8k capacity winch enough?

I'm also going with an 8K winch. Good information on here for those of us who have never used a winch with pulley/snatch block. Most of us had this in school but I don't remember most of what I learned in school. The most complicated part is that is SO simple.

 

Rules of thumb for pulling forces required for recovery on level ground: 100% of vehicle weight when buried to the hub, 200% when buried to the top of the tire, 300% when buried to the top of the hood. Additional derating factors apply if you got broken suspension or inclined ground:



https://www.warn.com/warn-winch-performance-specifications-pulling-capacity-by-layer
On the second layer of the rope drum, the 8k winch will be at ~6800 lb capacity. On the 3rd layer, it'll be at ~5900 lb. Your truck with all the accessories and gear will be ~5000 lb, so the winch will be good up to getting buried to the hub on an 18% grade.

A snatch block doubles the pulling power but also doubles the length of rope you'll need, which means either more layers around the drum (somewhat self-defeating) or running rope extensions. Rope joints (with either soft shackle or X-block) don't feed through snatch blocks.

 

One of the reasons to use a block is to pull more line off the drum and get down to the first or second layer. My preference is to have an extension strong enough to use as a single line from the block to the load and have no line connections running into a block. Simple is good when it comes to rigging.

 

Question for you since you have some good points on this. If I don't have a winch but do have a snatch block and cable or synthetic rope, I can still get double the pulling power? One end to a fixed point, the pulley on the stuck vehicle and the other on my truck pulling I can get 2 to 1 pulling power, correct? I never go where I would really need a winch so thinking of just getting a snatch block and cable/rope just in case. I never would've thought of this until you posted these pics.

 

Yeah. It’s all about how you rig the system.

I’d get a recovery donut and some soft shackles. Then some winch line extension. You’d have a pretty versatile kit in a lightweight package.

also check out these guides from factor55. Some good info

 

The lines need to be parallel, but yes. There’s some frictional loss from the block, so even if they’re parallel it isn’t quite 2:1. The greater the angle from 0* the smaller the advantage becomes. I don’t remember the exact math, but I think anything more than 30* off the block it actually begins to put more load on the anchors than the load.

 

Awesome. Thanks

 

Throw a second pully in your kit to get to 3-1 or to have more cable out on a close anchor. Pay attention to any side slope.

 

Another thing to factor in is how strong your bumper mounts are. Regardless of number of pulleys used to reduce the load at the winch, the bumper and its mounts are still seeing the full recovery force if you run the winch line back to the bumper. The stock bumper mounts are designed to absorb energy during a collision and may become the weak point if you get creative with multiple snatch blocks.

 

Minimum standard is a winch that is rated for 1.5x the max weight of your truck. Not the curb weight, and not what you think it probably weighs, and certainly not what you think you might need to pull. With all the over-built broverlanders out there, I'm willing to bet a fair number of them even exceed the GVWR.

Max GVWR of a 3rd gen is ~5600#. 5100 for a 1st gen.

5600 x 1.5 = 8400.

So in reality, no, an 8000# winch is NOT enough for a 3rd gen.

Will it work? If you are 5300 pounds or less, sure. But I'm not going to take bets on if you've actually weighed it to know for sure.

Just bare in mind that's the minimum.

 

Almost nobody is going to be off roading loaded to max GVWR. About the only time 8000 lbs wouldn't be enough is if your sitting on the frame in sticky mud and need to drag the truck for a long distance without the wheels touching solid ground.

I've seen guys pulling 7000 lb 3/4 ton trucks out of jams with 8000 lb winches.

 

At the end of the day, I just went with a 10k. Better safe than sorry I guess

 

Really? You sure?

Adding up the weights of f/r bumpers, winch, RTT, rack, and a tank of gas, you're already close to 900 pounds. Add 2 adults and a weekend's worth of water and another 100 or so in camping gear and food, and you're easily over 1500#. Then you have awnings, shovels, recovery/safety gear, spare parts, tools, etc... I'm being fairly conservative here. I see a lot of rigs carrying a LOT of extra shit - usually camera gear for their instagram.

Go load up your truck ready for a weekend of camping/wheeling and go get weighed. I'll bet you are way closer to GVWR than you think.

So have I. What's your point?

Our anecdotes of seeing people exceed the well established standards for off road recovery doesn't make that the new standard.

 

This 100%. On both accounts

 

Nailed it...GVWR is a comical double standard on TW and most don’t realize how pig heavy their “build” with every accessory they can find bolted on the truck.

Overland build thread: Zero regard or concern for GVWR. Most probably 500-1000lbs over...no one cares.

Towing thread: OMG, WTF, your payload is only 300 lbs after you put your bags and yourself in the truck. You can’t possibly safely tow that 4k lb trailer, you’re way over GVWR and going to kill a bus full of nuns immediately. Get a one ton dually diesel to be safe.

 

Two different crowds.

Towing crowd: practical, experienced.

Overland crowd: “bro, follow me on instagram”

 

Yeah I think there’s a happy middle ground between being prepared offroad and being a trail tampon that’s heavier than my dually and starts breaking weird shit like the bed or bending axle housings.

Same with towing, use some common sense and stay within Toyota’s guidelines and you’ll be fine, no need for a 3/4 diesel because you’re pulling a trailer that’s 65% of rated capacity of the Tacoma.

 

Good rule of thumb is go 3 times more winch then what the vehicle weighs. Then you don't have to worry about the physics. Just pull.

 

Overall, he's got a lot of good info, however I have a couple issues.

He cautions you against using a ball hitch to tow or recover, but he also says "just do the math" to make sure you don't exceed the limits of the ball hitch and you should be fine. Just from what I've seen in this thread alone, I don't have a lot confidence that people are generally good at "doing the math" when it comes to the weights of their vehicles, and the forces involved.

He also mentioned that "you could use a shackle if you wanted but it's not necessary" when talking about that Jeeps tow hook. I would say you should NEVER used a shackle if you don't absolutely have to. There is no reason to add extra potential projectiles when you don't need to, *especially* for something that's not actually secured to the vehicle (a hook, vs. a loop).

Simpler solution, just get a hitch mounted recovery point.

 

with enough line, pulleys and blocks you dont even need a winch. shit with a 300:1 advantage you could just pull your truck out by hand. Why waste money on a winch.



wait i might be in the wrong thread.