The LED SAE J583 Fog Pod & Fog Light Review

Excellent review Crash, as always.

 

That little sucker is quite impressive!! I wonder if @Diode Dynamics has a "Max" SSC2 in the works to compete? Those little 2Bangers have a higher intensity than the SS3 Sport and NCS 4Banger. Granted they are giving up width to gain more intensity, but still impressive for it's size and only 2 LEDs. Are you planning on testing the Morimoto 1Banger wide?

 

TBD on the 1bangers. The could be pretty compelling based on the performance of the 2bangers.

 

Do you think I could use a splitter and tie the SSC1’s into the same factory fog harness?

I am running KC G4 Amber fogs in place of the factory OR fogs. So they have an H11 to 2 pin Deutsch connector.

 

Yes, the Tacomas are wired for a 55w fog, so the KC G4s plus SSC1s are way below the designed circuit load. However, if you’re angling them that far to the sides, you wouldn’t want them on whenever you are running the fogs so that may be convenient but not practical.

 

How far to the sides would you aim them?
I figured the fog pattern would just supplement the G4’s.

 

Well for cornering lights, pretty far. If going that route you might swap the G4s for SS3 Sports to color match. I think amber and yellow is going to look odd. It is worth noting that running multiple fog light pairs is also not compliant.

 

Didn’t think of that, Well there goes that idea

 

Cornering lamps, and lamps that function as both fog and cornering lamps must also be white light only, if we're being sticklers.

 

Looks like a use case for the recent multi color fog.

 

Nope

The idea is, I suppose, they wouldnt want to risk the cornering lamp being mixed up with a marker/signal lamp, depending on how it was implemented.

 

We always have things in the works! Wish I could share, but suffice to say that many of improvements will be coming in the future for our whole lineup.

My take though - although the 2Banger uses a higher-power chip than the SSC2 Pro, the total power consumption is quite similar. From a design perspective, after going crazy with huge intensity values on the SS3, we took a step back with the C2 and C1 and we intentionally got away from a "max intensity" focus in favor of a very even and broad spread of light.

In the meantime, our competition continued to focus on that candela value to one-up Diode, probably because we had made it such a big focus on our marketing efforts. So it's not a surprise to see that the 2Banger is higher intensity. But, total light output should be quite similar between the two products, just based on the operating power level. I do think the 2Banger is a nice option, but from my perspective it's not providing substantially more overall performance than the C2 in any beam pattern, even if it does have a higher peak value of intensity. So we're not exactly scrambling to do a redesign on the C2.

Paul

 

I'm excited to see what's coming in the future!

Thats a good perspective there. I do prefer the wider pattern that DD's fog lens generally provides since the headlights already provide forward lighting. I've got a set of the SSC2 Pro Fog in white and have been extremely impressed by them! I have them mounted on my motorcycle, but need to mount them lower since the slightest amount of lean angle puts them in drivers eyes when I'm not expecting traffic.

 

That makes sense. I wonder, if a fog or other aux light that doesn’t point straight forward, is then considered a cornering light for legal requirements.

 

You can point some fog lamp outward and can satisfy cornering lamp requirement, as long as it has decent cutoff line.
But using fog beam for cornering lamp is somewhat over kill. Cornering lamp does not need to be that wide, it just must be aimed outward, covers 30-60 degree outer angle and have good cutoff.
45 degree outer angle is target center, but minimum requirement is 500Cd, no need of high power solution.
Cornering lamp only supposed to come on when turn signal/ or while certain steering angle range is detected.

 

2B HXB wide and C2 Pro Fog output have significant performance difference when used as fog lamp.
1/2/4Banger wide beam isn't wide beam end to beam end on the wall, but it does carry meaningful reasonable beam width as SAE Fog lamp, where it contribute to driver near field width illuminance.
I am not saying it has optimum width though!
Personally, I still insisting to call 1/2/4 Banger wide beam, not fog.. Not sure how marketing will call it, but to me it still is wide beam that is capable of handling fog role.
I made some improvement ( more like package size allowed bit more desirable config, slightly larger TIR optics and less reflector overlap) on questioning cutoff quality of 4Banger with 1 and 2 Banger this time for fog lamp usage purpose.

Anyways,, When lamp are aimed properly as SAE, 2B HXB wide does have more meaningful width to my comprehension based on test points that has minimum requirements.
This take some explanation, hope I can visualize well below.
I think it's been so long, so many failed to understand proper SAE F function fog beam, people using fog lamp wrongly giving false impression of what is actual meaningful width as fog beam.

I must also agree, it is not much benefit to have this regulation upper limit level of illuminance at peak, it is very much covered by low beam lower angle beam coverage.
Point is,, I do feel like very important part of discussion is being dismissed for long time in this SAE thread, is G( Gradient max)= Cutoff criteria

@Diode Dynamics
Has it ever been officially checked G max criteria? Looking at beam, there is no way to tell where the cutoff line is. Particularly Pro was very poor.
I did see SAE Fog lens now has angled exit source, so at straight aim when bezel front flat parallel to aiming wall, beam will naturally lower by few degree. Admiring attempt on this, this allows less downward aiming requirement compare to SS3
Data sheet doesn't show G max, nor F function table. IsoCan is not aimed as J583 too, I am afraid C2 Pro may not be OK to label as F fog.
Subject never got discussed enough to have any validation, unless I miss learning so. Please advise.

Below isn't photometric test by official third party lab yet, but from my careful observation, reasonably fair comparison I have conducted. Review as individual level study.
My study is strongly suggesting C2 Pro also will not likely satisfy SAE F function due to cutoff criteria, same as SS3 Pro, it must be aimed lower largely to use as fog lamp without glare limit to exceed
And I have concern that this cause 1.5D 9L/R may not be not bright enough as J583 table itself.
Essential 1.5D 9R/L point likely become very weak as fog lamp.



This is T=30min mark comparison of 2B HXB Wide vs C2 Pro Fog
2B HXB has improved cutoff quality and easier to aim per SAE gradient criteria of 0.75D aim.

2B HXB Wide 0.75D ( aimed by Cutoff, H 10L-10R max 500Cd ish)


Here is C2 Pro Fog ( No visual cutoff, aim is done so H 10L-10R won't exceed 585Cd per SAE F function requirement)
beam center floor bounce are prevented by baffle board, measurement should be reasonably accurate.


2B HXB Wide gradient mapping


C2 Pro Fog gradient mapping




These are the main basic point being assessed per SAE F function ( some upper angle limit is not drawn below)
And,,, I am sorry, 1.5D 9R mark tape fell off!!!! but mirror the point from 9L



Go back on wall shot image, and look at test points mark, this is what I meant by
When aimed as fog lamp ( Pro couldn't be aimed by cutoff, so it's really not fog aim, but aimed in the way it won't cause glare to others), critical immediate road edge width illuminance zone is much weaker with C2 Pro Fog in my observation.

This does NOT apply IF lamp are used as offroad wide beam. Wide beam usage, Pro's width provide high comfort.

 

MAde an account just too say thank you for all the testing and information.

Rigid has the SAE Pro Dually out now. Any plans too test that? With how well the original performed I hope too see how the Pro model stacks up, hopefully better than the 360 pro shown here.

 

Welcome to the forum!

No plans for the immediate future unless someone wanted to lend me some for testing. The updated 360 Pros performed worse than the original 360s due to poor thermal rollback with the increased power. I'd suspect similar thermal performance on the Dually Pros that were part of the same update, but I've not tried them. Rigid's dual layer projector + spreader optics are simply not efficient compared to the far more advanced TIR optics used by Diode Dynamics and Morimoto, so for a given power level pods using TIRs are going to have much higher output intensity.

 

Another option just it case it has some appeal.

https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads...led-cornering-lights-35.791366/#post-28334726

 

I fell into that engineering trap too! No need to actually put the light through a cutout. Simply take the front cover off and bring the light in from behind the cutout. Then mate the front cover over the cutout and secure to the light. In theory.

This is one of those projects that’s just going to require spending $$ to investigate. I’m not even sure that little ribbed area would be strong enough to hold a light securely.

PS, do you have any insight into the beam pattern for the 1banger wide beam? Width and height?