2024 Ford Ranger

Williston · Feb 8, 2023

Carmaker1 said: ↑

Amen, but I feel like I'm coming across as shrill on TW, so maybe I won't say too much this time. I left Lexus Enthusiast forum in July 2020, after 8 1/2 years there, back when it was a small blog and not yet a forum. I work for Ford and my spouse is a T6 engineer, in both Dearborn, Michigan and Campbellfield, Melbourne, Australia. I got the Ford job after we met each other in England over half a decade ago, following my departure from JLR.

And folks, when I referred to partisan discourse in another thread driving me away, it's posts like these that made me leave places like Lexus Enthusiast. A forum full of great young Lexus fanatics and Toyota Motor Company expert insiders, going back to the 2000s in their skillful insight. For me an uncomfortable line was crossed there, which put me in an awkward position and I left that site, to ensure not to make it personal and ruin any existing goodwill. I harbor no ill will now, but I wasn't going to defend my employer in that manner I almost felt forced to.

Now to turkey, that's some utter BS. I swear that some of you just log in and don't think through what you type up. Plenty of idiots are deriding the new Tacoma too and find it just as ridiculous. I've seen ugly and while this tester looks awkward, there are plenty of photos of it which don't look like this. Give it a rest and wait till it's official. Or take a peek at the new international spec Rangers, to give you idea which isn't really different from this USDM-spec Tooling Trial prototype build.

As for our other models? You are full of it, I'd figure LOL.

Ford World Headquarters Executive Design Approval of 2021MY P702 1:1 Clay Exterior - 11/17/2017

Our F-150 (P702), even on the day we approved this design in our courtyard in these very photos on November 17, 2017 (above), looked beautiful as can be and Toyota ironically who were finalizing the XK70 Tundra themselves at the same time as us, had to have been kidding themselves with that.

CALTY 2017 780B Program Exterior Clay Modelling

I think it's a cool truck regardless, even if too bold, but I can see why so many people are polarized by the Tundra.

You cannot say the same for our P702 F-150, which was deliberately made more vanilla than the previous P552 (MY2015-2020), which was much more bold and a design created in 2011 (modified in late 2015 for midcycle '18-20 MCA), yet still timeless today.

I say this as I'm working on teams for the next generation P736 and P800 Lightning...

Thank you, we own one (blue) in Brighton, Melbourne, which belongs to my spouse (owns that house there, I don't). It actually was stolen on New Year's morning after our house party (by some asshat guests) and the Brighton police ended up recovering it some 40 minutes away, in another jurisdiction within a different Melbourne suburb. They trashed the interior and left many cig burns on the Recaro seats, armrests and carpet. Unfortunately, I had left that morning back to Detroit via LAX connection from Melbourne on Jan 2, but saw the crime scene pictures from the PD and my spouse. Made use of my Everest instead, to commute from Brighton to Campbellfield.

I went with the SUV variant, 2023MY Everest Sport 3.0 V6 turbodiesel in the matching color as our Raptor. From the little time I had with it over the holidays, it is much more interesting than a 4Runner and I'd have it any day over that, save for a manual in the 4R. I'm truly proud of the work the P703 Ranger and U704 Everest teams did on these 2 vehicles over the last 7 years, but the latter won't be coming to the States when you have the Bronco (U725). My other older Everest XLT 2.2 (U375) in West Africa, is a bit more basic and manual transmission, the previous generation. I own a lot of Fords and Toyotas alongside luxury brands, but nothing GM nor "Chrysler" personally, even if I like the character of some of their products. I try to have no favorites, as long as I like product itself at the end of the day. GM has its strengths, but Ford and Toyota have absolute global appeal. Sad he we struggle in so many international markets, but I don't want to get into internal corporate politics on a Toyota forum and air out dirty laundry.

I understand this is a Toyota forum, but you don't have to be a Ford guy to appreciate a decent truck. I'm a Ford guy and went home from the hospital in a British (German) Ford Granada (Merkur Scorpio), plus work for the company now. I also own many Toyotas globally and happily share the future of many Toyota truck nameplates, just I've done so with Fords on other forums and daily encounters with enthusiasts. In fact, I comment more on Toyotas because of my NDAs at Ford. Some people actually think I still work for Toyota, like I briefly did in the distant past. That is how objective I am, but other people often can't bring themselves to that level of neutrality, even when there's no paycheck involved like my case.

Exactly, my man. This is absolutely golden. I left a Lexus forum I used to go to for years (and help share insight like I do here), when the 2021 Bronco debuted on July 13, 2020 and after some members I greatly, greatly respected (for years 1000x over) couldn't attack it based on appearance as a 5G 4Runner owner, they chose to attack it on partisan expectation it will be a failure, simply because it's a Ford and not a Toyota. One fellow engineer (forum member) there, also made it their business to egg on bad faith discussion and mention how a naturally aspirated 6.2L first gen Raptor (P415) struggling to get up Mt. Everest to a 70-Series, when it wasn't designed for that climate in the first place. It was designed for high speed desert running in the desert Southwest USA. I own MANY F-150 Raptors. A high mileage a 2011 6.2 Super Cab (bought used), with over 200k on it, a 2014 SuperCrew with a Whipple S/C (bought used), 2019 802A SCrew, and now a 2021 Gen 3 Ecoboost SuperCrew (plus my partner's RR). They have little issues, especially that we are rough with our trucks and keep in both Texas and Michigan. My Tacoma sees the least action.

Anyway, factoring in my 2011, I considered the premature attacks to be petty BS (seeing as what happened with 2022 Tundra hiccups later), which I had it up to here with and no longer saw that crowd there as the objective enthusiasts, whom I had posted with over the years on the greatest of terms about not just Lexus and Toyota, but other vehicles neutrally (except Acura LOL). It became a polarizingly partisan circle jerk full of snarky digs towards anything non-Toyota, so I left and chose not to fight back citing Toyota and Lexus' own failures, as a Ford professional. Particularly with the Tundra and not Tacoma. I chose to be diplomatic, unlike them and not go there, when Lexus failed to do so many things all of us had hoped for either. My spouse worked on that Bronco and I was proud of it, finally going public, only to see that rain down on my enthusiasm.

What I see here on TW at times almost drives me in that direction, because truth be told, shit-talking my employer without being able to cite the hard facts to back it up their attacks, feels like I am being baited to defend a multi-billion dollar Fortune 500 company who would rather me keep silent as a middle management employee, than be their sole voice and not senior marketing executive personnel in that scenario. I tolerate it more, because I understand that the environment here is different and over there it was like a cotton candy land, until that point. No one ever argued there and discourse was like being in the priesthood, for it to go south so quickly. If TW was like a convent that turned into a strip club overnight, it feel would similar to how I felt.

That's not the issue here. Your opinion a Ford truck is not your cup of tea, is definitely your right in my opinion as a Ford employee. It really is an issue, when you turn into an irrational hate fest. I don't think I've seen you do that, but definitely some other dudes have in this thread and it's childish. In my shoes, if someone wants to badmouth Ford and become extremely loud about it, especially a vehicle my spouse worked on as a senior engineer with lead responsibilities for this exact vehicle here in Michigan and Australia, then yeah I will take it personal somewhat and leave a forum if it gains too much acclaim (like 90% in favor). At that point, I am dealing with a partisan atmosphere and no longer one where folks can have their preferences, without being overly opinionated.

I am not sure if you are referring to the Yuma frame Ranger, which was manufactured in 3 different generations from 1982 to 2011 or if you mean the T6 Ranger (P375), developed in Australia originally from 2006 to 2011. That latter Ranger (P375) was designed to have softer, carlike curves, as that's what the international market favored. This is the original my predecessors' designed in Toorak, Australia from 2006 to 2008 and later put into production in August 2011 in Thailand and South Africa.

They don't need their trucks to look mucho macho and blocky, like Americans and Mexicans often prefer. Australians weren't too pleased with this blockier new P703 design, when it leaked in 2019 (clay mockup photos), because their tastes are different. They don't like blocky styling in general, but they did eventually fall in love with the new P703 for 2022.

The first version from 2011 is above, which gradually became what is sold in American showrooms currently and federalized at last minute for USA under the tenure of Mark Fields as Ford CEO, when he needed to justify the Bronco in a US factory and also get marketshare against GM's 2014 return to the midsize truck segment, during the last update to this generation for global markets. P375 aka T6 Ranger was never designed for the USA originally and meant for Australia, Oceania, Asia, Europe, and Latin America. Under our past CEO Alan Mullally (2006-2014), who saved Ford from bankruptcy and presided over development of this Ranger, he adamantly refused for it to be sold and marketed in the United States, even after killing off the original Ranger and shuttering our original Ranger Twin Cities plant in St. Paul, Minnesota in 2011.

The annoying thing is, so many Americans fought and complained over not having the choice to buy this truck back in the early-mid 2010s, while rich Mexicans could and often drove over the border with Chihuahua or Baja California plates in those early examples and refresh 2015-18 versions.

Well, I find it ridiculous how a decade later, it's been here since 2019 as the P375N and so many people trash talk these P375N Rangers and show the grass isn't so green on the other side, seeing as the rest of the world doesn't get the F-Series and only the Ranger, yet love it for what it is. VW didn't even bother with the Amarok for America, as they'll ask for it here, then hate on it once it comes LOL and not buy it at all.

The Maverick (P758) was designed off of this P703 truck anyway, because the Ranger design you see in the photos was being ironed out in late 2018, before it reached this stage of design review for formal approval in January 2019 below.

So, no the Ranger came first and just took longer to engineer. The design approval occurred that early, because the truck was originally due in Q4 2021. Due to COVID, launch got delayed across the board significantly in all markets into 2022 and 2023 (USDM).

Toyota luckily has managed the Tacoma 920B program delays much better, just like the 780B Tundra program from 2019 to 2021. Tundra post-COVID only slipped with the hybrid versions, while Tacoma got delayed some 4 months. P702 F-150 got delayed about half a year, in 2020 while the U725 Bronco was miserably late shifting full launch in January 2021 to becoming scattered across Summer 2021 and reservations backlogged to present 2023, and the P703/N Ranger deathly late to market by many months. However, Toyota was behind on the Tundra even before COVID and will launch the new Tacoma, 17 months behind schedule (pre-2019 internal projections for MY 2023).

In short, the Maverick is inspired by the larger new P703 Ranger, which took inspiration from the F-Series line and is an homage to this 1982 original.

Saying, "that doesn't look good to me" is nothing of issue at all. It's just an opinion, but that isn't what always happens on TW and I think some of us are referring to that kind of behavior.

Once again, thank you. We need more of your kind on TW, because I'm a Toyota guy by vehicle ownership and a Ford guy by both profession and ownership.

That is not the issue here, at least for me. It is the obvious over the top hate fest, I often come across on here that takes it behind general observation and simple subjective opinion, which everyone is entitled to with our tastes. It is not a fact any of our Ford trucks are ugly, so I'm sure that can be better expressed as an opinion and not a fact like some people here tend to do.

I unfortunately have to admit, the inspiration for every truck in the midsize segment, was the 2nd and 3rd generation Tacoma and Hilux as well, dependent on launch date though. The 2012 Ranger (P375) studied the 2nd gen, 31xx GM cousins did as well, H61P Frontier (2022) the 3rd gen, and D23 Navara borrowed from the 2nd generation truck. I could name many more. Anyone want to argue with me on that, be my guest.

If not, check out their respective preceding generations from the 2000s and you'll see what I am talking about. They looked different and more original. Toyota defined the zeitgeist of this segment, no joke. I can't tell you how many "looks like a Frontier", "looks like a Colorado" comments on the new 2024 Tacoma I keep seeing and they ignorantly don't realize, the 2005-2015 model year Tacoma and the 2005-2015 Hilux, set the template to follow going forward design wise.

Evolving your own design, doesn't make for being a copy of your not so original competition. Forgive me for that Ford gods.

Really, are you sure it wasn't this one in 1993?

When the 1994 Ram debuted at the Detroit Auto Show on January 5, 1993 and launched in showrooms October 1, 1993, it changed pickups forever.

Trucks became over the top and even though I was a kid back then, I learned from alumni as adult here at Ford, that the PHN131 Super Duty program was immediately ordered in 1993 upon seeing that truck, which Lee Iacocca himself made happen in the late 80s before he retired 4 days ahead of reveal.

They finished that PHN131 design by 1995 and it debuted as the Super Duty in 1998, whereas the PN96 F-150 curvy design for early '96 was too late to change and already dialed in for production. The next gen F-150 (P221) went blocky in 2003.

Okay then, I love mine just fine and feel we did a great job with it, under 3 different CEOs.

Thank you for being fair here, as it's uncomfortable to come across anti-Ford posts, which are not from objective fact. My spouse worked on this program, Bronco, and Everest across both Michigan and Australia, particularly when we first met each other in England.

That's exactly what I have, 2022 Badlands 2-door 2.3L 7MT Sasquatch. That's my main commuter manual to Dearborn or my Raptor (auto of course).
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WOW! Outstanding post: Thank you. Pictures. Insights. History. "Insider" photographs and info. I will be combing through this (your post) for days. I know I already said this, but:

Thank you.

Black Bean Taco · Feb 8, 2023

Williston said: ↑

I was parked next to a Ford Maverick in a parking lot a few days ago. I like Ford's and my son has a nice F150, so I took a look through the driver's window and was surprised to see lots of what looked like hard, cheap plastic. It's also smaller than I thought it would be. The interior looked small as well. No idea what trim level it had, and I wasn't expecting to see a "Limited" level of trim, but it still surprised me. I wouldn't label it: "Utilitarian". First word that came to mind was: "Fleet". I was also surprised to see that the bed wasn't separate from the cab. I personally don't know why anyone would want a truck smaller than a Tacoma/Ranger/Colorado/Frontier. Smaller than a Tundra, F150 or Silverado I can understand.
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Yeah the bed is connected to the cab bc it’s not a body-on-frame vehicle. It’s built like a crossover suv. Also, the idea I think is for people who want really good mpg and a car-like ride (they have independent rear suspension). It’s an on-road city-dweller type truck. Not that there’s anything wrong with that. But it was built to be compact, with high mpgs.

I like ground clearance and modability so I like midsize and full size trucks but I see a use case for the maverick (and they’re selling like hotcakes too)

shakerhood · Feb 8, 2023

Williston said: ↑

I was parked next to a Ford Maverick in a parking lot a few days ago. I like Ford's and my son has a nice 2016 F150 4x4 XLT Sport, so I took a look through the driver's window and was surprised to see lots of what looked like hard, cheap plastic. It's also smaller than I thought it would be. The interior looked small as well. No idea what trim level it had, and I wasn't expecting to see a "Limited" level of trim, but it still surprised me. I wouldn't label it: "Utilitarian". First word that came to mind was: "Fleet". I was also surprised to see that the bed wasn't separate from the cab. I personally don't know why anyone would want a truck smaller than a Tacoma/Ranger/Colorado/Frontier. Smaller than a Tundra, F150 or Silverado I can understand.
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The Maverick actually has more interior volume than our Tacoma's according to what l can find online, it shows 100.1 for the Tacoma and 100.3 for the Maverick.

2023 Ford Maverick Dimensions - iSeeCars.com

2023 Toyota Tacoma Dimensions - iSeeCars.com

SwollenGoat · Feb 10, 2023

Williston said: ↑

I was parked next to a Ford Maverick in a parking lot a few days ago. I like Ford's and my son has a nice 2016 F150 4x4 XLT Sport, so I took a look through the driver's window and was surprised to see lots of what looked like hard, cheap plastic. It's also smaller than I thought it would be. The interior looked small as well. No idea what trim level it had, and I wasn't expecting to see a "Limited" level of trim, but it still surprised me. I wouldn't label it: "Utilitarian". First word that came to mind was: "Fleet". I was also surprised to see that the bed wasn't separate from the cab. I personally don't know why anyone would want a truck smaller than a Tacoma/Ranger/Colorado/Frontier. Smaller than a Tundra, F150 or Silverado I can understand.
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While not a huge slice of the market, I know a few guys who want something smaller than the current Tacoma, those guys still holding on to 2WD regular cab 80-90s mini trucks. “Fleet” styled is more than enough for a ton of people as Ford had to quit taking orders. Personally wanted a basic interior because I run a lot of dirt roads, why I bought a SR, Toyota missed the mark by not offering rubber flooring, vinyl seats and rear seat delete with the V6.

Chucky888_2021_TRD_OR · Feb 10, 2023

SwollenGoat said: ↑

While not a huge slice of the market, I know a few guys who want something smaller than the current Tacoma, those guys still holding on to 2WD regular cab 80-90s mini trucks. “Fleet” styled is more than enough for a ton of people as Ford had to quit taking orders. Personally wanted a basic interior because I run a lot of dirt roads, why I bought a SR, Toyota missed the mark by not offering rubber flooring, vinyl seats and rear seat delete with the V6.
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Yes, there are people want just that. My co-worker is one, he is on his 3rd Ranger (older one, not the new Ranger).
There are people who wants just a plain-jane compact pickup with a 6 foot bed, 2WD and regular cab.

SwollenGoat · Feb 10, 2023

Chucky888_2021_TRD_OR said: ↑

Yes, there are people want just that. My co-worker is one, he is on his 3rd Ranger (older one, not the new Ranger).
There are people who wants a just plain-jane compact pickup with a 6 foot bed, 2WD and regular cab.
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Was chatting with a guy that had a 2WD RC Toyota at the gas station the other day, said would love a new one of what he already has, unfortunately they quit making them. He was a retired truck driver, stated he loves running around in his little truck coming off of driving semis for most of his life.

Black Bean Taco · Feb 10, 2023

SwollenGoat said: ↑

While not a huge slice of the market, I know a few guys who want something smaller than the current Tacoma, those guys still holding on to 2WD regular cab 80-90s mini trucks. “Fleet” styled is more than enough for a ton of people as Ford had to quit taking orders. Personally wanted a basic interior because I run a lot of dirt roads, why I bought a SR, Toyota missed the mark by not offering rubber flooring, vinyl seats and rear seat delete with the V6.
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I have a second gen reg cab and honestly don’t think I’d want anything smaller unless i had a second vehicle to daily. Even as a single 25 year old I end up filling the cab quickly with cargo and junk. 2nd gen reg cab is a good happy medium tho imo. Oh and living in Maine, 4x4 is a MUST and I like having the fender flares

SwollenGoat · Feb 10, 2023

Black Bean Taco said: ↑

I have a second gen reg cab and honestly don’t think I’d want anything smaller unless i had a second vehicle to daily. Even as a single 25 year old I end up filling the cab quickly with cargo and junk. 2nd gen reg cab is a good happy medium tho imo. Oh and living in Maine, 4x4 is a MUST and I like having the fender flares
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My ‘92 was a single cab, and yearned for an extra cab. Awful nice having that little extra space behind the seat. Think RC mini trucks fell out of favor when manufacturers started offering small city vans, they do make more sense for local businesses doing deliveries, though those are getting discontinued too.

North7 · Feb 10, 2023

Something happened at Ford when the new guy took control. Alot of dealers got greedy, quality suffered. Blaming everything on Covid seemed to be Fords answer.

Black Bean Taco · Feb 10, 2023

SwollenGoat said: ↑

My ‘92 was a single cab, and yearned for an extra cab. Awful nice having that little extra space behind the seat. Think RC mini trucks fell out of favor when manufacturers started offering small city vans, they do make more sense for local businesses doing deliveries, though those are getting discontinued too.
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Yeah there’s a decent amount of space behind the second gen seats but I’m jealous of those 2nd gen tundra reg cabs with like a foot

SwollenGoat · Feb 10, 2023

Black Bean Taco said: ↑

Yeah there’s a decent amount of space behind the second gen seats but I’m jealous of those 2nd gen tundra reg cabs with like a foot
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That is what a wanted instead of the Tacoma, could of really used an 8’ bed, too bad they quit making them. So an AC Taco and a 5X8’ trailer will have to do. Did look at other regular cab fullsizes, but after driving extra cabs for the last 20 years, felt like my head was to close to the rear glass. That and it is nice to have a few things back there that are in easy reach, not having to jump out of the cab and dig in the bed.

Black Bean Taco · Feb 10, 2023

SwollenGoat said: ↑

That is what a wanted instead of the Tacoma, could of really used an 8’ bed, too bad they quit making them. So an AC Taco and a 5X8’ trailer will have to do. Did look at other regular cab fullsizes, but after driving extra cabs for the last 20 years, felt like my head was to close to the rear glass. That and it is nice to have a few things back there that are in easy reach, not having to jump out of the cab and dig in the bed.
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one nice thing about the single cab tho is the ability to EASILY open the slider. At least there’s that!

SwollenGoat · Feb 10, 2023

Black Bean Taco said: ↑

one nice thing about the single cab tho is the ability to EASILY open the slider. At least there’s that!
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Ha! Indeed it is! Could reach it fairyland easily in my 1st Gen, it is a bit of a stretch in my 3rd. Next truck will be power.

Black Bean Taco · Feb 11, 2023

SwollenGoat said: ↑

Ha! Indeed it is! Could reach it fairyland easily in my 1st Gen, it is a bit of a stretch in my 3rd. Next truck will be power.
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I think people have done power conversions but maybe too much work for what it is. I never bothered to power mine for obvious reasons

ColoradoTJ · Feb 11, 2023

Sinister184 said: ↑

That front end looks kinda feminine. Maybe it's just me.
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Love to hear this explanation...

Sinister184 · Feb 11, 2023

ColoradoTJ said: ↑

Love to hear this explanation...
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Rounded edges, pinched nose, the grill looks smiley. I don’t know. Just looks muted; at least in that configuration. It’s mainly the new front end.

batacoma · Feb 11, 2023

Cpl. Punishment said: ↑

Just because those are ugly doesn't mean Ford trucks aren't also ugly.
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3rd gen Tundra and 14th gen F-150 have similar front ends. Overall, grilles are about the same size. The headlights, or headlights+vents occupy the same space of real estate. The major differences are Tundra has the mustache, and F-150 has front bumper that's seperate from the rest of the front fascia.

SwollenGoat · Feb 11, 2023

batacoma said: ↑

3rd gen Tundra and 14th gen F-150 have similar front ends. Overall, grilles are about the same size. The headlights, or headlights+vents occupy the same space of real estate. The major differences are Tundra has the mustache, and F-150 has front bumper that's seperate from the rest of the front fascia.

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New Tundra looks the ‘15-17 F150s.

Adventure Motors is doing a Sequoia conversion. Looks a bit better, me thinks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4I5DDahbKKU

batacoma · Feb 11, 2023

SwollenGoat said: ↑

Adventure Motors is doing a Sequoia conversion. Looks a bit better, me thinks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4I5DDahbKKU
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Seen it, and that's a good looking truck they got over there. I'd still like to see the Sequioa front end with an OEM steel or aluminum front bumper.

SwollenGoat · Feb 11, 2023

batacoma said: ↑

Seen it, and that's a good looking truck they got over there. I'd still like to see the Sequioa front end with an OEM steel or aluminum front bumper.
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Yeah not crazy about how the whole front ends on todays SUV/trucks are mostly plastic.

At least the after market has a solution.

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