Marlin Crawler's New Rock Crawling Long Travel IFS Suspension System (#RCLT)

I'm confused

 

How?

 

Yeah. I only found this thread AFTER I placed my order. I spent 6 months in total fear, reading these posts and comments, thinking I was going to lose everything on my kit and all the extras I ordered.

Speaking of extras. I can not believe the RCV "ultimate" Axles I got are already rusting and I havent even driven my truck yet.

 

where are you located?

 

In Hawaii. But the axles were wrapped up until install and everything has been in a garage. Nothing has seen the elements yet.

 

Dang. yea I was under the impression that those axles had some sort of annodizing or coating on the exposed outer joints

 

It just a normal state of mind, figured I'd share.

 

At 2 grand + per set... you'd think they would have something on them.

Although, (realistically) I wouldn't be all that concerned with a little surface rust on CVs.

 

Happens to the best of us.

 

Exactly. And in contrast my daily has a $50 set of rotors from Amazon I put on a year ago. Lives outside in the rain. No rust.

 

Def doesn't affect functionality, just not the most attractive thing especially when you spend that muhc.
My 333 LBJ's are real rusted now since I didn't paint them

 

Yeah they are for sure solid, but there is a bit of a let down when something seems blemished before even using it.

 

Marlin Czajkowski was the real deal, not this Instagram/YouTube company that goes by the name "Marlin Crawler".

Better times...

 

I’m so glad I went back to re-read the shit show and why I didn’t follow Nate’s build.

 

That's what my setup is doing. Bumped and strapped, measured from the top middle of the tire at full stuff/droop to the fender. Honestly, it might be 12.5" so I'll take more detailed measurements when I have time. I did add a piece of 3/16" plate to the LCA under the bump stop because I noticed that the delrin half-round piece at the bottom of the bump stop was flattening out. I didn't leave much room for that when I set everything up and don't want to bottom out the shock. The 12" was measured after I added that piece.

 

DUDE! I'm in SoCal and the same shit is happening. I did two days of snow wheeling and hosed everything down the night I got back. Not happy about that at all.

 

I've been rebuilding my own coilovers (and for a few friends) for years, but I've never messed with the valving. It's the shock tuning theory that I don't know enough about. What do you think is the best way for me to start figuring out what changes I need to make to the valving? Videos going over whoops at different speeds?

 

Yea, I was joking around. But cycling it without the axle would get me to 14". I tubbed my wheel wells so the uptravel limitation for me is the shock, followed by the outer TRE heim. I think that the coilover lengths could be modified bewteen the different vehicle models to maximize wheel travel for each setup. For example, my shocks have some downtravel left when the CV binds at droop, and the rest of the RCLT setup has more uptravel when the shock is fully compressed. I'm talking 1/2" to 3/4" in each direction, but still...

 

Whaaaaats up TW?! It's been one year to the day since my last post and what an amazing year it's been, the best in our 28-year history! Thank you to the tens of thousands of customers that made 2021 an incredible success. Marlin's dreams to "get respect for Toyota trucks" & "put Toyota on the map" have never been better solidified and my fledgling dream to get respect for IFS has grown exponentially as people are finally fearlessly rock crawling Toyota IFS!



Thank you to the few who have kept this thread alive. It's a sober reminder to myself that leaders of businesses our size don't need to spend every waking moment on forums to be successful.

Can't thank enough to all the orders and support for RCLT HD. Sales have been great, production continues to increase and we're into the third run now with install/usability improvements that come with product maturity.

It's been great personally meeting many RCLT HD owners and being involved with installations to ensure early-on issues across the range of applications are addressed quickly. Most installs are from customers who do not use social media and our guys have enjoyed reading trip reports and seeing pics of how great everyone's setup is performing.

I don't have time like I used to for forums but would like to take this opportunity to address some things I noticed while poking around replies.


- Customers unable to contact Marlin Crawler?

I found two customers who complained about a lack of support and while I do not doubt their authenticity there is no reason why they had to endure this and I am sorry for any issues this caused.

Our sales team takes thousands of phone calls monthly, has a fast response policy and is very good at staying up-to-date with emails. We process thousands of orders monthly and reply to hundreds of emails every week. Our sales team does not monitor this thread so instead please call or email us! It hurts to see this when we already provide resources to help every customer.

During the past year I stepped in to help about a dozen RCLT HD related emails and responded to every single one, some with customers, others with installers, using feedback for instruction updates. Our team is human and prone to mistakes, but we do not ignore any opportunity to help, regardless if it's RCLT HD or one Turtle Hat Pin. What you see in this thread is an echo chamber making small issues great. If you need any help with an order, please visit our website and contact our team direct! We have open phone lines right now so please call.


- Body trimming is not required to run 35" or larger tires?

I noticed a few members believe we claim large tires may be installed without any body trimming. We have never made such claim and these people are obviously trolling. My build thread details body trimming for iterations of my own RCLT HD installs dating back to 2017.

What we do state is that body mount frame brackets do not need to be trimmed to fit 35" tires. This is regardless of how much up-travel, down-travel, or cornering ability the vehicle has.

We state this twice on the product page, first as the primary goal of the project: "1. To install 35" tires without cab mount modification", and again as the first in the industry with the: "Ability to run 35" tires without body mount modification". Moreover, the appendix of our instructions state: "fender and/or bumper trimming is required" and includes the following from Page 51: "While 35" tires easily clear all frame parts at full steering-lock and suspension compression, likely the rear trailing edge of the front bumper will need to be trimmed as well as the fender in front of the tire." and, "Stuffing 40" tires on a late-model IFS is NOT easy and requires extensive inner fender wall modification."

We are clear that body trimming is required to fit 35s.

While some are hung up on trimming, here is a 2020 TRD Pro 4Runner RCLT HD install with 37s that required zero body or fender trimming because those parts were already previously trimmed for his front bumper. Did you catch that? Apart from drilling a couple holes and adding small welds, it's actually possible for an installer to bolt-on RCLT HD + 37s to typical trail rigs without performing any body trimming. Other LT kits can't even wet dream about this.




- What's the point of RCLT HD if it only achieves 6" of up-travel?

It is refreshing to see comments like this, especially since it comes from a business aspiring themselves to be a competitor of ours. Of all the LT kits on the market, wheel travel is the only comparative metric to RCLT HD, yet our features are so incredible that our superior double-sheer horizontal ball-joint wheel travel isn't even a listed goal. The blatant ignorance and disdain shown illustrates the limited mindset and mediocrity of other product offerings on the market.

To remind the thread, these are the unmatched, patented benefits of RCLT HD:

• Relocate front axle so far forward it requires a new steering system,
• Unmatched IFS approach angle,
• Unmatched IFS ground clearance,
• Unmatched IFS knuckle strength,
• Unmatched IFS steering strength,
• Unmatched IFS geometry stability,
• Flex equal to wider LT kits yet without requiring fiberglass fenders,
• Ability to run 35" tires without body mount modification, and
• It is the first IFS system that challenges the benefits of a Solid Axle Swap

These are not hyperboles, they are literal features of RCLT HD that go far beyond just suspension travel. What's truly wild is that these same people criticizing our infinite double-sheer horizontal ball joint vertical travel capability are using pee-wee knuckles with single-sheer vertical ball joints that explicitly limit vertical motion. Hypocrites. FYI, at ride height my Tacoma has 9-inches of wheel up-travel and 5-inches of down-travel.

RCLT HD is a quantum leap in LT Rock Crawling strength & performance. One of the above nine advantages is geometry. My design experiences only 1-degree of both toe-in & camber change through the entire range of travel which is an incredible tractive force benefit for Rock Crawling. We achieve this by replacing toothpick knuckles and light-duty steering geometry with the only all-new, integrated HD IFS + HD Steering Rack geometry resulting in Rock Crawling performance lightyears ahead of everything else.



ps. This image was made using my 1,225 lb-force two-way forced articulation setup, showing +4.5" lift (96% max) over -5.25" drop (73% squat) from ride height.


- With 37s & +2" forward geometry, you must completely eliminate inner fenders, relocate battery/fuse box/headlights...?

This statement is patently absurd. Not only has this been proven incorrect with 37" + RCLT HD installations, it is also proven incorrect with the 40s on my own 2016 Tacoma whereby I only modified about half of my inner fenders, did not relocate my battery, did not relocate my fuse box, and did not relocate my headlights, despite achieving full lock-to-lock steering and 100% of my coil over up-travel including the removal of the small shock shaft safety bump stops.


- Is the image in Instructions|Appendix A10 of my Tacoma at full up-travel?

The answer: Almost! Here is the full image in question plus a couple extra for reference.
This is climbing up-hill at Bald Mtn, Central California:



There is about 2 to 3" of up-travel in reserve



Here is what my full stuff looks like. The tire dug into the fender and wrinkled it again (I just had that fender redone!).
This is a video screenshot descending down Thompson Hill, Dusy/Ershim, Central California:



Additional reference showing full drop to full stuff, which on my install is 14 inches of wheel travel prior to cab/frame flex:




- Not a simple remove and replace product?

I noticed two owners say we gave the impression that RCLT HD is a simple install. We are sorry for the confusion but no where on our website or marketing do we claim such. One of the goals for making the instructions as detailed as they are (currently 52 pages) is to convey scope. In fact, the first page states, "This installation process is more time consuming than traditional Long Travel IFS installation due to modifications required to install the oversized MarRack rack and pinion steering as well as fitting factory knuckle components onto replacement Heavy Duty Knuckles" and, "Estimated Installation Time: 2 to 5 days". So the scope of install is made known from the beginning. Nevertheless, a misunderstanding with two owners is two too many so I copied the "Installation Overview" from the instructions to the product page for double-visibility.

Early on there were some installation issues that we worked direct with customers and shops to resolve and got those promptly added to the instructions which was fantastic. You can see these listed in the Change Log. Outside this, if you follow our instructions then RCLT HD is a straight-forward install.

The only thing I can think of is how we compare RCLT HD to a Solid Axle Swap by stating that compared to an SAS our kit is 99% bolt-on. Which is true. We didn't have to take the high road in challenging the benefits of an SAS, but in doing so we further distance ourselves and prevent competing with all other IFS companies as none of them dares compare their LT kits' Rock Crawling ability to that of an SAS.


- Why do we use rubber bushings & stock unit bearings?

I understand why these are being criticized by the same unhappy shop worker as above. Currently RCLT HD has no competition so one must reach deep to find semblance of common ground.

This is very basic.

Rubber bushings are the most commonly used isolation device in automobile history and are reliable and easy to service. They play an important role in Rock Crawling by reducing failure from shock loads and increasing drive train durability. For this same reason, I use rebuildable polyurethane heim joints in my rear 3-link. I have yet to break a suspension component on my truck despite running 40" tires for over 40,000 miles and I can tell you as a Mechanical Engineer that having a place for vibrations and impacts to be absorbed is one reason why. Rigid mounts with only one degree of freedom, ie. connecting a control arm to a frame using two heim joints, is not smart for Rock Crawling.

As for factory wheel bearings, there are multiple benefits to retain them. They are a wide, double-row, max-capacity design and are proven to be strong enough for Rock Crawling with 40" tires and King Of The Hammers four times with 35" tires. They are highly standardized and can be found at any auto parts store, requiring no alternate training or tools to service. They are compatible with Chromoly 35-spline Dana 60-sized axle shafts strong enough for up to a size 47" tire. (Yes, forty-seven.) They are more than sufficient for the use-case of RCLT HD. I have zero plans to service or replace my high-quality Japanese-made Toyota wheel bearings. They work great.


- We stopped making Crawl Boxes?

Someone asked why we stopped making Crawlers. We have not stopped manufacturing Crawl Boxes but have reduced availability of certain applications. Overall we had a strong year in Crawler sales.


- YouTube and "Includes Paid Promotion"

This one really isn't important but I saw the recent comment and would like to discuss because it's annoying to me too.

The first time something we did got tagged with this was ORDIP Vids' 2017 video, Marlin Crawler Explained. Some guy approached our booth at the '17 FJ Summit and asked if we'd mind explaining what we do for use on his YT channel. He was a nice guy and a great listener. He had never heard of Marlin Crawler and was uninformed about Rock Crawling. Using only a cell phone, he took the time to film, edit, and publish the video which we show on our Dual T/Case pages today. Mind you we never paid him anything, and he never paid us anything. Business cards were the only transaction.

Fast forward to last month when I saw Dirt Lifestyle's video go live with, low-and-behold, the same "Includes paid promotion" tag. I asked Nate about this and he said that many YouTubers who stake their livelihood on their channel are adding this tag because of threats from the DMCA and other legal/governing bodies shutting down, demonetizing, and deplatforming videos that do not meet pending legislation.

I have seen videos from people vlogging while driving (that's illegal) to driving without their seatbelt on (a certain popular off-road recovery channel) (believe it or not, also straight to jail), and Nate plus many in his circle are applying this tag across-the-board to their videos to mitigate legal concerns that may stifle their primary source of income.

I don't know these rules myself so Nate or someone else will need to chime in to clarify more. Because Nate approached us first, we did not pay him any money for the RCLT HD video and likewise Nate never paid us any money. In my opinion this YT tag is meaningless.


- Criticism Surrounding Influencers

Let this topic stand to humble those quick to judge a priori: All marketing kits are either prototypes, non-production parts, or a mix thereof made on separate jigs that had no impact to our product production schedule. For example, the kit on Dirt Lifestyle's Tacoma is a combination of prototype & KOH parts that were slowly mailed to him a few times during the year. Nate knew from the beginning that he would be waiting at least half a year or longer, as covered at the 17:07 minute mark of his video.

Frankly, how we operate R&D is none of the public's business and every one of these marketing opportunities reached out to us first. We have yet to actively seek marketing for RCLT HD. I see grumblings about us working with famous Instagramers yet we don't know any. To flip this on its head, influencers are the only reason RCLT HD exists. If it wasn't for the asinine pressure I placed on myself during those two back-to-back KOH prototyping seasons with Steel City Racing and Car #4602, we would have settled on inferior designs, avoided the 3 years it took to patent, and our LT would be another boring run-of-the-mill kit like all others on the market.

Many people have break-through ideas like RCLT HD but only complete idiots have the willpower to keep pushing struggles to fruition. Anyone who has persevered knows you don't have a product without an audience, and as a business owner I thank influencers for being a driving force in the economy so inventions have an ounce-chance for long-term success.

Here come some inconvenient truths:

1. Number of TW members complaining about influencers: Many
2. Number of RCLT HD owners on the trail complaining about influencers: Zero
3. Number of production RCLT HD kits that have gone to influencers: Less than half a percent.

Hate em cuz you ain't em.


- What's with all the hype for 40s?

I only ever meant to test product design and reliability, and on an IFS, 40,000+ miles of driving to trails across 6 states (never trailered), wheeling hard, and returning home to resume daily driving with 40s and zero product failures is conclusive validation that if our products are strong enough for 40s then they'll last a lifetime on 35s.

Just look at the insane size difference between a 40" and a 35" tire....



....only that's not a 35. That is a 37. Fourty-inch tires on a near bolt-on LT kit is no joke and you better be prudent on reliability as people's lives are at stake. So we went big (40s) and we went hard (3-time KOH) in the design of RCLT HD.


- Pelfrey and RST

So... just to be clear, we are much larger than peak Pelfry and peak RST combined. While no one is too big to fail, we did not amass our 3-decades of success by taking people's money and lying to customers. We always place customers first and are the polar opposite of how those two companies operated. A significant portion of our business is in community outreach and giving back, something startups and other businesses no longer around fail to appreciate.

Again, this thread is an echo chamber exacerbating the challenges it took to create the most revolutionary and complicated Rock Crawling IFS product in history. Last fall 4WD ToyotaOwner published one of my articles in their September/October magazine and this excerpt from Page 48 sums up the struggle I had in adding an entire new pie to the IFS industry, bold-font added here for emphasis:

All who placed pre-orders for RCLT HD did so to lock their position in queue. We didn't need the money and not a single penny was touched until the first kit shipped. Inspired by business models of automobile manufactures, we first discussed a down payment of $100 to lock spots in line which led to non-IFS owners offering money just to say they "got in". So we increased this to 50% payment to seek the serious but it was the first dozen or so depositors, the customers, who requested we accept their entire payment so they can have a completed, no-frills, paid-in-full spot in line, and since then four of these pre-order customers have already placed second orders.

Those in this thread who actually believe we would use pre-order monies to fund development are absolutely sick. I would never be able to sleep at night if we even tried this once, and I don't understand how anyone of you could either. I'd like to see you open a business and try that strategy. Operating a successful company is not as easy as 1-2-3 and Pelfrey and RST are proof positive of this.


- Hub travel of 12.5" & 14.5" of travel at tire center line?

The hub travel is correct, however, the tire travel is only 14", not 14.5" which I stopped saying quite some time ago. When I place a tape measure between fender and the top of the tire at tire center line, meaning the center of the tire tread looking straight down on the tire where the tape measure touches it, the distance is 14". The tire does touch and push through the fender as shown above (and now my fender is dented again) and that's why I originally said 14.5" because I thought I hadn't trimmed my fender enough, but actually that was due to body flex. So I've corrected that number to just 14" on my setup.


- In closing

I tire from marketing how impressive RCLT HD is so I stopped and have been busy meeting people and demonstrating it in person. I wish everyone could experience a truly Heavy Duty IFS & steering integrated system. It's painful to see people complain about the price, even when some of those people are my close personal wheeling buddies. RCLT HD unfortunately is not a mass-producible product nor was it meant to be. Rather, it's the best product that showcases what IFS can do when it's built right.

The haters here have never experienced RCLT HD nor met me or our team and do not know the sacrifices, struggles, and failures we went through in getting this "impossible product" to market... It's great having them here to prove our accomplishment is worth noticing and valuable for their time. I'm sure many of you are nice people and I look forward to meeting and wheel'n with you someday. Stepping away from this thread and focusing on customers, products, and my family was the best thing I did. I encourage everyone to take time off from the internet, get fresh air, and go wheeling. It's much less crowded on the trail.

 

Did you go with King's? If so, check with them. They are out weekly(?) at Barstow Main for test n tunes.....Also, you'll need to find your compromise of sorts. Valving that handles whoops, may not give you that plush ride in the rocks. I'm sure there's a some what happy medium to be found.