. A lot of people say the want one but will they open their pockets and pay for one.

 

Toyota (chief engineer IIRC) came out on camera during the Jan unveil & said why no Tacima diesel in the U.S.

I get while some people don't like the answer, but Toyota did give an answer. Move on guys, you're just getting wound up / pissed off for no reason at this point.

Toyota emphatically stated no diesel for 3rd Gen Tacoma. It's done.

 

Agree, and for good reason.
http://newscenter.berkeley.edu/2012/10/22/diesel-vs-gas-contributing-to-smog/

 

Meh, needs a bigger grill.

 

If I might weigh on the diesel conversation.

We've had to redesign our entire product line at my work to be able to take a tier 4 final diesel engine which is required by the USofA. tier 4 final is the level of emissions standards that the US is adhering to. Europe and Canada stopped being picky at tier 3, whereas other places like New Zealand/Australia/South Africa stopped at tier 2.

This is important because as you jump from tier 2 to 3 to 4 intrum to 4 final, the complication and cost goes up expontentially at each level, whereas relability drops off the same way. And of course all manufacturers conquer the result differently. However the common factor for T4F is that urea has to be injected into the exhaust system to keep the NOx levels down, which no-one from the engine makers to the OEM to the dealers to the customers like (on new transports this is the tank with the blue cap behind the fuel tank). A "regen" system that has been mentioned hasn't been used (on heavy duty engines anyways) since T3, though you might find it occasionally on a T4i engine.

So my guess for the lack Tacoma diesel is because the cost to develop a reliable T4F that is required for the US is incredibly high. They could offer a diesel in Canada as they already have that engine running in the Hilux in Europe, but there is a border issue, aka politics, with the US that is preventing that. It's the same reason Dodge went to Fiat in replace of Cummins (Cummins has been having issues for a few years with customer relations and engine reliability. Dodge is also a corporate partner with Fiat and the FPT engine and a fairly nice engine to work with. It's the T4F power plant we've had to design our machines around at my work). Having said that, my dad was looking at the Ram with the FPT engine and has been advised multiple times to not bother, not because the FPT engine is a problem, but T4F engines... which again, are required in the US/North America thanks to the US... are incredibly complicated, and unless you know them from the level of the guy who designed them, they are very very expensive to fix, and because of how complicated they are, they'll need fixing more often.

Just the two sense of someone who works with a T4F engine everyday.

And with all that, if the 3rd gen had a diesel I'd be waiting at the dealer before it opened on the morning the first one arrived.

 

Best answer I've heard yet to date !
The pollution issue is a major culprit ...
I still don't understand how VW does it so well though , with there common rail ?
Thanks Stuligan

 

I don't know how VW does it either, I haven't seen their answer to the emissions regs. I always liked the Jetta TDI, I'd probably lean more towards a Passat at this point as I'm getting married in 3.5 weeks and kids will be in a couple of years.

Most of my expereince is with the big heavy equipment diesels, like the FPT 8.3, 8.7, and 8.9L stuff for Forestry/Logging applications. And from an engineering (what I do) perspective they are a pain in the ass to design the entire aftertreatment system into a machine (and FPT is one of the simpler aftertreatment systems!), and from a service/mechanic (What I use to do) perspective they're impossible to work on, the computer systems on them are incredibly complex in order to monitor the exhaust system and keep the emissions levels in check, when they're not in check the machine shuts itself off after x number of minutes.

But they are required by law to get the emissions level low enough that my company (based in Canada) can continue to sell machines into the states. So we need to bite the bullet and work with them.