3rd gen tranny

I test drove autos and hated how underpowered the truck felt. It also couldn't ever make up its mind how many gears it wanted to downshift when I gave it slightly more throttle. Ended up getting the manual and couldn't be happier.

 

If you don't want a vehicle that shifts at highway speeds and hills the only option is a manual but you will find your self doing the shifting more often than you would probably like. The ideal with any thing made with an automatic is fuel mileage it wants to be in the highest gear possible with the converter locked up at any given road speed but they can not maintain the lower speeds in too high a gear so they down shift to a gear to match the road speed every single vehicle made to day does exactly the same thing no exceptions.

 

I went through my manual phase. Lived in LA for 10 years and drove a 2003 tacoma 5 speed. There's a reason automatics are the vast majority of US vehicles on the road. I have a muscle car that's a 4 speed manual if I want to step back in time. Is it too much to ask for a truck with decent motor and transmission combo in 2016? The gal's 2016 4runner drives great.

 

I've had my 4WD Tacoma for about 2 months. 3100 miles so far. I love everything about the truck except the way the motor/transmission handles cruise control! I live in an area where the terrain is only slightly hilly. When I'm cruising at 65 mph on flat land, the truck hums along at 1900 rpm. Virtually any incline in the road and it downshifts and revs to 3000 rpms. Back and forth - back and forth - back and forth. Therefore, I do not consider the truck to be equipped with cruise control. Driving it out of cruise control I can go up the same hills and only drop 2-3 mph for a few seconds and never rev the engine.

For the life of me I don't understand why Toyota engineers couldn't have developed a better marriage between the engine and the transmission! What would have been sacrificed to do this?

 

Purely speculation, but if I had to guess, the new motor/tranny combo was likely designed to conform with US Gov't fuel economy requirements that have been imposed by our designated betters on every automaker who plans to continue doing business in the "Land of the Free." Increasing the number of gears in automatic transmissions seems to be all the rage these days and something is driving that and I doubt it's cruise control performance.

 

Yep, as for more gears, it keeps the engine in a more efficient range through more speeds. Buddy of mine picked up a new cherokee with an 9 speed transmission. People here bitch about a transmission running through gears, they should drive this thing. It's ridiculous.

 

Nah. Fuel economy and EPA regulations/restrictions are not a new thing for 2015-2016 or even the last handful of years. In fact the Govt focus on driving down fuel consumption has been around since the 70's.

 

Yes.
But CAFE requirements go up every year.

 

OK but is there any proof that CAFE requirements led to this Powerplant/Transmission design change by Toyota? I have not been able to find anything supporting that argument. It's more or less just the conjecture used by those in defense of the 3.5L implementation.

 

From the linked article...

"WASHINGTON, DC – The Obama Administration today finalized groundbreaking standards that will increase fuel economy to the equivalent of 54.5 mpg for cars and light-duty trucks by Model Year 2025."

"In achieving these new standards, EPA and NHTSA expect automakers’ to use a range of efficient and advanced technologies to transform the vehicle fleet. The standards issued today provide for a mid-term evaluation to allow the agencies to review their effectiveness and make any needed adjustments."

https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-pres...zes-historic-545-mpg-fuel-efficiency-standard

Does this constitute proof? No, but it's pretty simple to connect the dots here.

 

Planning ahead.

 

Not probable that this was the primary driver for changing the design. And if it was then Toyota totally missed the mark as there are previous year models of this vehicle that averaged the same or better fuel economy than the 2016 model

 

I'd bet, the new drive train and even the OEM bed cover, delivered mpg gains in controlled environment that documented... gives ToMoCo what they need to keep the .gov commies at bay.

 

In the real world, yes, fuel economy is likely not improved by much at all. But as Larry suggested above, in a controlled test environment where everything is designed for the perfect-world scenario, they will claim (and can no doubt show evidence) that it yields a little bit higher MPG. Again, pure speculation based on an attempt to connect what appear to be (at least to me) obvious dots, but I do think Occam's Razor is at play here, I.e., the simplest explanation is likely the more accurate one.

And if you don't think the CAFE standards were the catalyst, then what were? I ask in complete seriousness: if you were Toyota, what would be your motivation to make this change? And, not just from the 2nd gen 4.0/5S AT, but from the 4.0/4S AT that was in the '03-'04 4Runners that also went to the 5S in 2005. I have that particular model and I can say without hesitation that the 4.0/4S AT is extremely solid. It rarely hunts for gears except in the most extreme grades or under a significant load. I've read posts by 2nd gen owners on this board complaining about the way the 5S AT hunts somewhat excessively, so it seems the motor/tranny combo in the 2nd gens wasn't exactly a panacea. What it amounts to is Toyota screwed the pooch in 2005 and have now taken it a step further in 2016. Something prompted Toyota to go from 4S to 5S back in '05 and from 5S to 6S today. What was it? What benefits are there for adding additional gears to a tranny, other than increased MPG under the right conditions? Not just for its customers, but for Toyota as a corporation? I honestly can't think of a single one.

I mean if you really think about it... Toyota has spent 50 years in the US auto market building a steller reputation on dependability and reliability and now it sits at the very top of the bunch. Certainly they would not knowingly do something that would compromise that, especially with its flagship product, so I don't think it's because they decided to roll out a product that won't hold up the way past models have. And, they certainly didn't do it to wave their middle finger at their customers by offering a product that they knew would not be well-received, I wouldn't think. Then why do this? I keep coming back to only one answer: regulatory compliance.

 

I think there is a lot of truth right there. Just an anecdote, but when I was in the market for my 2016 and working with a sales dude at one of my local dealers, he was looking through the not-yet-built Tacomas that were allocated to them, trying to find one that would meet my demands. He told me that if there was one that was close to what I wanted, depending on how far out it was from being built, they could request changes to the build specs (e.g., color, add JBL, etc.). However, he did say (not sure if BS or not, but it's what he told me) if it was spec'd to have a Tonneau cover, that was not changeable. You could add one to the build, but not have one removed. Something about having to build so many units with the Tonneau in order to satisfy gov't MPG requirements. Anyway, your post just reminded me of that, FWIW.

 

i learned to give it more gas, seems like i can control the shifting with the gas pedal, leaning into when needed to keep it from up shifting

 

Yep.
Land of the free...governed by commies.

 

Not really that excited now to go test drive the tacoma. Good thing I'm got a bunch of other vehicles in mind to test drive. Thanks for the info.

 

Make sure to drive a good long bit with the truck in drive. Then take it back and run the same route in sport mode 5th. Then take it back and drive the same route with the ECT button pushed. These are the options available to all drivers with the automatic transmission. It just depends on how much you want out of the truck and put it in the best mode that suits you. Toyota knew that some people won't be happy just putting it in drive and go so they have at least given the driver different options.

 

Truck drives excellent in the mountains. I love how it keeps a constant speed going down steep grades without a ton of brake pedal babying. It also shifts down going up steep grades and holds it until you crest. It's obvious to me now why Tacomas are so popular in the mountain towns.