2017 Tacoma TRD-3.5 L engine problems

Again, rings are set/sealed when the engine is first built. The only way oil gets past those is if the rings fail or the cylinder wall is badly scored/worn to a point of a divot/depression forming that allows oil to get past. And in the past few days I have noticed the problem of the smoke getting worse, and yes it appears that the oil level on the dipstick is diminishing. Just yesterday, the smoke from the tailpipe occurred at least 4 times, twice on startup, two others from acceleration after stopping in traffic. So, there is a big problem here and don't tell me there isn't. It's either failed valve stem seals, scored cylinder walls or a head gasket. At any rate it will be an expensive repair that I will probably not be able to fix without applying for a new credit card.

I have also noticed several threads on here about engine failure with the GR2-FKS engine, alot of discussion. And like I said with my truck only having 155,000 kms on it, it is disappointing to experience this as it occurs that Toyota is not making the same quality/bullet proof products they use to. Guess that happens when chasing profits.

 

Why do you keep guessing what it may, or may not be. Get a real answer. Also not reading through this whole thread again. Have you ever told us how, much oil it's going through in 1k, 2k, or 3k to 5k duration?

 

If you have read my original post, I have an appointment in two weeks at a Toyota specialist tech shop in Edmonton, Alberta.

Know I did not tell anyone how much oil it is using and I have only noticed the problem in the past month. Now, I had an oil service/change last week, since then have drove about 900 km and noticed the oil down on the dipstick about 1/4 between the two dots. Not sure how to quantify that, 200-300 ml?

 

Correct, but pretending wear doesn't occur, especially with improper use, is just plain wrong. It's your engine, I'm just offering suggestions. Especially when you tell me you don't believe in a warm up, but also used a block heater until it was disabled and also deal with -40° temperatures. You're already pretty convinced of what it is, but I'm curious to see what you find out at the appointment, and I do mean that genuinely. I haven't actually seen a lot of these engines fail and forums can be quite misleading and full of confirmation bias.

 

Most likely valve guide seal wear, a puff of blue upon startup is the tattle tale.

As far as repairs, keep an eye on oil consumption. But, valve guides don’t leak that muck oil. Certainly not worth a $3500ish repair job

 

Not that I don't believe in a warm up, but tell me, when it puffs a blue on initial startup, and the engine sounds like it has marbles in it, how is is an extended warm up going to help that? Plus, after it is warmed up it puffs blue, sometimes an even larger cloud than start up, after it has been running for an hour or more?

I'm sorry, but alot of you folks here don't read my comments. And I am starting to believe that you have such hard Toyota love that your denying the fact that they produce low quality products anymore. And as I said in my original post, owned and drove Toyota all my life, no joke. Once again that is why I am surprised by all of this at such a low kilometer on the vehicle. The highest mileage Toyota I owned was my 1986 Landcruiser HJ, had over 375,000 km on it. 6 cylinder inline diesel. Didin't use or burn a drop, but it had other issues, mainly old age, needing a recondition.

I'll let you all know what the techs say in a couple of weeks.

 

Valve guide seals can leak quite a bit. I owned a 1984 Toyota with a 22R in it. A mechanic friend reconditioned the engine, he let another buddy of his do the head/valve seals. That guy used the wrong seals and it smoked like crazy, used a ton of oil, until my mechanic friend replaced the seals with proper Toyota parts. Was fine and no oil loss/burn after that.

 

If you have all this experience, I guess I should not have commented.

You still have not produced any credible oil useage data. I’ve never heard an engine that “sounded like it had marbles inside” that didn’t have major damage. If it were my truck, and it had that sound, I would not be driving it. Flatbed it to the shop.

Starting the engine at -40, without using a block heater is extremely bad on the engine. The cylinder walls and bearings would take the brunt of the abuse. When I lived in Montana, I had three extension cords running to my truck in the winter. It can be done.

Best of luck

 

Sounds like you damaged it. Idk what else to tell you. You've completely missed what I've been saying. A proper warm up is going to prevent further damage, especially before you got to this point. Have you ever seen the thickness of oil at -40°? Because if you have, you wouldn't be sitting there telling me that 30 seconds is enough to protect your engine. That's why they give you block heaters. If you're putting a load on almost immediately in those temperatures, you're most certainly accelerating wear. You've also not posted any photos or videos showing what you're dealing with so we're all left to assume what you mean and throw out suggestions. Based on my experience, it's not always what the original poster has entirely described.

Furthermore, as I said before, coming to a forum can quickly make you think your vehicle is a hunk of shit, destined for a life of problems. My truck has 95k miles on it, or 1k km less than yours, and I have had no symptoms anywhere close to yours, except when it's super cold out. It's not what I'd call a "blue smoke" though, but I'm not you and I'm not seeing what you're seeing. I'm due for a spark plug change at my next service and that'll be the most major thing this truck has needed.

Furthermore, you've gone out of your way to say these engines are low quality and hunks of crap based on other threads you've seen but also failed to mention that there are even more users without said issues and there's even an entire thread devoted to high mileage 3rd gens.

 

I damaged my truck? How? I do not drive my truck hard, no hardcore 4x4'ing and sure the cold starts, but what am I to do? When I'm at work it sits at an airport parking lot in Northern BC, temps often get to -30, no way to plug the block heater in. And I all of my other Toyotas didn't develop this problem, no have other brands I have used for work which have been operated far harder and many more kilometers than what is on my Tacoma. And that block heater, it was disabled by a Toyota dealership in Prince George BC, Canada. Ya, they didn't fix it they disabled it, that is all.

I know how thick oil gets in cold, but

$52 0w20 oil Toyota/ exxon mobil Case of 6 Quarts Full Synthetic TGMO SN 0W-20 Oil

0w20 oil, it's the lightest you can get. It's quite difficult to find actually, and to best of my knowledge only Honda/Toyota use it.

I'm glad you have a pristine Toyota that doesn't need the work mine may, but such is what I am dealing with. could be the former owner, could be a screw up from day one in the factory, could be just wear and tear and this engine doesn't like it. At any rate, it has soured my opinion on Toyota, sorry. and that is a hard pill to swallow giving how many of these trucks I have owned in my life (about 7 of them)

Lastly, checked the oil twice today: in the morning it was between the two indicator marks, in the afternoon, it was at the bottom one. Drove about 150 km today. Plus the oil on the dipstick had black spots in it, where it was formerly clean and golden (recall I changed it just two weeks ago) Also, it's very difficult to start the truck, then run to the rear and video a cloud of blue smoke blowing away in the wind, or take a picture in my rear view mirror as I'm driving to show evidence of the issues I am having.

Finally, my initial question was "has any one experienced this problem" and guess what, no one answered that here. Just commented that I am full of crap, or it's nothing major or I'm not providing enough evidence to validate my argument. If it's an expensive repair, I won't be able to afford it, that leaves me with a truck that is greatly reduced in resale value and get me back into negative equity on a trade in.

My final post on this thread, so thanks for the debate/comments/bullshit whatever. Have a good day.

 

Ya that's great, if the Toyota dealer ship in Prince George didn't disable the block heater over what they called " a fire hazard" more like money hungry service manager wanting work to rebuild a engine.

And what is credible oil usage data, want me to hook up a oil monitor that logs on to the cell network, I can give you a password so you can track it daily? Or just take my word for what I am experiencing and what I have to ultimately pay for or eat the shit on a garbage vehicle.

Finally, flatbed to the shop is not an option for me. It's my only vehicle, and I'm far from having a healthy bank account to rent or buy a new one. Another reason why I am so frustrated by what I am experiencing with this.

 

I have the same truck with 192,000 kms. I also drive 500km per week. No issues with my 3.5l. That engine is damn near bullet proof. I do a 15 minute warm up every day before leaving for work. Toyota still makes very high quality products but like any automotive product sometimes things fail earlier than expected. Your mechanic will be able to tell you what the issue is. Hopefully nothing major but you never know. I feel very lucky to not have had any mechanical issues in all this time but if it broke down tomorrow I would still think I was doing pretty good considering the mileage.

 

I don't really know how many more times I have to explain it so I guess I won't.

Yes, they disabled it because of a fire hazard. Another user on here actually posted a photo of his Tacoma fully engulfed in his garage due to said block heater. So no, it wasn't just a "money hungry service manager wanting work to rebuild an engine." I believe there was some sort of TSB or recall on it, but I don't know the specifics. My whole point was that having a block heater allowed you to have the block much warmer than -30 or -40 and thus reducing the wear. As I pointed out before, most of your wear occurs before the engine reaches operating temperature. The colder you get, the more you increase that wear. I've seen oil in those temps thicker than molasses. I don't care that it's the lightest weight oil you can buy, it's not flowing like normal. So when you're not giving any sort of warm up and it's -40 out, I don't know how much oil you'd even have at the top of your engine, furthering wear even more.

Like you said though, it could be the previous owner, it could be you, or it just could be a fluke. Either way, you've got a problem that needs dealing with.

Coming onto a forum and seeking advice but only focusing on confirmation bias for what you've already convinced yourself the problem is, isn't exactly the point in a forum. The point is to provide different viewpoints and ideas to hopefully help you address the problem. When you say these are cheaply built and there's lots of threads on these engines failing while ignoring the bias that can come from a forum, or the other threads of trouble free owners, and then simultaneously say that no one else has said they've had the same problem, it raises a few red flags for those just trying to help. I never said my suggestion was the end all, be all. I was just merely tossing out ideas that hadn't already been addressed up to that point and trying to account for other possibilities that we can't possibly know because we have no photos or videos and, most importantly, aren't there to see what you're seeing. Sometimes people go so far out of their way to see a problem that they're blinded by their own view and can't be convinced otherwise. I'm not saying that's what's necessarily happening here, but I've seen it many times and even done it myself.

But, all that being said, I do mean it when I say I'm genuinely curious to know what the dealership says is going on.

 

Credible as in some solid data. At their point you have not stated exactly how much oil it’s using.

As far as the marbles thing, it only makes sense not to drive it.

Block heaters, there are block heaters that aren’t causing fires. One of those could be installed.

And I’m not attacking you, don’t attack me. Trying to offer suggestions to help. Maybe rent a car and stop driving the truck?

 

Had my truck into an independent Toyota tech shop in Edmonton last week, I left the vehicle overnight so he could hear it on cold start up. THey went into the engine with a stethoscope and determined where the sound was coming from and gave a diagnosis and how to fix this.

In short: the engine is fucked.

In the long end: the tech said the noise on start up(tacka-tacka/knocking sound; by the way, this does not go away after warm up/long drives, and it is getting louder) is coming from the lower part of the engine, specifically being the connecting rods(one or more of the bearings has failed), the smoke is from oil getting past the oil seal rings on the lower part of the piston(these are below the compression rings). What caused this: he believes it was from the original owner not doing/following manufacture guidelines for oil changes every 8000 km/5000 miles. Some people will look at oil containers(synthetic) and it says "16,000 km or 24,000 km protection" This is marketing and total bullshit. Too much heat has built up in the engine due to broken down/sludgy oil, and it has taken this long for the issue to come to bear, and now it's my issue. Another cause may have been when the original buyer purchased the truck and did not follow proper break in procedures, raced the engine, maybe did some hard 4x4'ing with it and didn't change the oil before 8000 km(this is an assumption)

So, what do I do? A used engine with low kilometers installed: about $10,000; and Toyota short/long block installed: double the other price for the used. Not worth it.

Can I trade it in? maybe, providing the dealership doesn't find out about the issue during their assessment or I take a big hit on the trade value and absorb negative equity(not ideal)

Sell it? maybe, but that can come back on me really bad.

Very disappointing to say the least, as I have done everything up to this point with my truck in regards to maintenance. Regular oil services 8000 km or less, fix/replace worn parts, and have issues checked out by professional mechanics. Moral of the story: change your oil regularly and if you buy a new Toyota adhere to manufacture break in period. When I bought my 2012 new, I made sure to read the manual and follow the guidelines for break in period.

That's it, all from me. Good luck and I hope you don't have to deal with what I am now facing.

 

Thanks for the update and sorry to hear the bad news. I’m not sure what I’d do in this situation. Not easy.

OCI are a polarizing subject here. I personally always go with 8k km oil changes and observe the break-in period too. 2 prior vehicles were 14 (brand new 92 Toyota Truck) and 15 (2003 lease return Pathfinder) year ownerships with no engine oil related issues. That’s just me tho.

There are plenty examples on social media of people taking these trucks and doing all sorts of abusive damaging things to them and moving on. So there is a chance of getting something that was not well looked after.

Majority get lucky and purchase a nice one owner, documented, well looked after Tacoma and have no issues long term. The way some of these trucks are marketed tho and presented on social media as being indestructible makes me really think twice about buying a used one without heavy scrutiny and due diligence. The vehicle shortage has made this more difficult tho.

Good luck with your truck and whatever you decide to do.

 

Sorry to hear the previous owner did not take better care of your engine. I Agree with your 8000km/5000 mile oil change comment. The Car Nut Guy made this video where he tears down an engine at 180,000 miles and shows what the rings and cylinders look like based on Toyota advertised 10,000 mile oil change. Plenty of other posts debating the oil change interval so I’ll let the video speak for itself

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TJhFAwFv-O0

 

Well he did say that he thought the dip stick level went down about a quarter of the way between full and a quart low in 900km. He was way far off in estimating that to be 200-300 miles. 900km is about 560 miles, so extrapolating from what he told us, his truck is probably using a quart every 2250 miles or so. That may seem like a lot of oil usage but if you contact Toyota you'll find that that is well within their spec even for a new engine even though most of their engines use far less. I'd do a more formal oil consumption test and get a more accurate idea of how much it's using and go from there. My guess is that you just keep driving it until it's only going 1200 miles per quart. And if this is your only vehicle, what do you do when you need service that takes longer than an oil change? Do they not have rental cars in that part of Canada. Every once in a while my 35 y/o 911 blows some blue smoke on start up but that's happens sometimes when a horizontally opposed engine has been sitting for a while.