The LED SAE J583 Fog Pod & Fog Light Review

Seems like a Justified response to me.

 

For someone who constantly complains that people don't read what he writes, you don't seem to read what anyone else writes either.

You ordered the selective yellow fog pod, then proceeded to install clear driving light lenses, and install them, and by your own admission, use them with your lowbeams with traffic.

Then you complain that you can't see very well in dust storms.

The solution has been pointed out multiple times. Maybe read what others have written directly in response to your questions. You literally just posted the picture of your solution. You have it at your disposal.

But you're just going to get pissy and scream about how nobodies helping you instead.

 

Morning fellas and ladies! Found this video on LightWerkz YouTube channel showing that the 4Banger HXB “wide” (not SAE compliant to my knowledge) is very close in PEAK intensity to the DD SS3 Max SAE Fog pattern. Both with the clear lens. One specific thing they make sure to mention is the run time. They both were running for about 15 min before the video started. @crashnburn80, I don’t know the meter LightWerkz uses but I would assume it is a decent one?

Something to note is the temperature reading on the face of the HXB is about 20F-25F higher which indicates the potential of for long term issues in my eyes considering how hot the MAX already gets. Also something else LightWerkz mentions is that it seems like the output color is different even though they use the chip. I would guess it is because Morimoto is driving the LEDS a harder to get the output to compete, not sure if that’s a factor or not but I know it is in HIDs. Something NOT noted is if the HXB is a pre-production model or the end product.

ENJOY! It’s short.

https://youtu.be/flQ3_PRx004

 

Looks like the same

$210 Extech LT300 Light Meter

Extech LT300 they've had for years. My memory says it's not accurate for LED spectrum but I could be wrong.

 

Heat is a good and bad thing for LED fogs. I like hot fogs, so that in snow they won't freeze over as that is one of the use cases of a fog light. But with LEDs, the hotter a product runs, the more output is reduced so it is somewhat of a balancing act. 10-15 minutes is not adequate time to reach stable operating temp on the Max, it will be much closer than startup but really needs closer to 25 minutes. Uncertain on the 4banger. What is interesting though is that the video shows nearly identical peak intensity (very unscientifically) between the Max and 4banger, which is not inline with TRS/HR/DLG claims for peak intensity when they claim higher output intensity than the Max. It could be that when warmed up, the smaller body of the 4banger is less efficient at cooling and therefor the higher operating temperatures take greater losses in stable operating output. Hard to say really without comparing them first hand. Too bad in the video they don't show the beams compared in an un-obstructed view. Lightwerks is using an inadequate meter for LED, it is for incandescent light sources.

It is not accurate for LED. The LT300 is a nice meter, I have one, but it is for incandescent light sources and not LED. It is way nicer than the cheap alibaba meter HR was using though.

Extech LT300 (incandescent meter) vs proper Extech LT45 LED meter measuring an LED light source.



And just to demonstrate it isn't the placement of the photo detector, I swapped their position:



This is because the standard lux meter operates on the assumption the light spectrum slope is constant between sources, because all incandescent lights have almost identical relative linear slopes. But the spectrums are completely different between LED and incandescent. A standard lux meter will sample a small number of points in the light spectrum and apply a spectral sensitivity curve fit on the assumption that the spectrum is a linear incandescent slope and use this to calculate total lux. But the LED light spectrum is very different potentially throwing off this calculation depending on where the sampling points are measured in the spectrum, and what the LED spectrum curve looks like. Margin of error might be small or it might be significant, but the point of taking a measurement is to have accurate credible data.

Measurements I've taken using a full digital spectrometer to show light source spectrum differences:



(Anything past 700nm is just IR and not factored in lux.)

You can see the spectral sensitivity spec chart from Extech for the LT300 below from the manual, and see that it the meter response is deficient in the short wavelength spectrum. If you compare that deficiency to the spectrum profile of the Morimoto XB fogs I posted earlier as a sample LED light source, you can see that that it is missing out on including a non-trivial amount of light output in the measurement from the short wavelength high amplitude spike. The LT300 is calibrated to light sources of 2800k as it is for incandescent lights, if measuring a source significantly outside of that color temperature, it will be inaccurate.



All that said! While the incandescent light source spectrum distribution is very linear and predictable, the LED spectrums vary depending on the LED emitters used. However, while the LT300 meter readings will be inaccurate, because they are measuring two products using the same emitters, which in theory would have the same output spectrum (though the video implies they might not), they in theory would be inaccurate in each reading by the same percentage thereby providing a likely reasonable relative comparison. I still don't understand how all these LED companies don't use the actual proper measurement tools to do the job, like this is what they do professionally.

 

Ask and ye shall receive:

https://youtu.be/PJFCSnjUFTE

 

Surprise! HR owned by DLG (makers of the 4banger) recommend their own product vs an outside competing one while trying to look semi-independent. I do look forward to trying these out myself for I am quite curious on actual performance, but don't put a lot of faith in their videos as they are often misleading. Lightwerks had just posted a video actually countering the output claims in the DLG content, and they have a partnership with TRS (a DLG company).

However, what seemed like a major oversight in the video, is they never explained that an ideal fog beam should be very wide, and not necessarily extremely tall. The purpose of a fog is to illuminate the shoulder/ditch with a very wide even pattern distribution in the fog pattern, and not to illuminate extra close to the front bumper with a tall pattern where it is no use to the driver in conditions where a fog is needed.

Also curious on the host change, Chris had done all the HR videos for some time.

 

My guess regarding the host change is to show less perceived bias and to make it seem like he is their "behind the scenes technical expert" giving the most accurate specs/tests. A host that gets called out but makes corrections is usually still questionable by many. Placing a different host to make "corrections" makes it look like they put in more effort and is more believable to many because it's an unknown individual but is perceived to be the expert that normally doesn't get the lime light. To the average person/enthusiast this seems way more credible and the average person that uses Google (because you can pay to be put to the top of the searches), this will seem incredibly legitimate and scientific.

Also in that video they show the specific light meter used. It is the UNI-T UN382B, which seems like the only difference from the the 381 model that you previously speculated is that it has a USB interface. Good eye Crash! Also, thank you for the great explanation and demonstration above about the the LUX meters with visual aids to help understand it better for visual learners like myself.

 

I have a set of BD wide cornering and am curious if I should leave the ARB fogs and mount these above them just to the right of the headlights or replace the ARB fogs. Unsure if the wide cornering would be ideal mounted in a fog location.

 

they work great for offroad in that location, but remember its not a real fog light, but a offroad only light. if you are looking to replace those oem arb fogs we make a bracket to put in some nice diode dynamics fogs, then you can move the wide cornering to the top of the bumper.

 

I’ve been looking at your adapter. Great idea for that location. I’m planning to build a new front bumper so I may just hold off on doing anything unless I pick up some true fogs, too. I didn’t see a squadron fog light, so I wasn’t sure if they considered the wide cornering their fog range or not. According to their diagram they have it in a separate “zone” or whatever.

 

Bajadesigns sold their wide cornering lights, *ahem* incorrectly, as street legal fog lights. Crashnburn80 showed this was absolutely not the case. BD was then forced to come up with a lens insert that resulted in compliance with fog light standards. They offer(ed?) The lens insert for people who had previously purchased theirnwide cornering lights for use on the road. However it significantly reduces the performance of the light.

 

Hang tight. They sold their squadron sport/pro/racer pod lights (with off-road patterns like wide cornering and others) with brackets that allowed them to fit in the fog light pocket and marketed them heavily. Lots of people think this makes them fog lights, though I don't think BD was explicit about this.

However, the SAE squadron was a unique product designed from the start to be a fog light (or an interpretation of one at least). It was found to be non-compliant, and the adapter plates were added to nerf the optics and bring it back to legal spec.

 

And the "fix" significantly reduced the output of the light - to the point that they're now about the lowest performing LED fog pod available.

 

I wasn’t sure if they considered them fogs or not. I was wanting something a little wider than fogs. Do you know if the wide cornering lights they sell now have the same lens insert or was it just for when they marketed it as a fog light and they’re more explicit now and don’t need it?

 

I don’t even own a Tacoma (I drive a f150 right now) but I created an account just to say thank you for all the hard work. This is such a wealth of information and made buying fog lights so much easier.

DD max yellow getting ordered this week!

 

Welcome to the site. You will not be disappointed with the selective yellow Max fogs. I have them after moving up from the Pro model and they're awesome. BTW, prior to moving to a 2014 Tacoma, I had six F-150's in a row.

 

BD never said the wide cornering lights were street legal fogs, but what they did say on the forums were that they were “street friendly” lights good as a fog, which obviously wasn’t the case with blinding everyone else on the road.

Welcome! Lots of different vehicles/makes in this thread, including many F150/Raptor owners. As a complete SAE LED assembly it doesn’t really matter what vehicle it is mounted in as the lamp functions the same regardless.

 

You're not going to find anything with a wider pattern than a fog pattern. You will find that some fog patterns are wider than others though. For instance, the Diode Dynamics SS3 fog pattern is wider than the new Morimoto 4Banger fog pattern.