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1st Oil Change Poll

Discussion in 'Performance and Tuning' started by spaghettiedy, Oct 7, 2008.

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1st Oil change

  1. 500 - Dyno

    3.9%
  2. 500 - Synthetic

    3.7%
  3. 1k - Dyno

    4.9%
  4. 1k - Synthetic

    7.7%
  5. 2k - Dyno

    2.2%
  6. 2k - Synthetic

    6.2%
  7. 3k - Dyno

    12.3%
  8. 3k - Synthetic

    16.8%
  9. 5k - Dyno

    13.3%
  10. 5k - Synthetic

    29.0%
  1. Jun 30, 2009 at 6:50 PM
    #41
    jandrews

    jandrews Carolina Alliance Southwest Region Ambassador

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    No need to wait until 5000. That's just the recommendation.

    Engines are broken in from factory. Transmissions are not, which means you're better off doing diff oil change sooner rather than later.
     
  2. Aug 2, 2009 at 3:53 AM
    #42
    KodiakVA

    KodiakVA Well-Known Member

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    Although I haven't done it yet I plan to change to Mobil 1 at 2000. Then again at 5000. Every 5000 with the M1 after that.

    I have used this schedule with many small 4 banger commuter cars and never ran them for less than 180,000 miles. After about 80,000 I would then change oil at 10,000 miles intervals. Drove 35,000 a year with most of the cars over 200,000 miles on them and still running strong when I would get rid of them.

    These miles were with me either me driving 80 MPH on Rt 80 in PA or NJ or stuck in traffic because some stinking garbage tractor trailer flipped over and just added 1 to 2 hours to my drive home. :mad: These are hard miles on small 4 cylinder engines (Dodge Colts and Neons) so needless to say I swear by Mobil 1.
     
  3. Aug 2, 2009 at 9:17 AM
    #43
    bass mechanic

    bass mechanic Well-Known Member

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    that was pretty stupid, all manufacturers use a special break in oil designed to help the rings seat. when you build any motor new or rebuild you have to let the rings seat so they won't rotate around the piston, they will wear against the walls of the cyl and seal up.

    all this talk about metal shavings ha ha you guys are so funny! some have even mentioned metal flakes! are you kidding me? have you ever built an engine?
    if you had flakes of metal in the motor believe me you would have some pretty major issues.
    first of all keep in mind that yes there is wear, but we are talking about metallic POWDER particles so small you would need a microscope to see.
    with that in mind realize that NONE of the parts in the engine have direct metal to metal contact, they all carry a film of oil between the bearing surfaces and the rotating assemblies. and the rings and cyl walls. there are some irregualarities in the rings and cyl walls that do touch but thats what break in does, thoes parts wear together. also camshafts and lifters have to wear together their surfaces to have minimal contact and need to wear together.

    now getting back to the metal particles. yes there are some but they are all smaller than the space that is between bearings and other surfaces and they are held in suspention of the oil. its not like they get ground up in the motor and most of which ends up in the bottom of the oil pan. from there they go through the FILTER which is exactly what it was designed for. to remove particles large enough to cause dammage to the engine.

    do you really think your doing your engine any good or making it last any longer by prematurely changin your oil? do you really think the manufacturer who designed the engine, who has a reputation of quality and building products that last 200K+ miles don't know what they are doing? do you think if it was at all dammaging to your motor to leave your original oil in for 5k miles they would print that in the owners manuel?

    come on guys! let's use our heads a little shall we? follow the manufacturers instructions, believe me they know a lot more than you do about their products. changing your oil early is just a waste of money and there are a lot of commercials on TV that have claims about their oil they can't prove! all because they know there are people like you who believe the hype and will spend the money to buy their products.

    i buy castrol 5w30, always have, is it any better than quakerstate? penzoil? who knows? who cares.. there is no research i know of that proves using synthetic oil will make your motor go a million miles before a rebuild verses using dino oil. it's not like you see cars stranded along the side of the road that konked out because they used regular oil and changed at the manufacturers reccommended intervals.

    not only that, youll probly sell your truck LONG before it reaches it's life expectancy or it will be involved in an accident and totalled well before the engine reaches it's usefull life.

    now if you turbo or SC your engine it may not be a bad idea to upgrade the oil, it certainly can't hurt. but for the rest of you if you want to throw your money away worried you have metal flakes in your engine i guess to each his own, a fool and his money i guess.

    i have a honda VTX 1800 the oil change interval on that bike is 3K for the first change and normally 6k after that. the reason is because it has wet type clutch and there ARE clutch particles in the oil. you have to change it because if you don't it can fill up and clog the oil filter. but only because it is a new clutch.
    cars and trucks don't have clutch material in the oil abd they dont have metal shavings or flakes!
     
  4. Aug 2, 2009 at 9:42 AM
    #44
    Coastie Joe

    Coastie Joe Well-Known Member

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    x2 I'd follow you anywhere Bass Mechanic! :D
     
  5. Aug 2, 2009 at 11:15 AM
    #45
    bass mechanic

    bass mechanic Well-Known Member

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    here we go with the shavings again, PLEASE gimme a break!

    and FWIW they reccommend the lighter weight oil 5w30 because it yields better MPG due to the lack of pumping effort. and for the same reason they reccommend you change to different viscocities during winter or summer months.
     
  6. Aug 2, 2009 at 11:20 AM
    #46
    bass mechanic

    bass mechanic Well-Known Member

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    oh and i forgot to post. im leaving mine in per the manufacturers reccommendation and plan to continue to use the cheap dino oil for the remainder of my ownership i expect to get an easy 200K out of the truck or sell it before it gets that old whichever comes first and it will be the next owners problem after that.
    i have better things to spend my money on and worry about than my oil. it lubercates the engine and as long as it continues to do that i am a happy camper!
    unless of course i find flakes in my oil! LMAO!!
     
  7. Aug 2, 2009 at 11:36 AM
    #47
    jandrews

    jandrews Carolina Alliance Southwest Region Ambassador

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    FWIW:

    Per two different service managers I have talked to at Toyo dealerships, Toyota does not use any special "break-in" oil as factory fill to help piston rings seat. Rings are seated at factory, you can change to whatever oil you like at whatever mileage you like.

    Many vehicle manufacturers these days use commercial oils as factory fills, which should tell you all you need to know.

    That said, there's no need to change your oil early. I swapped mine over to synthetic at 1000mi because I'm anal, not because it was necessary.

    As for visible pieces of metal: If you find these in your diff oil, no big deal. If you find them in your engine oil, have it TOWED to a dealership/mechanic. I wouldn't even crank the engine if metal was coming out with the oil during a change.
     
  8. Sep 2, 2009 at 6:29 PM
    #48
    cornwall325

    cornwall325 Toyota newbie...

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    I'm planning on changing mine at 3,000 and then every 3,000 thereafter. I haven't decided when I'm going to change the diffs. and all that yet. I'm still caught up in the moment of enjoying my new Tacoma right now! :)
     
  9. Oct 11, 2009 at 4:51 PM
    #49
    jandrews

    jandrews Carolina Alliance Southwest Region Ambassador

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    The engine is broken in at factory.

    Viscosity is not different between dino and synthetic oils of the same viscosity rating...because they have the same viscosity rating.
     
  10. Oct 12, 2009 at 5:11 AM
    #50
    JoeSchmuck

    JoeSchmuck Well-Known Member

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    I believe they were trying to say dino oil leaves a thicker film behind where as synthetic leaves a thinner film once the engine is off for a break-in period.

    I still believe in a break-in period in spite of what you're saying, even if what you're saying is true. I'm not going to say you're wrong or mis-informed because I don't know what Toyota does when it builds it's engines. However, my gas mileage did improve, a sign of break-in. I'm sure it was not only the engine but other components too, and I don't mean the computer learning my driving habits either. I doubt it took between 3000 to 3500 miles to learn those because that's about where my milage gains stopped. I got a gain of ~3.6 MPG (up to ~22.3 MPG). Some people would attribute that to driving habits but I'm a bit too old to be hot-doggin' it. I was cautious when I first got it for the first 500 miles, after that just normal driving. The MPG was a very gradual increase. Some fill-ups were worse than others when I'd drive with the A/C on. But, I prefer four windows down as much as possible.

    I've since had my 5000 mile oil changed with whatever Toyota puts in the engine (free oil for life) but at my next change interval I will be putting in full synthetic and a K&N Performance Gold filter. Honestly I'd stick with the dealership because it's free but waiting 90 to 120 minutes for an oil change is a waste of my time. I'd rather change the oil myself. I also plan to change the diff oil and transmission fluid at 60,000. If the transmission filter is easy enough to replace, I'll do that as well.

    Okay, time to jump off the 'ole soap box. It was not my intention to offend anyone and hopefully I didn't.

    -Joe
     
  11. Oct 12, 2009 at 4:03 PM
    #51
    jandrews

    jandrews Carolina Alliance Southwest Region Ambassador

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    :annoyed::goingcrazy:


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viscosity

    Not trying to belabor the point, but this is killing me: oils of the same viscosity will have essentially the same fluid characteristics in terms of response to stress, at least within the specified temperature range.

    That is the entire point of the viscosity rating.
     
  12. Oct 12, 2009 at 4:26 PM
    #52
    def4pos8

    def4pos8 Well-Known Member

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    My Taco has 92 miles on it as I pound these keys.

    I'll drain the crankcase at 1000 miles and fill with AMSOIL 0W-30 and one of their EaO filters. Drain interval is one year or 25,000 miles for me.

    I'll also drain the (manual) transmission and differential, filling those with AMSOIL Severe Gear 75W-90, a GL-5 lube.

    Normally, the EaO filters are good for one year but the 2.7's filter is so small that I'll change it at 6,000-mile intervals. I may modify the filter system by adding a bypass/full-flow dual remote filter combo. This would put me back on the annual filter change routine that I am used to.
     
  13. Oct 13, 2009 at 3:04 AM
    #53
    JoeSchmuck

    JoeSchmuck Well-Known Member

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    Agreed. :thumbsup: I'm not debating viscosity at all because I agree. However dino oil leaves more oil behind between the contact points where as synthetic oil would rather follow gravity into the oil pan, leaving less oil behind. Some folks like this idea and depending on thier engine, it may be practical. Dino oil just likes to stick to things better and lead and other materials are easily grabbed in the oil suspension. And I agree that synthetics do have less friction than dino oil. I myself will be moving to full synthetic at the next oil change.

    Have a blessed day.
     
  14. Oct 18, 2009 at 10:55 PM
    #54
    JKD

    JKD Well-Known Member

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    You're going to go with the extended drain interval while still under warranty?
     
  15. Oct 20, 2009 at 6:42 AM
    #55
    def4pos8

    def4pos8 Well-Known Member

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    As I've said in other posts, AMSOIL has been in my crankcases, trannys and difs (and u-joints, steering knuckles, bearing sets, etc) for thirty years now without any troubles or failures. AMSOIL itself will warranty a user's costs if lubricant failure has been proven to be the cause. I don't believe that they've ever had to pay out on that promise.

    The biggest problem untechnical folks have with super lubes is ignorance of contamination. Any synthetic, Redline, AMSOIL, "Purple Jesus", etc won't work after, say, you wade a muddy river and suck a load of mud through the differential ventilators. Filtration is important. AMSOIL offers many options in filtration. If you research the actual capabilities of OEM and most over the counter oil filters, you'll likely be surprised, even shocked at how miserable most products are.

    Air filters are important too. Most OEMs are OK but restrictive. I've used K&Ns for street driving but am grateful for not needing them in dust environments. They may be great in dust but just seem a bit thin. I've lived in such cold that frozen filter oil has choked my engine to a stop. AMSOIL filter oil does not freeze in temperatures at and below minus forty degrees. (F or C, -40 is the same on both scales.) I use AMSOIL foam filters when available in an application, even if they give up some air flow volume to the K&N.

    AMSOIL has dropped its best oil filter, the EaO, from the 2.7L applications list. The filter volume of the 2.7's spin-on won't support AMSOIL's one year/36,000 mile drain interval on its best, "Signature Series" synthetic. I'll continue to use that EaO filter, just swapping the FILTER at 6,000 mile intervals for a while. I'll likely upgrade to one of the dual/remote filter systems they offer. I've used this before on an '88 4Runner's 22RE and continue to use a remote oil filter on my Cessna's :plane: Continental engine.

    Apologies for beating this to death.:eek: I'll stop now. The fingers are wearing out.:typing:
     
  16. Oct 24, 2009 at 2:54 PM
    #56
    1GR

    1GR Toyota Dealer Technician

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    Best thing to do is dump at 1K with dyno, then at 4 or 5k with synthetic, then every 4-5k after with synthetic.
     
  17. Oct 30, 2009 at 7:22 PM
    #57
    HondaGM

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  18. Nov 4, 2009 at 12:35 PM
    #58
    bishtacova

    bishtacova Don't buy a Ford

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    I'm following the manual exactly as it's written, 5K for it's 1st oil change with synthetic oil.
     
  19. Nov 4, 2009 at 5:06 PM
    #59
    bass mechanic

    bass mechanic Well-Known Member

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    Havnt seen this thread in a while but FWIW i still own the taco and changed my oil at 5k as the maintenence minder light was flashing.
    changed the oil with castrol

    i also just bought a 2008 Corvette Z06 the manufacturer says use mobile 1 synthetic ONLY im due for an oil change soon and i will be using exactly as reccommended. Chevy gave a 100k mile drivetrain warranty so if they say use that oil, guess what? thats what i use!
     
  20. Nov 6, 2009 at 9:00 AM
    #60
    gozar

    gozar Well-Known Member

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    The dealer told me to keep the factory oil for .... can't remember, think it was 5000 ... because it had additives that help with the break-in period.
     
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