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DIY 1st Gen. Rock Sliders

Discussion in '1st Gen. Tacomas (1995-2004)' started by razhick4x4, Dec 9, 2019.

  1. Dec 9, 2019 at 7:12 PM
    #1
    razhick4x4

    razhick4x4 [OP] Well-Known Member

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    hey all, i am in need of some advice. i have been in the process of fabricating some rock sliders for my truck and am almost done. the part where i am at currently is the way to attach the sliders to the frame. i have finished the sliders themselves, I just need to figure out the brackets. here are some photos of the sliders:
    IMG_2545.jpg IMG_8691.jpg
    IMG_7602.jpg

    Here is my current idea: i will attach the sliders via three attachment points using pre-existing holes in the frame. i'm planning on using a 1/2" grade 5 bolt and washers on each side in order to attach the sliders. there will be 1 bolt per bracket and the bolts will be sleeved to prevent crushing the frame. here are some photos of the brackets via Sketch-up.
    IMG_6492.jpg IMG_4194.jpg

    my primary question is what do you guys think of this setup? I don't use my truck as a rock crawler, more as a camping/hunting/overlanding rig. sometimes i take it up minor obstacles but for the most part it stays on pretty minor trails. my reasons for wanting sliders are primarily logs sticking out into trails (i've had a couple of close calls and want some more protection), light duty rocker panel protection, as a jacking point, as a step, and (lets be honest here :D:p) looks. i think that the bracket design will stand up to this considering that the truck really never is in danger of getting full-on, dynamic-load, dropped on the sliders and the sleeve-like design of the brackets should take most of the force for jacking and minor stuff. in theory the bolts will only get used as retaining pins and only support weight when the sliders get used as side-steps. i figure that the three bolts should be plenty skookum for that:).

    so what do y'all think? I know that they wont be the strongest sliders out there but will they work?
     
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  2. Dec 9, 2019 at 7:14 PM
    #2
    Kwikvette

    Kwikvette Chief Executive Officer at Kwik Fab

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    @GHOST SHIP

    If I recall, when he made mine, he made plates to maximize surface area contact, and gussets to strengthen the legs; stupid strong as I've already tested my sliders...intentionally :anonymous:
     
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  3. Dec 9, 2019 at 7:32 PM
    #3
    razhick4x4

    razhick4x4 [OP] Well-Known Member

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    do you happen to have photos of yours? if nothing else i'm hoping to make this a photo heavy thread for those seeking info as i was unable to find much helpful info on first gen. sliders when i was researching.
     
  4. Dec 9, 2019 at 7:36 PM
    #4
    GHOST SHIP

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    I have a couple notes but take them with a grain of salt:

    the bracket design should be enough to bolt them on as you stated. Use them as side steps, minor protection/deflection sure, but I question how strong they’d be as a jack point. Remember that if you’re jacking the truck, you’re more than likely going to be working near or under the truck so your own safety is directly related to how well you build the sliders.
    Secondly, drilling the frame and adding a crush sleeve is a great idea, but adding that to making the brackets to bolt them on seems like a helluvalotta work compared to just welding them straight to the frame (which incidentally would also address my first concern).
    From your work so far it seems you have the skills and ability to just zap ‘em on rather than jump through hoops to design something that’s considerable more work and lighter duty.

    Just my opinion.
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2019
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  5. Dec 9, 2019 at 7:42 PM
    #5
    GHOST SHIP

    GHOST SHIP hates you.

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    This is a rough sketch of the frame plates I made for your sliders. The plates are 3/16” plate and overall 4x4”. The angle cut into the upper corner allows for better access to welding the upper portion (it’s a little hard to get to that top section with your wire squirter). Then it’s a small angle gusset at the top of the frame plate which you’ll want to set near the side of the support leg. If you weld it dead center, it could collapse the tube if ever put under load- welding it off-centered placed it in a stronger section of the tube.


    DE0E36CB-3C0F-454B-AC6A-A0CE776747A0.jpg
     
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  6. Dec 9, 2019 at 7:45 PM
    #6
    razhick4x4

    razhick4x4 [OP] Well-Known Member

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    I thought about that, but I am worried by the possibility of compromising the frame by welding on it. perhaps I am being over cautious but I'd rather play it safe than sorry. if i can get away without drilling or welding the frame by picking up existing holes then i'd prefer to do that. As for jacking it'd be for quickly changing tires and more of a last resort thing than anything else. I never really get under the truck when i can help it, even with it on jack stands, so I'm not too too worried about that. as a side note, do you think that the strength gain'd be worth the effort as far as adding gussets. i've toyed with the idea but it seems like a lot of work for a relatively light duty application anyways.
     
  7. Dec 9, 2019 at 7:46 PM
    #7
    razhick4x4

    razhick4x4 [OP] Well-Known Member

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    many thanks for putting that up. gave me a lot of good ideas as far as gussets.
     
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  8. Dec 9, 2019 at 7:49 PM
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    GHOST SHIP

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    Making that frame plate and the gusset seems like a lot less work than making the bolt on brackets. FWIW, in my experience, I use three support legs on most cab/bed configurations but will use 4 on longer trucks when I weld them to the frame. They’re plenty strong and it’s common practice but I hear your concerns about using existing holes vs welding them on. Your truck, your application, your choice. I was just stating my opinion based on my experience.
     
  9. Dec 9, 2019 at 8:17 PM
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    cruiserguy

    cruiserguy Well-Known Member

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    That's the type of attention to details that I understandably and happily pay good dinero for:cool:
     
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  10. Jan 10, 2020 at 10:29 AM
    #10
    razhick4x4

    razhick4x4 [OP] Well-Known Member

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    just an update, i finally got the front two brackets pretty much done done. it's basically a clamp for the frame since there aren't any holes to pick up in the front. pretty happy with the result. have not test fitted them yet but i'm 99% sure they will fit. i basically just modified my old brackets to clamp instead of bolt on using holes. still need to gusset them but they're most of the way there. the driver's side backing plate has those two spacer blocks in there to allow for the fuel lines. don't want to be crushing those:D, that'd be a bad day.

    upload_2020-1-10_10-27-19.jpg

    upload_2020-1-10_10-28-10.jpg

    upload_2020-1-10_10-28-31.jpg
     

    Attached Files:

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  11. Jan 10, 2020 at 11:20 AM
    #11
    pray4surf

    pray4surf Well-Known Member

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    So.. bolts at top and bottom?
    CBI used to sell bolt-on brackets akin to those shown in this ad
    https://tacomabeast.com/products/1st-gen-tacoma-rock-sliders-bolt-on?variant=15399500709990

    Just two bolts across the top of Frame (plus an additional/optional/ self-tapping bolt in the bottom).

    I don't see just the bolt-on adapters on their website any longer

    Nice work! I understand the feeling you get from creating something of your own.. (plus the $ savings - LOL)
     
  12. Jan 10, 2020 at 1:08 PM
    #12
    razhick4x4

    razhick4x4 [OP] Well-Known Member

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    yeah, two bolts on top and two on the bottom. that's only for the front though because the rear two have holes in the frame for the brackets to pick up. the pics in the first post show what those'll look like. they're in the works right now, i'll throw up some pics when i'm done. i've heard about the CBI brackets and read about them on some forums but i haven't seen any pics. otherwise i would've tried to build a pair of those. it has been kind of a fun ride though. it has been kind of a fun ride though on building these. these are like bracket ver. 3.5. i'm both glad to have something to do and ready to get this project over with. developing a bracket that isn't like anything else i've seen has been kind of cool though. really gives a sense of accomplishment.
     
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  13. Jan 10, 2020 at 8:18 PM
    #13
    jbrandt

    jbrandt Made you look

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    Just weld them to the frame. Those brackets look like they’ll hang down and get caught up on rocks n stuff.

    Just get some 1/4” plate about 4”x4”, make 8 of them. Then space them evenly along the sliders, the front and rear ones maybe 8”ish from the ends. Figure out how far out you want the sliders to stick out, and cut your tubes accordingly, then line everyling up and tack the tubes to the sliders and the plates. Do NOT weld the plate to the frame yet.

    Once everything is placed and tacked, take it all off and finish welding. Last thing you do is weld the plates to the frame.

    You can’t see in the pics, but there’s also some ~1.5” triangle gussets from 5e tubes to the plate (on top).

    The way mine worked out is the bottom of the tubes are nearly flush with the bottom of the frame.

     
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  14. Jan 10, 2020 at 9:44 PM
    #14
    razhick4x4

    razhick4x4 [OP] Well-Known Member

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    i've seriously considered weld-on construction but after a lot of thought, i've decided to stick with bolt-on. i'm trying to avoid welding to the frame if at all possible. main reason being, additionally to what i already mentioned earlier in the thread, i'm working out of a school shop and my welding teacher has nixed any and all welding on vehicle frames.

    the ground clearance is a good point though and i hadn't considered it before, so let's do some math here:

    the slider brackets are made out of 1/4" Mild Steel Plate. the extra parts that will hold the bolts are 1" by 1/4" Mild Steel Flat bar.

    so adding those two together that means that the brackets will hang down 1 1/4" from the frame. so yes, some ground clearance will be lost but it's not very much at all, or at least, i wouldn't imagine that 1.25" will make that much of a difference.

    Here are the other things that factored into my decision to go with bolt on: 1) the location of the forward-most brackets in relation to the front wheels, and 2) what i'll use the sliders for.

    1) since the brackets that'll use that clamping system will only be the front ones, they wont have as much opportunity to get hung up. generally when you get high centered (at least in my experience), it's closer to the middle of the truck which will mean the middle bracket; the middle and rear brackets won't have that method of attachment.

    2) i really don't do a whole lot, if any, hardcore off-roading. these sliders will see three main uses: Light duty deflection (like trees/logs and side scrapes from boulders), glorified side-steps, and, lets be honest here:p, looks:D;). the majority of my trips involve travel on what are basically old, un-maintained, rutted out, logging and USFS roads. not exactly rock crawling but still stuff that i need 4 wheel drive for and would prefer to have the added ground clearance that comes with a lift and tires.
    pretty much the only reason that i have for building sliders is from a couple of close calls with trees that were sticking out into the road. not entirely necessary, but for me the peace of mind is worth it.

    yeah, the bolt on construction isn't the strongest nor does it provide the best ground clearance, but the way i see it, it's a good starting point. the other thing is that since the kickers are made of 1/8" wall square tubing, i can make new ones with a miter saw pretty easily. square tube is easy to obtain, even easier to work with, and IMHO is far easier to weld than round tubing. round tube i'll need to make a jig or use a drill press. the whole design of the sliders is intended to make them easily customizable to whatever I (or someone else) want to do with them in the future. i can always weld them on later if i need to but i'd like to avoid welding on the frame for now. if nothing else, to appease my welding teacher;):thumbsup:.
     
  15. Jan 11, 2020 at 5:52 PM
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    jbrandt

    jbrandt Made you look

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    I can understand the teacher not wanting the liability of welding to frames.

    But it's not about the number of inches of ground clearance you'll loose. It's more about just having something that hangs down that will get snagged. If you'd tag the bracket, you'd more than likely tag the frame anyway, so it's more about giving the rock or log or whatever something smooth to slide off of and not get hung up. It's like the skid plate I'm building: Because I have a diff drop, that forces my skid to be slightly lower, by like 1/2" or so. While I technically have less ground clearance, I skid plate is nice and flat and smooth.

    If you're really set on bolt-on, I'd go with a U shaped bracket, with maybe 4 bolts. You won't lose any strength in the frame if you drill a couple holes for the bolts.

    Use 1/4" material, and either bend (of you have access to a brake big enough, or just weld 3 pieces together into a "U". Then you could easily taper the bottom edges if you wanted to.
     
  16. Apr 15, 2020 at 10:22 AM
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    rybern

    rybern Well-Known Member

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    Let us know how this came out. Nice start on the project. I will be installing 4xi sliders soon and was considering doing some bolt on brackets. Honestly, some of the comments here is making me think about just welding them on. But I'm very interested in what you ended up doing.
     
  17. Apr 15, 2020 at 10:47 AM
    #17
    Kwikvette

    Kwikvette Chief Executive Officer at Kwik Fab

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    He posted them for sale; they're either sitting there waiting or have already been sold.

    Went weld on for my sliders.
     
  18. Apr 16, 2020 at 6:59 PM
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    razhick4x4

    razhick4x4 [OP] Well-Known Member

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    yeah, I posted them for sale. I was going to install them but I was working out of a school shop so for obvious reasons, i wont be able to finish them. I honestly just don't have the equipment to weld them on myself or the money to pay someone to do it for me (or buy the proper equipment). Plus, I cant work right now because of this coronavirus stuff so that extra couple hundred dollars would come in handy right now (i have both the timing belt and new tires coming up). we'll see what happens tho, they havent sold yet and shipping is proving to be very cost prohibitive so unless a local buyer comes up, they may end up on the truck yet. in any event, they probably wont go on for a while.

    @rybern as far as how the brackets work though, I got to do a test fit-up before the shutdown happened and the brackets do fit. I havent had the chance to test them yet (obviously) so I cant say how much the ground clearance issue that @jbrandt brought up would come up or how strong they actually are. With that said though, they seem to be plenty strong from what i saw in the test-fit and I would trust my truck to them for a jacking point or on the trails.
     
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  19. Apr 16, 2020 at 7:13 PM
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    rybern

    rybern Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the info Alex. I can certainly understand your situation.

    Ironically, after creeping around under my truck this evening, I am planning to bolt on my sliders. LOL. Welding them on is such a commitment and I can see myself wanting to make a change to them after they are on there. If I follow through with the idea, I will post it in a new thread on how I do it.
     
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  20. Apr 25, 2020 at 12:24 AM
    #20
    razhick4x4

    razhick4x4 [OP] Well-Known Member

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    well... no bites on the sliders, and i'm getting bored after being isolated for so long... so i have decided to revisit the sliders. I practiced running a few beads today on my welder, it's an old ass Airco stick welder, which was why i was initially hesitant to do structural welds with it. but after buying some new electrodes, i'm pretty happy with the result; enough so that i'm willing to give it a shot. Turns out that 7018s run a lot better than 6011. a little bit of random porosity but i can deal with that. I lined them up on the truck today and came to the conclusion that the kickout is too much. even if i tuck the sliders way back (which wouldn't protect me from anything like trees or stuff anyways), they still look kinda goofy.

    upload_2020-4-24_23-48-37.jpg

    I do like the way that the rest of the sliders look though, which leads me to my next task: i'm going to cut the kickout section out and weld in a new section. i can find the correct tubing at the home depot so that'll be pretty easy, but then the question becomes whether to make the kickout less intense, or to eliminate it entirely. I don't have access to an effective way of bending the tubing so it'll look a little choppy (the tubing bender that i used was from my school shop) I don't have any of the correct tubing yet but i did do a mock up with some smaller square tube that i had laying around.

    upload_2020-4-25_0-0-18.jpg
    or
    upload_2020-4-25_0-2-14.jpg

    and then comes the brackets... i have been thinking about it and i think that i'm going to revisit the advice that @jbrandt gave me. I think that i'll mount them up, and then cut the bottom bolt bits off, then weld a plate on to the bottom. this should create something like CBI's system. I don't have a torch at home so i'll have to be a little bit more precise:eek:. shoudn't be a problem though:cool:. tomorrow (or later this morning i guess:p) i'll go and pick up some more tubing and some 1/4" thick flat bar. then i'll get the sliders cut up and ready to go. the only other tool I'll need is a drill press vise. Not interested in notching tubing without a secure method of holding it down. I do have Hole saws though so that's a plus. only other thing i can think of is a proper welding table but i'm not interested in spending that $70 at Harbor freight if i can avoid it.

    well that about covers it for today, anyone have any thoughts on what i should do with the kickout? if so i'll be glad to hear them.
     
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