Enough Already! Your Truck's T, HP and RPM Explained

melikeymy beer · Oct 25, 2018

melikeymy beer · Oct 25, 2018

Dkurtz42 said: ↑

I don’t think anyone is offended. Sides just arguing their position.
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So cretin is an affectionate name? I understand now.

Dkurtz42 · Oct 25, 2018

melikeymy beer said: ↑

So cretin is an affectionate name? I understand now.
Click to expand...

Lol. I’ll have to search for
Cretin. I guess I didn’t read that closely!

Scott W · Oct 25, 2018

hiPSI[OP] initial post: ↑

I don't know how many threads are here that start with "My truck is slow" or "My truck has no power" or, my favorite, "My truck shifts too much!"

Let me explain.

Your truck has plenty of horsepower. 278 to be exact.
Your truck has plenty of torque too. 265 lb. ft of it.

So why do so many think the above figures are not enough? I mean, it takes around 7.5 seconds to go 0-60 and that's in line with other vehicles with close to the same weight. What's wrong?
I'm pretty sure it's the last variable, the elusive RPM. Can't see it, can't smell it, but you sure can hear it!
Let's talk relationships. No, not that kind, mathematical relationships! You see, a lot of things in life can be shown through math. Let's go:

Horsepower Formula
HP= (T*RPM)/5252 yes, it is that simple. 5252 is a constant derived from a... never mind but time is involved.
So, if that is the Horsepower formula, the Torque formula is, with a little Algebra:
T= (HP*5252)/RPM

So now that we have those out of the way, let's see how they apply to our trucks and why our trucks have no power, shift all the time and are just generally big piles of dogsh... Anyway, we need both Torque (gets you going, pulls things up hills, etc) and Horsepower (keeps you going, since it is a function of Torque and RPM)

Here's a fun 3.5L fact:
Maximum Torque is attained at 4600 RPM
Maximum HP is attained at 6000 RPM (!)

Fun 2.7L Fact:
Maximum Torque is attained at 3800 RPM
Maximum HP is attained at 5200 RPM

Do any of you see any RPM above that is less than 3800? No? That means that YOU ARE GONNA HAVE TO REV THAT ENGINE UP TO AT LEAST 3800 RPM TO EVER SEE ANY MAXIMUM OUTPUT. Seriously. And for the V6 you need 4600 RPM to feel the good stuff!

(Another Fun Fact: Torque and Horsepower will always be the same numerical value at 5252 RPM. Cool right?)

Bottom line, TLDR, etc,
You have to push the pedal down with this engine. Newsflash: You had to push the pedal down on the 2nd Gen Tacoma too. Seriously.
This engine is designed to run at higher RPM's. It will run fine, It will last. Yes, with the automatics it will shift... a lot. It will shift because you are expecting more torque yet you are keeping the engine at the same power output (cruise control is a fine example) so your truck takes matters into its own hands and shifts for you. It will shift when going up hills because you are trying to maintain a speed (Horsepower) but it needs more torque to keep that same speed so it again, shifts for you.

People will argue that its just programmed wrong. Programmed for efficiency they say. Well, of course it is. That's what most people want out of a vehicle and it comes at the expense of a bit of what some call "drivability." Yes it shifts a lot but it does so to improve mpgs. Want to improve the shifting a bit? OV Tune has a thing that will change the shift points and changes the power around a bit. Some people are just fine with their truck the way it is. Some people just bought the wrong vehicle to start with... should have bought a race car or something.
Personally, I think that most (not all but most, especially with the new models) people who are dissatisfied have came from a vehicle that was a lot different than this truck. I came from a 4Runner with the 4.0. You had to push that pedal down too. This truck is similar to the 4Runner. But this truck is not a BMW. Or an Audi. Or a 7.11L Power Stroke Diesel. Or a Miata, or a Surburban, or a Civic. It's a Tacoma.
Click to expand...

Very well said. Everything stated in your post is so true. I for certain can feel my PRO totally go into a whole nothing state of "performance" as soon as it hits about 4200-4600 RPM from a pretty good acceleration. You gotta "wind it up". I just wish it preformed like that from a start. The Sprint Booster I installed does help by changing the throttle input from the ETC to the PCM. Thanks for the post

Dkurtz42 · Oct 25, 2018

motogeek said: ↑

Agree with the too many post about this subject but the MOD should just PM the person the existing links in the forum and remove it. This forum is getting huge. In general TW doesn;t get enough props.
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Remove it? There will be nothing to talk about. There’s is only like 6 3rd gen topics.

1. Crappy trans/underpowered
2. My mpg sucks
3. What lift?
4. What tires?
5. Seats are uncomfortable.
6. Stock radio sucks.

Ah yeah. And one about cilantro I was loving yesterday. Don’t kill our creativity with which to beat the above topics into the ground. OP added data and math. All NEW content.

dynamicweight · Oct 25, 2018

melikeymy beer said: ↑

So cretin is an affectionate name? I understand now.
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I thought using such an outdated insult would lend a tongue in cheek playfullness to the insult. I assure you, I have quite a fond affection for each and every one of you.

Dkurtz42 · Oct 25, 2018

dynamicweight said: ↑

I thought using such an outdated insult would lend a tongue in cheek playfullness to the insult. I assure you, I have quite a fond affection for each and every one of you.
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I feel the same way about the guy whose wife makes him pee sitting down so he can’t piss in the wind.

melikeymy beer · Oct 25, 2018

But what is a "subtle" cretin? The opposite of an obnoxious cretin? Asking for a friend

cre·tin
/ˈkrētn/
noun

1.
INFORMAL•OFFENSIVE
a stupid person (used as a general term of abuse).

txst · Oct 25, 2018

Tacoaric said: ↑

I don’t think it’s the engine. It’s the transmission.
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No - it's the engine. I have a manual and the latest ECU update, and it still hesitates when accelerating below 2000rpms or so. As others have mentioned, it felt better immediately after the update, but after 2000+miles, it feels the same as the old tune, but it does shift smoother.
I am an engineer who has raced just about everything. I used to own an S2000 that had peak torque of 152 ft-lbs at 7200rpms and also have a Corvette Z06 that has torque everywhere, so I can adapt my driving style to just about anything. My wife has a 6-speed 2016 Accord Coupe. I have two V4 powered motorcycles and raced 2-stroke dirt bikes. I'm not bragging, but the tune of this engine from a company like Toyota is the worst of anything I have driven, including carburated cars.
Don't get me wrong, I would buy my Tacoma again, as it meets my needs and is one of the few trucks you can get with a manual transmission. But, there is no comparison of this engine to the smoothness of the 4.0L engine in my 2003 4Runner, or any of the other engines I have mentioned. And the fuel mileage above 75mph is disappointing.

Tacoaric · Oct 25, 2018

txst said: ↑

No - it's the engine. I have a manual and the latest ECU update, and it still hesitates when accelerating below 2000rpms or so. As others have mentioned, it felt better immediately after the update, but after 2000+miles, it feels the same as the old tune, but it does shift smoother.
I am an engineer who has raced just about everything. I used to own an S2000 that had peak torque of 152 ft-lbs at 7200rpms and also have a Corvette Z06 that has torque everywhere, so I can adapt my driving style to just about anything. My wife has a 6-speed 2016 Accord Coupe. I have two V4 powered motorcycles and raced 2-stroke dirt bikes. I'm not bragging, but the tune of this engine from a company like Toyota is the worst of anything I have driven, including carburated cars.
Don't get me wrong, I would buy my Tacoma again, as it meets my needs and is one of the few trucks you can get with a manual transmission. But, there is no comparison of this engine to the smoothness of the 4.0L engine in my 2003 4Runner, or any of the other engines I have mentioned. And the fuel mileage above 75mph is disappointing.
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Isn’t that just the nature of the Atkinson’s cycle?

Clearly I’m the wrong person to ask. I hated my truck from the second the newness wore off... peep my signature, I wouldn’t buy one again. Lol.

Dkurtz42 · Oct 25, 2018

txst said: ↑

No - it's the engine. I have a manual and the latest ECU update, and it still hesitates when accelerating below 2000rpms or so. As others have mentioned, it felt better immediately after the update, but after 2000+miles, it feels the same as the old tune, but it does shift smoother.
I am an engineer who has raced just about everything. I used to own an S2000 that had peak torque of 152 ft-lbs at 7200rpms and also have a Corvette Z06 that has torque everywhere, so I can adapt my driving style to just about anything. My wife has a 6-speed 2016 Accord Coupe. I have two V4 powered motorcycles and raced 2-stroke dirt bikes. I'm not bragging, but the tune of this engine from a company like Toyota is the worst of anything I have driven, including carburated cars.
Don't get me wrong, I would buy my Tacoma again, as it meets my needs and is one of the few trucks you can get with a manual transmission. But, there is no comparison of this engine to the smoothness of the 4.0L engine in my 2003 4Runner, or any of the other engines I have mentioned. And the fuel mileage above 75mph is disappointing.
Click to expand...

This post is better than OP. I want to try.

I owned a 1985 chevette. I “raced” my friend who had a grand am and he won. It could carry 150 lbs of my fat high school girlfriend. My current wife drives an Armada and she lets me drive whenever we go somewhere together. She makes excellent stew.
Not bragging, but now that my qualifications are clear. I like my Tacoma and think it drives nice. However there is no comparison in color to the black ford ranger I owned in 2003.

hiPSI · Oct 25, 2018

txst said: ↑

No - it's the engine. I have a manual and the latest ECU update, and it still hesitates when accelerating below 2000rpms or so. As others have mentioned, it felt better immediately after the update, but after 2000+miles, it feels the same as the old tune, but it does shift smoother.
I am an engineer who has raced just about everything. I used to own an S2000 that had peak torque of 152 ft-lbs at 7200rpms and also have a Corvette Z06 that has torque everywhere, so I can adapt my driving style to just about anything. My wife has a 6-speed 2016 Accord Coupe. I have two V4 powered motorcycles and raced 2-stroke dirt bikes. I'm not bragging, but the tune of this engine from a company like Toyota is the worst of anything I have driven, including carburated cars.
Don't get me wrong, I would buy my Tacoma again, as it meets my needs and is one of the few trucks you can get with a manual transmission. But, there is no comparison of this engine to the smoothness of the 4.0L engine in my 2003 4Runner, or any of the other engines I have mentioned. And the fuel mileage above 75mph is disappointing.
Click to expand...

As an engineer you should understand why your fuel mileage sucks at 75 mph. If not, read the link in my signature.
And yes, you are bragging.

US Marine · Oct 25, 2018

Everyone has Hot Rodding in their DNA so why not look at ways to increase hp and tq #'s from the 3rd Gen !!! . If it's easy for newer Corvette C7 owners to get 700 rwhp and Mustang owners getting the same #'s Then why can't you guys do the same but at lower rwhp #'s

I know there's ways to make hp easily and the best place to do this is in the cyl heads by porting and blending the runners and valve pockets . Also porting the throttle body and intake can pick up good #'s

Basically an engine is a gas powered air pump , if you can get the air in and back out quicker and more efficiently you will pick up hp and tq

melikeymy beer · Oct 25, 2018

So OP can we change the laws of mathematics to make our trucks less dogshitty? Like maybe adding a cup of kitty litter to each tank of gas? Sorry if this is a stupid question but mathing was always hard for me.

hiPSI · Oct 25, 2018

melikeymy beer said: ↑

So OP can we change the laws of mathematics to make our trucks less dogshitty? Like maybe adding a cup of kitty litter to each tank of gas? Sorry if this is a stupid question but mathing was always hard for me.
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Just use the FOIL method. Works every time.

Dkurtz42 · Oct 25, 2018

melikeymy beer said: ↑

So OP can we change the laws of mathematics to make our trucks less dogshitty? Like maybe adding a cup of kitty litter to each tank of gas? Sorry if this is a stupid question but mathing was always hard for me.
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You mention dogs and kitty’s and your pic is of a gopher. You like a PETA mod on TW or something?

GOTSAND?18 · Oct 25, 2018

I dint buy the truck to go 0-60 … I bought it to take me places where most vehicles can't go .

boynoyce · Oct 25, 2018

melikeymy beer said: ↑

So OP can we change the laws of mathematics to make our trucks less dogshitty? Like maybe adding a cup of kitty litter to each tank of gas? Sorry if this is a stupid question but mathing was always hard for me.
Click to expand...

Simple.....E=mc3rdGen....boom!

Well, that's Physics, but should be close enough for the laws of TW....lol

2004TacomaSR5 · Oct 25, 2018

My 190hp 220lb/ft torque V6 first gen is more than enough to keep a smile on my face. But, I also have a 400hp Mustang sitting in the garage when I want to be greedy! Lol

Tacoma2020 · Oct 25, 2018

2004TacomaSR5 said: ↑

My 190hp 220lb/ft torque V6 first gen is more than enough to keep a smile on my face. But, I also have a 400hp Mustang sitting in the garage when I want to be greedy! Lol
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How fast does the stang do 0-60?

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Enough Already! Your Truck's T, HP and RPM Explained

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