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3rd Gen HID vs LED vs Halogen H11 projector headlights

Discussion in '3rd Gen. Tacomas (2016+)' started by crashnburn80, Jan 25, 2019.

  1. May 30, 2019 at 4:17 AM
    #1201
    Tullie D

    Tullie D Well-Known Member

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    I didn't know they made carbon fiber deer whistles. I wonder if someone sells Red TRD logo'd carbon fiber deer whistles? Now THAT would be special ! :cool:
     
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  2. May 30, 2019 at 5:18 AM
    #1202
    gurneyeagle

    gurneyeagle Well-Known Member

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    Shhhhh…………………..that's MESO's next project!
     
  3. May 30, 2019 at 7:19 AM
    #1203
    Comb

    Comb Known Member

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    Carbon fiber deer whistle hood skewp insert. :D
     
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  4. May 30, 2019 at 7:21 AM
    #1204
    speedyralph

    speedyralph Member

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    Like I said, my truck's low beams were H11's from factory so putting the Philips H11's was as simple as plug & play. The high beams are the problem here because they are H9 from factory. I was able to plug the H11 onto the pig tail but was unsuccessful clocking them into the housing socket.
     
  5. May 30, 2019 at 7:25 AM
    #1205
    speedyralph

    speedyralph Member

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  6. May 30, 2019 at 9:27 AM
    #1206
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

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    Yep!

    You guys got it covered, but correct, the reflector is precision designed for an LED light source rather than trying to make an LED mimic a halogen for use in reflector specifically designed for a halogen light source. There are some great LED reflector lights such as the offering from KC like the KC G4 fog, where all the reflector optics are specifically designed for the LED source.

    You don't want to put an H11 in the high beam! An H11 is ~1300 lumens and H9 is 2100 lumens. Some performance H11s can outperform some H9s in the low beam because they are more focused and the low beam concentrates the focus into a hot spot, so a lower output source with better focus can outperform a higher output source with less focus. In the high beam the pattern is distributed for maximum area coverage and distance projection, you need the raw power of the H9. Putting an H11 in there will be a downgrade.
     
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  7. May 30, 2019 at 9:34 AM
    #1207
    ANTupLIFE

    ANTupLIFE Well-Known Member

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    Place H9's instead of H11's in your low beams by cutting the small tab. They have no glare cap and will project much more full. You can leave your highs as is, as that's the best option overall. If you wish to keep H11's for low beam, then use GE +130. I feel you have this all backward.
     
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  8. May 31, 2019 at 5:07 AM
    #1208
    speedyralph

    speedyralph Member

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    I don't think you guys are realizing that my LOW beam came with a H11 NOT H9 and my HIGH'S came with a H9 from factory.
    NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND.

    The objective was to upgrade to a bright white color bulb for both my lows and highs so I went to the philips site https://www.automotivebulbfinder.com/philips/ and bought the CrystalVision Ultra which is a 4300k.
    I bought the H11 as recommended for my lows and those went in with no problem (plug/socket) bc I stated above (low beams came with H11's from factory) and I also bought H11's for my highs bc I thought I could modify them to fit but I realized that the issue wasn't trying to fit them to the plug the issue is trying to clock them into socket.
     
  9. May 31, 2019 at 5:11 AM
    #1209
    gurneyeagle

    gurneyeagle Well-Known Member

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    No, everyone who has been on the thread and read it from the beginning understands that H11's come in the lows and H9's come in the highs. What crash has determined after much testing and money out of his own pocket is that H9's work better in the lows. Putting H11's in the highs is counter-productive for anything other than aesthetics and will cause performance to suffer.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2019
  10. May 31, 2019 at 4:30 PM
    #1210
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

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    You need to run an H9 in the high beam. If you really want a whiter color bulb, understanding it will be lower output than a clear bulb, use something like a PIAA Xtreme White H9, or a Sylvania Silverstar H9 both of which will be plug and play.
     
  11. May 31, 2019 at 7:05 PM
    #1211
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

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  12. Jun 3, 2019 at 5:11 PM
    #1212
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

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    I'm cross posting this from the 2nd Gen headlight thread because I think it is interesting enough to share in both the 2nd Gen and 3rd Gen threads.

    For a really interesting headlight comparison! 3rd Gen owners seem to often mention the headlights are not that great. Larger reflectors are more efficient and performant than smaller ones and ultimately a projector still has an internal reflector, as far as reflectors go the 2nd Gen reflectors are pretty massive. Now that I have run both Gens through the same series of standardized tests, I have directly comparable data.

    Here is the 3rd Gen data, which you guys are familiar with. I have the 3rd Gen in 2 charts due to the LEDs and HIDs being involved in the first one. The HIDs used in this first chart are Xenon Depot house brand bulbs, and their rebased H11 HID Philips bulbs.

    [​IMG]

    More 3rd Gen halogen data:

    [​IMG]

    Compared to the 2nd Gen halogen data:

    [​IMG]

    Some interesting points:
    • Stock 2nd Gen headlights are about 56% higher lux than stock 3rd Gen headlights.
    • A stock wattage Philips +150 bulb in 2nd Gen comes in at higher lux than the XD HIDs in 3rd Gen headlights.
    • Osram Hypers put out nearly as much lux as the Philips HIDs... at 13.8v. The higher wattage bulbs measurements do not have added voltage to account for running a standalone harness which boosts output. And if you are running an AGM with a voltage booster, as covered here, results will be even higher. Meaning that the original Ultimate Headlight Upgrade with the voltage booster is actually higher in lux output than HIDs in a 3rd Gen halogen projector. Correctly using HIDs in a proper HID projector would produce better results than HIDs in a halogen projector. But still fun comparison data nonetheless.
    For headlight output photos of my setup that I have shared in this thread, they have been the Osram 85/80w Hyper, and the and the Osram 85/80w All Season (Hyper).
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2019
    xxTacocaTxx, ERod27 and skierd like this.
  13. Jun 5, 2019 at 2:38 PM
    #1213
    replica9000

    replica9000 ./$0|./$0&

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    Who wants to be the first to attempt to retrofit 2nd gen reflectors into 3rd gen headlamps?
     
  14. Jun 5, 2019 at 2:58 PM
    #1214
    Boghog1

    Boghog1 Jack of all trades, master of none.

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    Great, another thing for 2nd genes to float over
     
  15. Jun 5, 2019 at 3:33 PM
    #1215
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

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    LOL! The 2nd Gens seem to always want projectors like 3rd Gen!
     
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  16. Jun 7, 2019 at 2:46 AM
    #1216
    RedsWhiteTaco

    RedsWhiteTaco Member

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    Soooooo I have a 2019 Pro and I don't like the LED fogs with the Halo Heads... can you just tell me to leave them alone or copy me a link on what to buy haha thanks!
     
  17. Jun 7, 2019 at 9:36 AM
    #1217
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

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    Sell the Pro fogs and replace them with higher output fogs in a far more usable color temperature, you'll likely even come out ahead after the sale of your Pro setup.
    https://www.4wheelparts.com/p/rigid...mpliant-fog-light-pods-504814/_/R-FLWB-504814

    You can see how the Pro fogs compare here:
    https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/the-led-sae-j583-fog-pod-fog-light-review.554813/

    And the Rigid selective yellow prototype comparison here.
     
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  18. Jun 7, 2019 at 9:49 AM
    #1218
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

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    In the original post I talked about the importance of what I called the "LED cross section" and how making light sources smaller it is critical to beam focus, and focus is essentially what drives distance projection efficiency, which is what most LEDs lack. Here is a video from Diode Dynamics talking about the same concept:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGmoDtdNqIk

    The cross section of their LEDs covered in the video is by far the smallest I have seen, and it is really refreshing to see science based content to promote a lighting product rather than glare photos or raw lumen claims. I've reached out to Diode Dynamics and will be testing their LEDs soon to compare them to halogen focus and projection in the 3rd Gen headlight. It will be interesting to see what the data says. :)
     
  19. Jun 7, 2019 at 10:43 AM
    #1219
    replica9000

    replica9000 ./$0|./$0&

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    But he doesn't mention you're still not getting a full 360° of light since he's showing off a blade style LED "bulb". LED tech seems to be improving fast though, so maybe soon.

    I'd like to see more options like the OEM Tundra LED headlamps.
    [​IMG]
     
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  20. Jun 7, 2019 at 11:05 AM
    #1220
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 [OP] Vehicle Design Engineer

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    Yes, you are correct, it will still have that flaw inherent in the blade style design. Thinner cross section helps reduce the negative effect, however it obviously will not shine light above the bulb. Below won’t matter since the light is cut off by the projector glare shield.

    2020 Tacoma’s will have LED headlights like the Tundra. I’ll have to get my hands on some when they are released, having optics designed specifically for LEDs will provide better results.
     

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