1. Welcome to Tacoma World!

    You are currently viewing as a guest! To get full-access, you need to register for a FREE account.

    As a registered member, you’ll be able to:
    • Participate in all Tacoma discussion topics
    • Communicate privately with other Tacoma owners from around the world
    • Post your own photos in our Members Gallery
    • Access all special features of the site

3rd Gen HID vs LED vs Halogen H11 projector headlights

Discussion in '3rd Gen. Tacomas (2016+)' started by crashnburn80, Jan 25, 2019.

  1. Nov 12, 2020 at 11:08 AM
    #3621
    Toy_Runner

    Toy_Runner Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2019
    Member:
    #311172
    Messages:
    115
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    99 4Runner SR5
    3" OME lift, heavy coils f/r 3/16" steel skids Modified Coastal Offroad diy bumper 5spd swap ('98 donor)
    I haven't read every states lighting codes, so I guess I need to qualify my statement: I have yet to see a clear cut requirement for a dealer or manufacturer to ensure legal aim for headlamps prior to a customer taking possession of a vehicle.

    Additionally, headlight aim should not be treated as a static condition. While you should aim your vehicles headlights based on typical loading (typical #of passengers, 1/2 tank fuel, typical cargo load) you should also check and adjust their aim when you have exceeded these typical loads (e.g. taking a long drive with lots of cargo, towing, etc) or have changed the vehicles ride height in some way (addition of a lift, new tires, etc etc). And obviously if you have changed aone characteristic of the lampa themselves.

    A shop that has a certified aiming machine would be best, but daniel stern has an excellent article barring that.
     
  2. Nov 12, 2020 at 4:02 PM
    #3622
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2015
    Member:
    #156893
    Messages:
    10,828
    Gender:
    Male
    Kirkland, WA
    Vehicle:
    2015 DCSB TRD OR MGM
    Go Hawks!
    The recommended H9 is Philips, but you should still see a significant increase. If you are driving in urban areas you might not notice as much as the light color is about the same, but if you go somewhere truly dark it should be a very noticeable improvement. Several have also said that they felt the 3rd Gen lights were aimed a bit low from the factory, it is worth checking the aim per the instructions listed by @Toy_Runner.
     
    Aws123 likes this.
  3. Nov 13, 2020 at 1:42 PM
    #3623
    fj45Jeff

    fj45Jeff Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2020
    Member:
    #333225
    Messages:
    25
    Gender:
    Male
    Vancouver, BC, Canada, eh!
    Vehicle:
    2020 Black Taco TRD Offroad
    Wayyyyy back in this 184 page thread it was suggested that these GE's are great options for a plug n play upgrade. I checked them on Amazon, prices is pretty damn good at $36 CDN, but then it warns me this will not fit my 2020 Tacoma OR? So if that's the case, what is the simplest plug n play headlight bulb upgrade that isn't going to void any warranty?

    upload_2020-11-13_13-39-31.jpg
     
  4. Nov 13, 2020 at 5:58 PM
    #3624
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2015
    Member:
    #156893
    Messages:
    10,828
    Gender:
    Male
    Kirkland, WA
    Vehicle:
    2015 DCSB TRD OR MGM
    Go Hawks!
    You could have just checked post #2 with that info. :)

    If you don’t have factory LED headlights, your truck takes H11 bulbs, and either the GE Xenon +120 or GE Megalight +130 are the best performing options.
     
    fj45Jeff and NMTrailRider like this.
  5. Nov 13, 2020 at 7:37 PM
    #3625
    smikec

    smikec Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2018
    Member:
    #272376
    Messages:
    267
    Gender:
    Male
    can you link to where you found these on Amazon for $36 CAN?
    I searched Amazon.ca and do not see anything in that price range, or availability.

    Thx
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2020
  6. Nov 13, 2020 at 10:57 PM
    #3626
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2015
    Member:
    #156893
    Messages:
    10,828
    Gender:
    Male
    Kirkland, WA
    Vehicle:
    2015 DCSB TRD OR MGM
    Go Hawks!
    Toyota OEM LED Headlights (consolidated post)
    Original posts are here, here and here.

    Beam pattern

    Right beam only pictured. The beam pattern looks to be excellent, the hot spot is right up at the cut off where it should be and the highest intensity parts of the pattern carry up near the cut off across the pattern with a very smooth and full natural blend downward.
    [​IMG]

    GE +130 vs OEM LED
    The GEs certainly look brighter in this picture, but the measurements say otherwise. The OEM LEDs do have uplight above the cut offs unlike Morimotos, (headlights are supposed to have mild uplight) though that uplight appears less than the halogens running performance bulbs. The OEM LEDs appear to do an great job of matching the halogen pattern in light distribution.
    [​IMG]

    Here is where it gets interesting.
    Recall the most efficient form of lighting projection technology is well designed reflector. A reflector is far more efficient than a projector, which blocks light from leaving the assembly, but the projector does have a small form factor advantage which is often why they are often used. The 3rd Gens projector headlights were a significant downgrade in performance than the massive 2nd Gen reflectors, but it allowed for more modern styling. If you look at KC's gravity series, their lights outperform the competition using a fraction of the power and lumen output because they use highly focused reflectors which are drastically more efficient. Their 8w G4 gravity fog can go toe to toe with a 22w projector based Rigid fog. While some might bash Toyota's decision to use reflector LED headlights instead of projectors, it is the higher performing more efficient technology and the better engineering design decision.

    Using a more efficient projection technology, one might expect the OEM LED headlights to draw less power than say Morimoto who which uses less efficient projectors. But they don't. They draw more. Morimotos draw 1.46A, or about 20.2w. The OEM LED headlights draw 60% more power at 2.34A, or about 32.3w. Combine higher power with higher efficiency projection and the results shouldn't be suprising.

    OEM LED low beam draw
    [​IMG]

    As measured at 18', Morimoto vs OEM:
    [​IMG]

    German Philips H9s vs OEM:
    [​IMG]

    The OEM LEDs have excellent beam pattern distribution, they don't have the odd dark spots below the hot spot that Morimoto has or the less than ideal double cut off low hot spot, the OEM lights have appropriate uplight unlike Morimoto and they are higher in peak intensity output than Morimoto or a Philips H9 bulb swap. To further put the low beam performance in perspective, lux at 18' with the OEM LEDs is higher than the Xenon Depot brand HID swap, while being street legal without blinding glare.


    OEM LED Headlight distance test
    Headlights ran for ~30 minutes for stable temp readings.

    German Philips H9 vs OEM LED in 42' test
    [​IMG]

    OEM LED vs German Philips H9 swap
    [​IMG]

    The OEM LED is the highest intensity street legal option tested yet. While the Philips H9s are about 10% lower in peak intensity than the OEM LED, keep in mind the Philips halogens will fade by 30% over the course of their lifetime, meaning in the later stages of the bulb life the LEDs will be substantially brighter.

    Compared to Morimotos, the OEM has higher peak intensity at 42'. However, the Morimotos do have a slight edge on color temperature, but not enough of a difference to be a factor in the decision making.
    [​IMG]

    Compared to stock the OEM assemblies are a substantial upgrade, nearing double peak intensity output.
    [​IMG]


    Based on the low beam distance test, the OEM LED headlights appear to be the best performing off the shelf low beam headlight on the market for the Tacoma. If you do not need to worry about icing in snow environments, these look like a solid buy as an outstanding performing headlight. For environments where regular snow is a concern, a halogen upgrade would be more appropriate.

    OEM LED High Beam Testing
    This is an imperfect test. The OEM LED high beam is very different than the high beams of the OEM halogen headlights or the Morimoto LED headlights. The OEM LED high beam focus is much lower and significantly overlaps the low beam pattern at the cut off horizon. Both the OEM halogen and Morimoto high beam hot spot is cleanly above the low beam pattern.

    In the photo below, showing both low and high beam from the OEM halogens with an H9 swap and the OEM LEDs, both lights have the low beam cut off set right to the top of the 2nd door panel. You can see how the halogen high beam hot spot is much higher, while the LED high beam is much more of a super low beam with uplight.

    [​IMG]

    To give an idea of overlap, this is the right OEM LED high beam only, low beam disabled. The low beam cut off is set to the top of the 2nd panel, but disabled, showing the amount of overlap below the panel which is not present in the OEM halogens or Morimoto assemblies. Note the outstanding uniform spread and smooth uniform transition in the vertical light.

    [​IMG]

    Compared to the Morimoto high beam, shown with low beam enabled. Not a uniform spread or smooth pattern high beam.

    [​IMG]

    Here is where things get a little murky and why I say the test is imperfect. In my pattern testing I find the peak intensity in the pattern and if it is not in the correct location I note it in the review. With the OEM high beam having such a low aim overlapping the low beam, it is extremely difficult to determine the high beam peak intensity without bleeding into the low beam. So I decided the best way to do this was disable the low beam and measure the high beam independently, but that does pay a tax against the OEM LED high beam as it then does not benefit from the low beam uplight that the halogen high beam units benefit from. So it makes the OEM LEDs look slightly worse than they actually are. The Morimotos use projector cut offs, so they are not affected in measured numbers.

    But regardless, the OEM LEDs have the highest intensity output compared to stock or Morimoto.

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    I think the raw numbers are a little misleading though. They would have you think the OEM LED high beams are just slightly better than the halogen high beam. But because of the lower beam orientation and the overlap with upper cut off of the low beam, the LED high beams should offer exceptional down road visibility, prioritizing light intensity output where it is most important and most useful.
     
  7. Nov 14, 2020 at 6:18 PM
    #3627
    fj45Jeff

    fj45Jeff Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2020
    Member:
    #333225
    Messages:
    25
    Gender:
    Male
    Vancouver, BC, Canada, eh!
    Vehicle:
    2020 Black Taco TRD Offroad
  8. Nov 15, 2020 at 1:11 AM
    #3628
    smikec

    smikec Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2018
    Member:
    #272376
    Messages:
    267
    Gender:
    Male
    Those are H1 bulbs you listed for 39.99, not H11 (unless I'm totally missing something)
    I have yet to find H11 Ge Nighthawk +120's or Megalight 130's in Canada (I bought mine from the UK)
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2020
    Too Stroked likes this.
  9. Nov 15, 2020 at 9:21 AM
    #3629
    Redline870

    Redline870 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2018
    Member:
    #268773
    Messages:
    636
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2018 Cement Tacoma TRD Off-Road
    Remember when TRS was in here constantly talking about how the Morimoto headlight was better than the OEM LED headlights? What could they have been basing this on because it’s clearly not the case!

    Awesome work! I’d like to see how they compare to the Alpha Rex headlights.
     
  10. Nov 15, 2020 at 9:30 AM
    #3630
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2015
    Member:
    #156893
    Messages:
    10,828
    Gender:
    Male
    Kirkland, WA
    Vehicle:
    2015 DCSB TRD OR MGM
    Go Hawks!
    AlphaRex does not appear to be a legitimate headlight product. More info my post and quoted posts here. This is also linked in the top of post #3 on LED headlights.
     
  11. Nov 15, 2020 at 10:26 AM
    #3631
    fj45Jeff

    fj45Jeff Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2020
    Member:
    #333225
    Messages:
    25
    Gender:
    Male
    Vancouver, BC, Canada, eh!
    Vehicle:
    2020 Black Taco TRD Offroad

    D'oh! Thanks for noticing that! The link back in the original post goes to an H1 as well, I had just copied that info into Amazon.ca. Well at least they hadn't shipped yet and was able to cancel the order.
     
    davidstacoma likes this.
  12. Nov 15, 2020 at 12:23 PM
    #3632
    kwill

    kwill Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2015
    Member:
    #163486
    Messages:
    173
    Gender:
    Male
    I ordered some of those GE H11s on Amazon and they came from Canada. I swear they were salvaged from a wreck. They were even muddy! The packaging looked reclaimed too. I returned them immediately.
     
  13. Nov 15, 2020 at 12:43 PM
    #3633
    smikec

    smikec Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2018
    Member:
    #272376
    Messages:
    267
    Gender:
    Male
    Good you caught that, the next post would be, why didn't they fit!

    The GE +120 nighthawks haven't been available in H11 for awhile. I assume they are discontinued.
    However, someone found Tungsram nighthawks a few posts/pages back, which presumably is the same ones rebranded.
    https://www.walmart.com/ip/Tungsram...9=pla&wl10=8175035&wl11=online&wl12=313412664

    Still not from Canada though (not that it matters where they come from), but I don't think walmart.com ships to Canada.
     
    crashnburn80 [OP] likes this.
  14. Nov 15, 2020 at 12:48 PM
    #3634
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2015
    Member:
    #156893
    Messages:
    10,828
    Gender:
    Male
    Kirkland, WA
    Vehicle:
    2015 DCSB TRD OR MGM
    Go Hawks!
    Earlier I completely missed those were the updated branding Tungsram version. Good to see those available again under the new label.
     
  15. Nov 15, 2020 at 3:18 PM
    #3635
    Too Stroked

    Too Stroked Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2017
    Member:
    #208501
    Messages:
    2,092
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Tom
    South shore of Lake Ontario
    Vehicle:
    2014 Tacoma TRD Sport 4x4
    They're better looking. :rofl:
     
  16. Nov 16, 2020 at 7:53 AM
    #3636
    Jbarth

    Jbarth Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 5, 2019
    Member:
    #292366
    Messages:
    66
    Gender:
    Male
    Albuquerque, New Mexico
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRD OR
    Morimoto just announced/released 2stroke 3.0 leds. The advert Does mention specific tuning for a reflector. Any chance you might be getting a set for testing in our projector headlights?
     
    Jpalafox and antlab67 like this.
  17. Nov 16, 2020 at 7:56 AM
    #3637
    Invid

    Invid Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2015
    Member:
    #172581
    Messages:
    1,009
    Gender:
    Male
    New Braunfels, Texas
    Vehicle:
    2016 Tacoma Limited
    Send him a set.
     
    Rainoffire and Boghog1 like this.
  18. Nov 16, 2020 at 8:00 AM
    #3638
    mynameistory

    mynameistory Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2012
    Member:
    #81862
    Messages:
    528
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Tory
    Redondo Beach, CA
    Vehicle:
    4Runner


    MORIMOTO 3.0, THE HEADLIGHTS THAT VAPE! :rofl:
     
    Aws123 likes this.
  19. Nov 16, 2020 at 8:01 AM
    #3639
    Too Stroked

    Too Stroked Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2017
    Member:
    #208501
    Messages:
    2,092
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Tom
    South shore of Lake Ontario
    Vehicle:
    2014 Tacoma TRD Sport 4x4
    Stop me if you've heard this one before.
     
  20. Nov 16, 2020 at 9:09 AM
    #3640
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2015
    Member:
    #156893
    Messages:
    10,828
    Gender:
    Male
    Kirkland, WA
    Vehicle:
    2015 DCSB TRD OR MGM
    Go Hawks!
    I got the email this morning on the 3.0s. What is really interesting, is this measurement detail from the email:

    upload_2020-11-16_8-37-26.jpg

    I had heard that a new 2mm emitter face to emitter face was coming from in the industry, but I didn't at all anticipate it to be Morimoto. Recall that so far the best LED width has been Hikari Ultra with a 2.64mm measurement between emitter faces. If this add it true, these are substantially better from a width perspective, which if the emitters are accurately sized will also mean better focus. These would be the closest by far to the ideal 1.42mm width as measured on a halogen H11 filament.

    upload_2020-11-16_8-47-33.jpg

    Nice to see initial and stable output specs. 2100 lumens is impressive, initially it may seem like an H9 equivalent but recall that an H9 is 2100 lumens (+/- 15%) at 13.2v. The upper end of the allowance with a bulb like Philips is closer to 2400 lumens at 13.2v, but with the truck running the voltage is close to around 13.8v and output increases exponentially with voltage. So they won't outperform the best halogens as they still won't have the output or focus of a halogen, but these look substantially better than the Hikari Ultras.

    I'll have to get ahold of a set to test. The price though isn't anything to sneeze at, being listed at $175.
     

Products Discussed in

To Top