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AC Failure...insane dealer quote...possible solution?

Discussion in '2nd Gen. Tacomas (2005-2015)' started by abeastman, Apr 11, 2017.

  1. Apr 11, 2017 at 6:32 AM
    #1
    abeastman

    abeastman [OP] Member

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    Hey guys.

    I purchased a 2006 Tacoma that had a non-working A/C.

    I live in Texas and I would probably stroke out if I don't get AC installed here as summer is on its way.

    Story: AC does not blow cold, does blow hot, relay swap does not fix problem. AC light is flashing.

    I took it to the Toyota dealer and received a quote for around $3200 all in to replace essentially every component.

    However, they said that the points of failure were two fold (that they could see...as they can't see the condenser until they open up the dash...)

    Point of failure 1: Leak in condenser line.
    Point of failure 2: Failure of a/c magnetic clutch

    So I was thinking about getting the condenser line (leaking in engine bay) and magnetic clutch repaired first at an INDY, and then if that doesn't fix A/C, moving forward with the in-dash components.

    Anyone have any advice on if I am thinking through the problem correctly?
     
  2. Apr 11, 2017 at 6:46 AM
    #2
    hanrock

    hanrock Well-Known Member

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    Hi there should be lots of independent shops that can do AC work at a cheaper rate than dealer I think you are on the right track the AC clutch probably wont engage with out proper pressure in the system because of a low pressure switch with any luck a new line or new seal a recharge and away you go.
     
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  3. Apr 11, 2017 at 7:31 AM
    #3
    08TRDOFFROAD

    08TRDOFFROAD Well-Known Member

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    You can get just the magnetic clutch on eBay for around $120. My guess is your dealership wants to replace the whole compressor for $600 plus... Line shouldn't be more that $50.

    http://m.ebay.com/itm/AC-Complete-CLUTCH-Fits-OE-Compressor-Toyota-Tacoma-2005-2014-A-C-see-detail-/222056646012?fits=Make:Toyota|Model:Tacoma&hash=item33b39b857c:g:hC4AAOSwyjBW6qKu

    Or here is an oem

    https://toyotaparts.bochtoyotasouth.com/oem-parts/toyota-compressor-clutch-8841035080/

    Light flashing indicates an under or over charge in the system. In your case likely an empty system due to the leak in the line.

    If I were you, I'd replace the line, and clutch myself and then take it somewhere to have the system properly charged and see what happens.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2017
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    #3
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  4. Apr 11, 2017 at 7:35 AM
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    abeastman

    abeastman [OP] Member

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    The dealer wanted to replace the ENTIRE AC SYSTEM because they said "it's old anyways so you will have to replace the compressor etc eventually."

    I said: SO what is the actual point of failure?

    They said "oh, its the clutch and the condenser hose, or possibly in your dash but we don't know that until we take it apart."

    So i'm thinking I do this thing in stages at an indy to avoid huge costs.
     
  5. Apr 11, 2017 at 7:46 AM
    #5
    08TRDOFFROAD

    08TRDOFFROAD Well-Known Member

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    Compressor should be fine as long as nothing grenaded. It may be as simple as the system being empty due to the leaky hose and the clutch not kicking in because it is below the low pressure cut off to protect the compressor.

    Replace the faulty line, recharge the system and see what happens. The clutch can be serviced with the system charged.
     
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  6. Apr 11, 2017 at 6:35 PM
    #6
    07 sport 4x4

    07 sport 4x4 Well-Known Member

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    I've heard of several stories premature compressor bearing failure on these trucks. Any chance the compressor locked up and killed the clutch? My compressor has been really rough sounding for the last 2 or 3 summers, I figure one of these days it'll lock up and shred the clutch or belt. I need to replace it at some point. It makes a howling noise almost, you can hear it at low speeds and idling. When driving on the highway or interstate you wouldn't ever notice it.
    2010 AC Compressor failed!
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2017
  7. Apr 11, 2017 at 6:58 PM
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    abeastman

    abeastman [OP] Member

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    An indy told me they want to try a new compressor and clutch, and condenser hose, and then see if it fixes it all up.
     
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  8. Apr 11, 2017 at 6:59 PM
    #8
    07 sport 4x4

    07 sport 4x4 Well-Known Member

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  9. Apr 11, 2017 at 7:01 PM
    #9
    SJC3081

    SJC3081 Well-Known Member

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    Did you try a can of refrigerant?
     
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  10. Apr 11, 2017 at 8:18 PM
    #10
    Tex-Tac

    Tex-Tac Well-Known Member

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  11. Apr 12, 2017 at 5:06 AM
    #11
    topcathr

    topcathr Well-Known Member

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    You can buy a compressor replacement kit, comes with compressor , oil , new seals , receiver dryer and valve on eBay for around 200 dollars. Good place to start .
     
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  12. Apr 12, 2017 at 5:24 AM
    #12
    Exracer2

    Exracer2 Well-Known Member

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    Problem one is you have no history. When it failed, how it failed, slow failure or boom instantaneous. Because of this you have no data of or feedback to give any mechanic.

    So you can add a can of refrigerant and hope it works only to watch it leak or do nothing. Or you can replace a part at a time until you have replaced everything until you are at that dealer estimated cost. That is the issue with auto AC systems is they are not fully exposed so we tend to guess at the issue because we can't access the whole system without complete disassembly.

    My last truck had no AC so I did the recharge can and it was good for a month or two until it did nothing again. So who knows what O-ring failed or where or if the issue was elsewhere. I eventually left it and accepted it was an old truck with issues. In the end it cost me $40,000 to fix my AC, brakes, rust, new tires and exhaust. Older vehicles sometimes are best accepted for what they are until you finally fix everything in one go. My 3rd gen has none of these issues but I paid heavy to fix all of these little issues. So pick your poison. Chances are an 11 year old vehicle in a hot climate has abused its AC and may need more than a recharge but how much more will be a crap shoot. Who knows if after spending a grand will it need another grand next year or not. Your dealers quote may be the best route depending on how bad you need RELIABLE AC.
     
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  13. Apr 12, 2017 at 7:14 AM
    #13
    cliffyk

    cliffyk Well-Known Member

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    I think you are thinking it through quite correctly--the mechanical part could all easily be a DIY project as others have suggested; to recharge the system you'll need a vacuum pump (I've had for over 10 years--used it when installing a new system on the house) and an R134a manifold/gauge set ( ).

    BTW the in-dash coil is the evaporator...
     
  14. Apr 12, 2017 at 7:51 AM
    #14
    dumprat

    dumprat Well-Known Member

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    You can buy a can or recharge crap from the parts store and with a black light be able to see if or where it is leaking. The lubrication is supposed to have a luminescent dye in it.
     
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  15. Apr 12, 2017 at 7:55 AM
    #15
    js312

    js312 Well-Known Member

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    Have someone charge it with dye added to the refrigerant.

    I'd bet it's simpler than they say and you just have a leak. Clutch, compressor, etc. is likely fine. Without proper pressure, the clutch won't try to engage.
     
  16. Apr 12, 2017 at 8:21 AM
    #16
    mikaymusic

    mikaymusic Well-Known Member

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    I don't know how much of a DIY'er you are, but this would be my approach.

    1. Cheap charge kit, under $25, comes with the gauge and fitting and can of refrigerant. Follow directions, add to system. If the A/C works after this, that's great, because that means you either have fixed the problem, or that there's still a leak and in a month it will stop working again. Either way, the fix will not be that expensive. If it doesn't work at all, then you know you have problems beyond just a leak and that it will cost a lot more.

    2. If it works for a month, then you just have to track down the leak or have your indy shop do that and fix. Done. If it works all summer, congratulations, you fixed it.

    3. If it doesn't work at all in Step 1, then you know that your Indy Shop guy will need to check out the compressor and clutch.

    There's a place in California that ships pretty quick and is solely a Toyota salvage yard, you might want to check there for parts. For instance, for the JBL speaker on my Sequoia, Ebay had them all day long at around $175 to $225. I got one from this place for $50.

    http://www.ranchotoyotatruckparts.com/
     
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  17. Apr 12, 2017 at 8:33 AM
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    Glamisman

    Glamisman Well-Known Member

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    for a few hundred dollars you can buy a small vacuum pump and an AC line set at Pep Boys and diagnose and fix it yourself. The comment about no previous history is accurate, how did it stop working, gradually or suddenly. The condensor, the "radiator" in front of the radiator is the trash collector for the AC system. They are inexpensive enough to replace, a bit of work but in my opinion a necessary piece to replace when the compressor is replaced. In the old days AC condensers were of a round tube design and rarley plugged. With modern condensors they are of a flat tube design with many many small diameter tubes that can get plugged with debris from the compressor. There is a filter in the line that goes into the evaporator. That needs to be pulled and replaced. In many instances the filter is colored, when replaceing this filter match the colors. The different colors are used to designate differernt orifice sizes.
    Finding a small leak can be a real pain but with the vacuum pump and tapered rubber stoppers found at Lowes/Home Depot in teh hardware isle you can do it your self. Evacuate the system first... you need to do this as the level of AC charge level needs to be close to what it came with from the factory. Look for where dirt is around any fittings, the AC lube oil leaks out when the gas leaks out and dirt sticks to it. Disconnect that line and fit a tapered rubber plug into it and put another plug in the other line. Start the vacuum pump and pull it down to 28" of vacuum. Now watch the gauge. I usually walk away from the vehicle for 15 minutes or so and come back... if it is still at 28", tap the gauge to see if it is stuck and if it stays you have found the leak. If not, continue the process by disconnecting and plugging. Yeah it is a pain but after it is done you can now work on your buddies AC systems. Short of an obvious leak elsewhere, it always seems to be the seal at the compressor shaft that leaks.
    Harbour Freight has a "green" O ring kit for a few dollars and I have had limited success with that kit having the correct size of o-ring...The dealer does but not always in stock.
    One last thing, some line sets use a quick connect type of fitting and over the years vibration from use can cause the 2 aluminum lines to wear where they slide into each other. If you are fighting a small leak and it is in this line set, you have to replace the components. There is only so much of a "working range" that the o-ring can seal... some of the pressures exceed 300 psi depending on how hot it is outside.
     
  18. Apr 12, 2017 at 3:07 PM
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    abeastman

    abeastman [OP] Member

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    You guys are awesome. I am taking it to a really great local indy tomorrow to see what he thinks.

    The dealer did run a dye-test and identified the leak as the condenser line coming out of the hood.

    They said they couldn't tell if it had additional leaks further in, because the leak in the hood was so big.

    However, the seller said it stopped suddenly so I am hoping that line rupture was the main cause and I can replace and be on my way.

    I am a big DIY guy on my P-car (997 carrera S), but on my daily I like to have it done professionally and quickly. I intend to invest the least amount of money realistic/possible into this truck. (I actually kind of like it beat up as it brings back nostalgic thoughts of my old Hilux I drove in afghanistan.)
     
  19. Apr 12, 2017 at 4:38 PM
    #19
    Failure2Comply

    Failure2Comply Old HVACR Tech

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    First off any a/c tech can tell if it is a refrigerant issue, or a faulty pressure switch. Also, if there is refrigerant in the system they can jump out the pressure switch to test the clutch and see if the compressor is pumping. If it is out of refrigerant they can do a nitrogen leak check with a trace amount of R-134a and use a good electronic leak detector to locate the leak. Even if it is in the "Evaporator" behind the dash the leak detector can pick it up from the vents after a few minutes under pressure, but a better place is to "sniff" the drain hose, as refrigerant is heavier than air. Find a local shop with a good BBB rating.
     
  20. Apr 12, 2017 at 4:43 PM
    #20
    abeastman

    abeastman [OP] Member

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    Well, dealer robbed me then but I half expected that.
     

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