Death Valley Off-Road Adventures

I think social media is bad for remote places like Death Valley. I fed @Scott B. question into my preferred AI chatbot and I agree very much with its answers on the differences between the two.

What is the difference between modern social media and internet forums?

Great question! While modern social media and traditional internet forums both facilitate online discussions, they have distinct differences in structure, purpose, and interaction styles.

Internet Forums

• Thread-Based Discussions: Forums are structured around specific topics, with users posting in threads that allow for in-depth conversations.
  
  
• Community-Oriented: Users typically join forums based on shared interests, creating a tighter-knit group dynamic.
  
  
• Long-Form Communication: Posts tend to be detailed and structured, fostering deeper discussions rather than quick reactions.
  
  
• Chronological Structure: Replies in threads usually follow a timeline, making conversations easier to follow without algorithmic interference.

Modern Social Media

• Algorithm-Driven Feeds: Content is distributed based on user preferences and engagement rather than purely chronological order.
  
  
• Casual & Fast-Paced: Posts are shorter and designed for instant consumption, with likes, shares, and comments serving as primary interactions.
  
  
• Broader Audience Reach: Social media connects users globally, whereas forums often have niche communities.
  
  
• Visual & Multimedia Integration: Platforms prioritize images, videos, and interactive content, often blending entertainment with discussion.

In essence, forums cultivate thoughtful discussions within smaller communities, while social media accelerates engagement across a wider audience with fast-moving, dynamic content.

 

I think the biggest issue for me is SM sites often place limits on reply length. The number of reels that leave you wondering is staggering--you almost cannot have a conversation about anything because attention spans are so short. Cake was a recent attempt to create traction in forum software market that was more like social media but long form. Didn't succeed, Interesting experiment. Dynamic, engaging but it lacked organization--and this is not the same as the Cake Software Platform.

 

I was very brief, and everyone is asking sensible questions. The starting point has to be what do we mean by "Social Media" and that's probably where the disconnect is happening between my view and most everyone else's. And if we use Google, we see there isn't a consistent definition of "Social Media", but there are a number of cases in which people make a distinction between "Social Media" and a "Forum" which is where I was coming from. But if I just say "TW isn't Social Media" then I can certainly see why people wouldn't agree.

Just so the discussion is easier to follow I will define:

Online Discussion Platform (ODP) - A platform for community discussion of a topic or area of interest primarily by community members interested in that topic. The existence of the platform is not based on a profit motive, though it may use ad revenue to pay hosting fees and there may be excess revenue beyond these costs. The platform does not algorithmically recommend or moderate content nor does it promote content with the intent of increasing revenue. The host and moderators are typically persons with a direct interest in the area of interest. Content creators are not financially compensated or otherwise rewarded for their content, the number of community members that read/rate/recommend their content, or the ad revenue that their content may generate for the platform host. Content is not favorably placed or promoted based on the particular content creators who create it, any user's content is equally visible as any other's. Typical "traditional Internet forums" or more ancient "mailing lists" are examples, TacomaWorld being one. In general the content is the primary focus, regardless of how few people might view it.

Social Media Platform (SMP) - A platform commercially owned and developed with a profit motive driven by increasing viewership to generate revenue through advertising and other partner relations. The platform uses algorithms to promote content specifically to increase ad revenue, increase the amount of time users stay on the platform, and reward content creators that generate the most views and revenue. The most promoted content comes from creators that are directly financially compensated both through the platform itself (ad revenue sharing) and external brand sponsors (product placement). Extremely large and expensive development teams continue to evolve the platform with the single overriding goal of increasing the number of users and the amount of time each user spends on the platform regardless of the actual content they view. In general having the maximum number of people view the content is the primary focus, regardless of the topic of the content.

Why do I say people make a "false equivalence" between them? Because it is very easy to fall into the trap of "well they are online communities and the community members create content that other members view, so really they are the same thing". That's obviously not true at all and it is just as misleading to saying "democracies and absolute monarchies are both successful forms of government so really they are the same thing". The intent and implementation of platforms drastically alters how their users and their content creators behave.

For reference, I have friends that work at FB (now Meta) and for multiple years the single overriding strategic goal for the entire company was simply: "Increase the amount of time FB users spend on FB by five minutes a day." And every possible means was deployed to try to achieve that goal - including using social psychology techniques to actively addict users to the platform.

I think once you read the above distinctions between the two it is almost immediately obvious how the two kinds of platforms differ and that your experiences of those differences in the real world are very easy to understand when viewed through the context of what are the platforms created and maintained for (i.e. what is the motivation for their existence).

I'll leave it at that, since I don't think much more needs to be said, but I'm more than happy to list the differences that are the direct consequences of those motivations if anyone has trouble getting to them themselves.

 

Damn, this has been a good discussion and I'm late to the party but here's my TLDR:

Social media is anything that uses an algo to keep you engaged. Tik Tok, X, Threads, Insta, Youtube all qualify.

Forums do not qualify since YOU choose what threads to look at not the algo.

While I really dig all the effort and typing some of you guys have put into these replies I like short and sweet. Mostly because I type slow as fuck. lol

 

That indeed is the heart of it! Nice and concise!

And one immediately derives most of the rest of the poison once you think through "but why would some use an algo to keep you engaged?"

 

To rehash an old quote. "If your not paying for the product, you are the product."

 

Doesn’t matter whether you pay or not. You are the product.

Back to forums. Sure, you can argue social engineering is not part of many forums. But that doesn’t mean it’s not happening. Ads, landing pages with articles, that’s maybe a less formal approach. Likes, definitely social engineering. A list of similar topics at the bottom of a page? And finally, every bot that crawls the sight is making it easier for people find the site.

I don’t think the line is as simple as we’d like it to be.

 

Saying there is a continuum does not at all change the fact that there are still easily distinguished extremes at each end of the continuum. A 130F day is a lot different from a 60F day even if there are a whole bunch of moderate days between those two things.

 

We're gonna have to disagree.

 

I think we probably actually 95% agree, but I'm just being pedantic!

Cheers!

 

This intelligent discussion is why the DV thread is one of the few on TW (along with one of the mountain bike threads) that I read regularly, even though I haven’t been to DV in over a year . My own internal algorithm steers me here. I removed both the FB and IG apps from my devices a few months ago and don’t really miss them. Though a few public agencies (CalTrans and in fact DVNP) do provide useful info there. I do kinda miss the old Usenet news groups though … I think I still have a printed-out copy of an overlanding article from rec.autos.4x4 from the 90’s.