AdventureTaco - turbodb's build and adventures

Best bet is to mule a roof rack full of wood around the country and then dump it at a strangers house 1000 miles from home @Night Eagle

 

I mean, any good fire has minimal smoke. But yeah, as long as I can stay out of it, I'm .

I mean sure there are places with no wood, but those just need a little planning ahead. We did just fine on the last trip, even on nights where we didn't find dead wood in camp.

 

It wasnt a stranger's house. It was a client of Brett's. Also we only ditched it because it would fit in the garage.

 

I mean all the spots I went to this summer. Goose, Pryor's, big horns at Moran, was either picked clean. Dry rotted. Or non existent. Down there is a shit load more fuel for sure.

Not that it's impossible. We found some at Moran but it took some finding.

I personally think you're all just a bunch a pansy's. I was fine a sweatshirt most that trip

 

Heat is maybe 3rd priority for what I am looking for in a fire personally. I’ve been cooking almost every (dinner) meal since I got my EAF grill on the fire, and you need a pretty good amount of wood to get a good coal bed right off the bat. The social aspect is number two. We were having raging fires around the Grand Canyon last year when it was still 90 degrees out at midnight. Nothing like sitting around a fire shirtless sweating your nuts off.

 

Social in #1 for me. Maybe cooking 2. Heat...eh. I dont' care. Its awesome to have. But I don't need it.

 

So buying wood that was cut elsewhere, then processed, packaged, shipped, etc is a better solution? Or are you saying no campfires?

Eventually you're right, and there will be no dead trees to cut down at (popular) campsites, but for now, I'll continue to make use of the resources available.

 

Yeah the key is standing dead trees only. I don't think anyone here would cut down a live tree for that. Plus it would burn like shit.

 

Yeah I can relate to that.

But these guys are only cutting standing dead trees or downed dead fall. Which is fine by me. Doing the area a favor really by doing that.

 

Should be fun. Really what we should do is have you use my file dohicky. Then, you'll just buy one of those .

You haven't been looking around enough as you've driven through. There's tons of beetle and fire kill and in all the western states and western Canada. Idaho (the forest part) is no exception . It's a result of our national forest mismanagement plan™️. (And the reason much of California is without power.)

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Even if one night's site doesn't have any dead fallen/standing (rare, but did happen in CO even), planning ahead from the previous night will usually get you through.

Of course, there are places like the Alvord, Owyhee, Moab, etc. where there's nothing for the entire trip...or campgrounds where it clearly wouldn't work...or national parks where we can only burn fossil fuel fires - but that's not what we're talking about here.

I think it's more than just availability of dead trees - it's also about population in the immediate area. In campgrounds, National Parks, etc., I think no cutting is a good rule - b/c most of the people who visit those places shouldn't be cutting. Of course, generally, those areas are thinned for liability reasons.



One of the things I wonder about more and more (largely as a result of trip reports) is actually the safety aspect. Lots of keyboard commandos and first time campers read these reports. If they see people (like us) cutting down trees, they will assume it's easy and might try it themselves. That could be a bad thing. I know I had plenty of experienced supervision for the first hundred or more trees I felled (on private property, to build a house), and even so I'm still constantly aware of the danger - something that's hard to convey in writing a report.

 

eh. That's always going to happen. Shit doing some of the just "normal" stuff and not being prepared correctly is just a dangerous. Defeats the point of doing the report if you think in those terms.

 

It's like you're trying to convince me to keep writing reports, as if that part was going to change.

But we already edit the things that end up in the report from a day. So, the source of firewood could be one of those things.

 

You edit I don't tend to filter that shit out. Mistakes are important to show. We aren't perfect. And we learn from it. Life isn't perfect and certainly our trips are never perfect.

Besides, I think when the shit hits the fan or something doesn't go right(which always happens) is the best part. Not just a story but its the core of any memory of any trip. You always remember the suck more than the good. For me having a deep memory of the suck keeps the memory of the good all the more alive.


Not that im about to disclose every conversation we have all the time hahaha no one wants to read that shit.

 

You edit just as much as I do; we just edit different things sometimes. But not usually . I don't think I've ever edited out any suckage.

This is "edited." That bypass unfortunately got destroyed. (Note, I'm not trying to call you out - I edited there too. Just saying, that's how stories go.)

And damn, this just reminds me that it's been too long since we've ALL been on a trip together.

 

I don't think of it as being political. I mean, I guess it sort of could be b/c the forest policies are those of politicians, but politicians the country wide have made the same decisions (at all levels for all of our forests) so then it just becomes societal to me.

For years our (US at least) society has favored the "fight/don't allow the fires" mentality. Some of that (I think) was naivety. Will be interesting to see if it changes in the future - esp. as more and competing forces colide - more civilization creeping out into the woods vs. things like CA fires/PG&E power outages happen...

 

Hancock is the first one that comes to mind. Similarly close to "Fight Club ". We steal the fat they paid to get removed, then sell that fat back to them at 2x$ in a different packaging. Called soap.

Thinning and cutting blow down is positive, its less fuel for the dry lighting. Or do nothing like Washington, and they wonder why the whole state burns in 1 summer.

 

Redhead Down #8: Exploring the Champion Mill
September 23, 2019.

Having gone to bed late, and camped at the bottom of a valley between two, 13,000' peaks that kept the sun from hitting camp, everyone was up relatively late the next morning.

Mostly.

I just happened to wake up and look out the tent door when the sun was in that special place below the horizon and lucked out capturing what I think was probably the best - or at least most colorful - sunrise of the trip!

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But I was then back in the tent for another couple hours, doing my darnedest to keep warm as the cloud cover thickened. Eventually of course, we were all up and about - the day's journey awaiting our departure. It was at this point - as Monte was wondering how long it'd take him to make it back up the trail through Birdseye Gulch - that Brett informed us that, and then chuckled, "We don't need to go back up. Wait, you guys didn't realize that we're continuing down?"

Uh, nope. We're not from around here, Brett! ::

Happy to hear that our route out may not take a couple of hours, we decided it was high time for a morning break from wheeling.

No, that doesn't make sense, we hadn't done any wheeling yet. Regardless, someone had found a frisbee plastered with stickers from the in the nearby creek and we proceeded to have a great time tossing it around for a good half hour or so before stashing where it belonged - it in a Trasharoo.

Eventually we all piled into our trucks and continued down the trail we'd started the evening before, the rocks and flexy sections just as frequent as they'd been on the way down.

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As we descended toward CO-91 and ultimately Leadville, we crossed numerous streams that showed just how cold it'd gotten the night before - because it's not a balmy 32°F morning that results in 5" long icicles!

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And then, we crossed something that we've never - to my recollection - crossed in the wild before: train tracks. I mean, we cross these all the time on paved roads, and we see old abandoned mine rail lines all the time. But to run into an active rail out here in the middle of nowhere - it was a little surreal, and we waited around for a few minutes to see if we could get lucky and see a train. (Nope.)

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From there, the dirt road down to the CO-91 highway got remarkably better. There were still a few water crossings and slower sections, but all-in-all, we were definitely back in Subaru territory. And once we hit the highway, it was a short jaunt into Leadville.

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There's no better description of Leadville than that carved into the sign at the edge of town, so rather than paraphrase, I'll just include it here:

As we drove through the town itself, it's quaint main street reminded me of the town of Wallace, Idaho, the buildings old, but in remarkable condition.

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Still with plenty of fuel, we didn't even stop as we passed through town - our eyes set on a destination that we'd been waiting several days to enjoy: the Champion Mine and Mill. And it was up at the top of this mountain. :biggrin:

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Soon off pavement, we headed up the trail - the forest here completely void of any undergrowth. I commented on this fact over the CB radio, and Brett came back to say that so many people camped here as they staged to climb a 14er, that they essentially trampled anything shorter than 30 ft tall.

Well, that was a bit of a bummer, but looking back now I realize that despite the heavy traffic, there wasn't hardly a piece of trash in sight - so at least that's a reasonably good thing!

The further we got from town, the more rustic the trail became, avalanche shoots showing themselves as scars on the mountainsides, reasonably deep water-crossings serving as gatekeepers for the remainder of the trail...and a car wash for our amazing wheels.

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Soon enough, we were once again making our way up and out of the treeline, our trucks and their drivers breathing in the cool, clear mountain air.

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As we got closer to the mill, Brett let us know that there'd recently been a bit of controversy over whether or not it was OK to drive up to the mill itself. Apparently the road was gated and - logically - the Forest Service said that if the gate was open, it was fine to drive up; otherwise, the road should be considered closed to motor vehicles.

We all hoped we'd find the gate open. Predictably, it was closed. Undeterred, we parked our trucks and set off on foot.

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The Champion Mine was developed in 1907 when the Mount Champion Mining Company purchased the property and started construction mill capable of processing 50-tons per day and a 6,100 ft. long tramline - the first to pass over the crest of a ridge with an altitude over 13,600 ft at its highest point. Tram towers were constructed of wood and varied in height and design to follow the curvature of the cable strung between them. Electricity brought from Leadville powered the tram, which was equipped with forty-two buckets - each weighing 600 lbs and capable of holding nine cubic feet of ore which was shipped directly to the smelters in Leadville.

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Significant production started in 1912 and continued until 1918 when the cost of shipping ore to Leadville smelters proved to be unprofitable. Today, the mill still stands tall, though long tough winters have obviously taken their toll. Clearly though, some renovation and preservation work has taken place recently - large steel cables and a few new wooden beams now helping to stabilize the leaning structure.

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As we approached, the first thing we ran into was obviously a bit newer than the majority of the mill. And our friend Brett - always looking to beef up his truck - was intrigued by the size of the rear diff.

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How can I fit this under the back of a Tacoma?​

And then, we were to the mill itself. Still full of much of the original machinery, we took our time exploring this historic mining time capsule. It's boiler, and much of the other equipment all stamped with the same manufacturers as those we'd seen at the Pennsylvania Mine.

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Tumblers, funnels, and all means of other machinery lay dormant as well. The work to get this stuff in place back in the early 1900's must have been enormous! And as a woodworker, the big wooden flywheel was especially intriguing.

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In our exploration, we also - perhaps expectedly - found bits of ore just about everywhere. Surely it was worthless, but we couldn't help but snap a photo of the shiny material.

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It took an hour, but we eventually got our fill of the mill and headed back down to the trucks where Mike - who'd been feeling a bit under the weather - had been patiently waiting. After filling him in on what we'd seen, and presenting him with a couple bits of ore, it was time to continue our ascent up the mountain.

An astute reader may ask, "But how, didn't you say the road was closed?" To that reader, I'd say, "Thanks for paying attention, not many people actually read the text of a trip report!" Luckily for us however, the road to the mill was a fork off of the road that continued to the top of Mt. Champion, meaning that we were free to continue on, climbing up above the mill - the view down, dramatic in its own right.

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Just as the trail had some gatekeepers obstacles near the bottom, so too were there some larger gatekeepers before we could proceed much further towards the top. Several of these offered easier and harder lines, our approach summarized nicely by this meme:

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And up we went.

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About this time we were all getting hungry and so before reaching the very top - where we were unsure what the wind situation would be - we stopped in a small saddle and pulled out our camp chairs. It was quite pleasant here - except for the smell of diff oil that'd burped up through my front diff breather - and we all enjoyed our sandwiches, chips, and some miscellaneous fruit in good company and among the clouds.

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Why does diff oil smell so damn bad?!​

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It was 2:30pm in the afternoon when we made our final ascent to the top and found ourselves with yet another view to die for.

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A view that we just kept trying to get a wider and wider shot of. It was spectacular, really.

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With plenty to explore here on the top of the hill, we set off to explore on foot. Old buildings - likely bunk houses for the miners who would enter shafts on the side of the mountain to dig ore - still stood, though they'd clearly seen better days. Small sheds that covered what used to be mine shaft entrances looked as though they were only a few winters from falling down. And scattered about, detritus from the miners - several different variants of purple glass, remnants of the old tram line. It was an explorers gold mine.

Literally.

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And all this time, the view around and below us continued to impress. In the distance - and far below us at 12,095 ft - Independence Pass, the second highest (paved) pass in Colorado.

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Eventually - as always seems to be the case - we had to pull ourselves away. We'd explored all we could in the time we had, though there always seemed to be something to come back for. For now though, we knew that if we were going to find camp before dark, we needed to skedaddle our way back down the mountain, and that's just what we did. Mostly. I mean, sure, there were a few stops for photos of the sole tram tower standing valiantly on the ridge.

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Down always seems to go faster than up, and we were soon retracing our steps through the last of the water crossings and onto the highway. With several miles of pavement before camp, we'd aired up and so at this point were making good time as we raced the afternoon sun. A quick stop in Buena Vista, CO, for fuel and we continued up and over the newly paved Cottonwood Pass - the only paved pass higher (by 21 ft) than Independence Pass that we'd looked down on just an hour earlier.

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We found camp at sunset in the Taylor Park area and were quick to find a suitable beetle kill for our - now ritual - bonfire. It'd been another amazing day in the high mountains of Colorado, and a special one at that. See, it was Brett's last day with us - his plan to leave for home after breakfast in the morning.

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That'd be a little later than usual, given our plans for one of our famous group feasts - but still, it would turn out to be the beginning of the end. A time of mixed emotions on any trip.

But that wasn't all that was in store for the coming day. By it's end, we'd be left wondering...

What the hell was that?​

 

So a topic that seems to be mostly avoided here is firearms. I know that you didn't have any when you ventured into Canada; but I don't recall you stating either way if you typically carry some form of protection in the lower 48.

Of course, if the answer is: ....then just ignore me.

But if the answer is ....what do you carry, and why that choice? I could easily see something of a .45 for the infrequent, if ever, bear encounter. 12ga for general protection, or something of the like. I don't really see you as much of an AR guy. You strike me as more of a "carry, but keep quiet about it" or a "we don't need no stinkin guns" kind of guy.

 

I've got these two guns right here with me all the time buddy.

Anyway, not sure if you're referring to just me or all the guys on these trips with the question, so I'll answer just for myself. Others can chime in - or not - as they please.

I don't carry any firearms on trips. I am not opposed to guns as a rule (I like shooting them very much - I think it's great fun), but I am also cognizant of the fact that:

(and as I write this, I realize this may be my opinion rather than general belief, so take it with that pov)

• Guns for protection from wildlife are generally unnecessary for the trips I go on, for several reasons:
  • Wildlife is generally more scared of humans.
  • I'm generally around the truck or camp, where wildlife more likely to keep its distance anyway.
  • I'm more likely to be "attacked" by a snake when I step in the wrong place or reach my hand up while climbing, or by falling off a high cliff, than I am to be attacked by a large animal.
  • I am alert/cognizant of my surroundings when hiking/walking. These things help with wildlife awareness, but also general safety (like snakes and high cliffs).
  • If there's some crazy bear charging me because I've been stupid
    • I've probably done something else seriously wrong that I shouldn't have.
    • Having the wherewithal to calmly draw and fire the gun in a way that actually protects me is - I would say - a 50-50 chance anyway. (I can only imagine the adrenaline in that situation.)
  • If there's some crazy bear or mountain lion attacking @mrs.turbodb or @mini.turbodb, I'm unlikely to want to fire at that bear anyway, for obvious reasons.

• Having guns around poses a safety risk for everyone else on the trip (the size of that risk is, I understand, debatable).

• Having guns for protection from other humans is not a good idea in my experience, for several reasons:
  • It implies that you are ready to escalate to the level that guns are required, rather than de-escalating or walking away.
  • It implies that you are ready to take another human life.
  • It implies that you have the gun with you, loaded, and accessible at all times, since another human may approach even while you are in your vehicle. (vs. for wildlife protection, where you could simply load/carry while hiking, etc.)

• I'd rather spend my time on trips
  • Not worrying about a gun at all (not just with me, but even more so for the safety of others)
  • Chatting around the campfire, rather than shooting a gun (and picking up all the trash as a result)
  • Shooting (pun intended, sorry, I know that's a bad one) photos

Anyway, I've grown up camping my whole (not short, lol) life, and I've been around plenty of bears, seen plenty of mountain lions, and I've never needed a gun. Notably of course, I'm not out looking for/hunting them, or creeping quietly through the underbrush in a way I might flush them out - if that were the case, I'd likely have different gun behavior.

Much of my family lives in what is essentially the edge of wilderness, and while guns are owned and understood to be a useful tool, I don't believe any of them have carried guns on-person when out hiking around/camping/etc. If they have, it wasn't on the thousand+ hikes/nights camping/etc I was on...so it's unlikely that they have done it at other times. So, personal experience reinforces my current behavior.

So, really, it's about trade-offs. I mean, all decisions in life are about trade-offs . In this case, it's a safety trade off. IMO, I am reasonably safe when I'm out "in the woods" - probably safer than I was when I was walking some of the city streets I frequented when I was growing up, where I was subjected to gun violence several times and lost two friends to it a block from school. And, since I want my trip entertainment to come from things other than guns... no gun necessary.

Well, except for these two bad boys.

 

I figured it was likely not your style, but figured worth asking.