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3rd Gen HID vs LED vs Halogen H11 projector headlights

Discussion in '3rd Gen. Tacomas (2016+)' started by crashnburn80, Jan 25, 2019.

  1. Dec 22, 2021 at 1:24 PM
    #5501
    Saturnine

    Saturnine I am a meat popsicle

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    That's a better result than anything for the taco
     
  2. Dec 23, 2021 at 4:34 PM
    #5502
    brandon78lusch

    brandon78lusch Well-Known Member

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    I was looking at the vehicle lighting laws for each state and I came across this for North Carolina. I thought a general service lamp was any reflector style housing, which is anything from a halogen hand-held flashlight to a halogen reflector headlight. Can anyone explain whether this only applies to aftermarket modifications which alters light output, or if this is restricting halogen reflector headlights on cars?
    upload_2021-12-23_19-31-55.jpg
     
  3. Dec 23, 2021 at 9:11 PM
    #5503
    JustinTRD20

    JustinTRD20 Member

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    Recently changed my low beam H11s to H9s (by modifying the H9 itself) and a few weeks later noticed it's out. Checked the H9 and it looked fine. Tried plugging the H11 back in and that won't turn on either. It's late so I haven't got to check the fuse box yet, but is there a possibility I fried my harness? Just wondering if anyone else had a similar issue.
     
  4. Dec 23, 2021 at 9:28 PM
    #5504
    Toy_Runner

    Toy_Runner Well-Known Member

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    A standard H9 should only draw about 10w more than an H11, well within the factory wirings ability to handle. Check the pigtail to the bulb for any signs of chafing/damaged insulation (most likely place to be damaged) then check your fuses.
     
  5. Dec 23, 2021 at 9:37 PM
    #5505
    JustinTRD20

    JustinTRD20 Member

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    I did notice what looked like tiny shards of glass. It's hard to see in this photo, but along the red o-ring there's a couple. IMG-2302_b6b5e3ef6a4a4a5e9140a5c1f8903bc66f20a268.jpg

    I was more surprised that the stock bulb wouldn't turn on when reinstalled. I'll check the fuse box in the morning though
     
  6. Dec 31, 2021 at 11:42 PM
    #5506
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

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    Follow up on the Lexus RX350 D2S retro post with adding preferred OEM grade components vs China aftermarket.

    Additional items tested:
    Philips Xtreme +150 D2S HIDs
    Osram Xenarch +200 D2S HIDs
    Denso OEM Toyota 35w ballasts

    The most advanced D2S HID bulbs on the market, Philips XtremeVision +150 and Osram Nightbreaker Laser Xenarc +200.

    DF9A9D95-1146-47C3-BAAA-9FCD8727F3A2_1_201_a.jpg

    First, a startup comparison between Morimoto with a Hylux 35w ballast vs Osram with an OEM Denso 35w ballast.

    Morimoto/Hylux left vs Osram/Denso right
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJNjxF7BWOA
    Very obvious which products are aftermarket vs legitimate OEM grade, startup time of OEM grade components is significantly quicker and brighter.

    Morimoto left vs Osram Xenarc +200 right (after full warm up)
    C512569E-5E48-4B65-A9E7-F87641D9A9BB_1_201_a.jpg

    A little challenging to tell in the photo, but the Osrams definitely have a better hot spot concentration than Morimoto.

    Output was actually much closer than I expected, and the color temps are very similar. Osrams come in at 16% higher output intensity on low beam.
    Morimoto left vs Osram right, low beam.
    9AC6921B-9E47-4975-A8B3-F6E7BF3A5462.jpg

    High beam the Osrams come in at 25% higher output than Morimoto
    Morimoto left vs Osram Right, high beam
    51EA6F3A-1B38-4AC8-A9EF-BC60ADD0FBDD.jpg

    But the Osrams Xenarcs were not the highest output intensity, Philips Xtremes put down higher numbers.

    Philips Xtreme +150 left vs Osram Xenarc +200 right
    44CD08AB-9499-4862-91CC-1AA9556ACFAC_1_201_a.jpg

    Osram Xenacr +200 vs Philips Xtreme +150, low beam
    F1358083-B3F2-419C-976E-6531E1DF8AB5.jpg

    Osram Xenacr +200 vs Philips Xtreme +150, high beam
    08500847-2893-451F-AD0F-83974AA20B7F.jpg

    Both the Philips and Osram had the same 3.0A draw
    F6D8CC53-3F82-4262-B2FB-9009EABAF95E.jpg

    OEM ballasts will draw far more power at startup than cheap aftermarket, the high power draw is used to ignite the capsule and get it to max operating output immediately, minimizing the warm up time. As such the Denso ballasts exceed the 6A draw max of my high precision power supplies on startup, meaning I have to break out the heavy hitting 30A power supplies but in doing so loose a digit of precision. For retrofitting purposes, what this means is that OEM ballasts must be run on a standalone relayed harness as the startup draw will exceed the OEM low beam circuit. (No it won't be anywhere remotely close to 30A, that is just the rating of my larger power supplies).

    The Philips Xtreme +150s deliver a ~4-4.4% gain over the Osrams Xenarc +200s. The Philips hot spot does seem visually smaller with more high color temp in the beam pattern. While peak intensity in both high and low beam goes to Philips by a ~4% margin, I personally preferred the larger hot spot and warmer color temp of the Osram Xenarc +200s.

    Comparing Morimoto left to Philips right low beam, the Philips come in at ~21.4% higher in output intensity.
    B049F53E-7211-434B-B09E-7D5513CAACE4.jpg

    Comparing Morimoto left to Philips right high beam, the Philips come in at ~30.4% higher in output intensity.
    ABB53B88-41D3-4EA1-8481-0B42E0576282.jpg

    Not at all surprising that the worlds leading German lighting manufactures produce superior performing lighting products, or that OEM Toyota Japanese ballasts are vastly superior to Chinese aftermarket.

    Note for retrofitting the Denso ballasts tested in this post are not waterproof, as they are in a waterproof enclosure in an OEM assembly for OEM applications. Meaning the ballasts will either need to be waterproofed (TRS offers this service) or you should select a different OEM ballast such as those by Hella which are waterproof from the factory.

    Special thanks to @Bertw192 for providing his RX350 retros for the testing again as well as the Osram Xenarc bulbs, and @TacoFergie for donating the Denso ballasts.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2021
    a2lowvw, Loan Wolve, 907rx7 and 5 others like this.
  7. Jan 1, 2022 at 12:32 AM
    #5507
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

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  8. Jan 1, 2022 at 12:47 AM
    #5508
    Toy_Runner

    Toy_Runner Well-Known Member

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    $43/each is steep. Would be interesting to see how they perform compared to the Vosla's. Would be cool if they were also improving their 9011 to compete with the Osram/Sylvania offerings. Excellent rx350 tests Crash. I wish there were real performance HID burners in the sub-4000k range. 4600-5000k isn't bad at all, but still quite cold.

    And a very cool start to the New Year.

    Happy New Year, everyone.
     
  9. Jan 1, 2022 at 1:34 PM
    #5509
    Spike Spiegel

    Spike Spiegel Well-Known Member

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    You have me tempted to try a retrofit on the factory headlights now. Those numbers are impressive!
     
  10. Jan 4, 2022 at 12:25 PM
    #5510
    RubberDuck

    RubberDuck Active Member

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    Thanks for the continued testing @crashnburn80! Out of curiosity, what would the theoretical result of mixing and matching ballasts and bulbs be? i.e. Morimoto ballasts and Osram bulbs or Denso ballasts and Morimoto bulbs. It looked like the steady state current draw was similar (3.08 A vs 3.0 A) between your previous testing and this test, would a difference in warm up time be the main difference?
     
  11. Jan 4, 2022 at 10:32 PM
    #5511
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

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    Higher power ballasts will provide greater bulb output at diminishing returns, in theory giving a minor advantage to the Morimoto bulbs in this test. HIDs start to drop off in output performance over 35w as more power is lost to heat. They are not like halogens that scale as well, though the differences we are talking in this example are trivial. Of course if the aftermarket ballasts were less efficient they may draw higher power, but put out less. I only measured input power, not output. For this comparison, I'd focus on the biggest differences being the substantial startup time difference as well as the product quality difference. Not uncommon for an aftermarket unit to fail after a couple-few years. OEM units should last 10-15 years easy.
     
    509 buckeye and RubberDuck like this.
  12. Jan 5, 2022 at 5:42 PM
    #5512
    justdoit

    justdoit Well-Known Member

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    So with all this info I'm having a brain melt down. I have a 22' TRD Offroad and want to just upgrade without modifications to my stock headlights. I have the projectors not the LED's. Is the philips HID the best for the stock plug and housing?
     
  13. Jan 5, 2022 at 5:44 PM
    #5513
    DuffyBank

    DuffyBank Well-Known Member

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    Phillips H9
     
  14. Jan 5, 2022 at 5:48 PM
    #5514
    justdoit

    justdoit Well-Known Member

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    Isn't that the high beam?
     
  15. Jan 5, 2022 at 5:52 PM
    #5515
    a2lowvw

    a2lowvw Well-Known Member

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    yes, putting a high beam bulb in the low beam location is your best bang for the buck and it is better than most the headlight replacement options out there.
     
  16. Jan 5, 2022 at 5:54 PM
    #5516
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

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    It is. See post #2 in the thread. Using a Philips H9 in the low beam is the best performing option. If you want slightly whiter light (as the Philips H9 is stock halogen colored), the Hella performance 2.0 H9s are almost as good but a little whiter. For true plug and play, the Tungsram Platinums or Tungsram Xenon +120 are the best H11 performers (Tungsram was formerly GE).
     
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  17. Jan 5, 2022 at 5:54 PM
    #5517
    justdoit

    justdoit Well-Known Member

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    Ah ok, so the HID kits for H9 will be fine then and what about the ballast do i need canbus or anything special?
     
  18. Jan 5, 2022 at 5:58 PM
    #5518
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

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    Philips H9 halogen bulb is what was being discussed. HID kits are not recommended. The halogen projector has uplight (light above the cut off) specifically calibrated for halogen output. Putting HIDs in a halogen projector causes blinding glare to oncoming drivers as the uplight is way to bright, since the projector isn't intended for an HID. There are also no legitimate halogen based HIDs. To do HID properly you need to do an HID projector retrofit, preferably with all OEM grade components or at minimum a legitimate HID bulb type, so that you can run quality HIDs and not rebased/hacked stuff from china. See post #5506 and the linked post there for HID retros. But if considering that route, I'd look at OEM LED instead.
     
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  19. Jan 5, 2022 at 6:10 PM
    #5519
    justdoit

    justdoit Well-Known Member

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    Ah ok thanks
     
  20. Jan 6, 2022 at 6:00 AM
    #5520
    Dtax

    Dtax Active Member

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    OME BP51, Methods, BFG AT KO2 285s, lots of MESO, DD Yellow Fogs, H9 low beam mod, Blue Ridge Overland stuff
    just do it :thumbsup:
     
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