Alabama thread!

haha! so its looking like a no go on this weekend huh dave??

 

I have no problem with a debate or discussion. Honestly. I just tend to get defensive when being called a crook. It's all good. let's hear your basis on disagreement.

 

but noone called you a crook, its like someone saying lawyers are liars, its a generality not a personal attack. part of the business. heck my job automatically ropes me in with being an uneducated hillbilly with no teeth and can't read nor write. but when someone says something like that about miners i don't take it personally and get all bent out of shape. especially when or if it is someone i know, because i know they weren't aiming at me. If they did they would have used my name in the sentence. But as stated earlier I am going to do my best to refrain from debate/discussion right now bc tempers seem to be flared and feelings are on sleeves. no offense just trying to keep things drama free.

 

I guess it has a lot to do with perception. I hear day in and day out how "mechanics are crooks" and to ME I look at it differently. I am a mechanic for the most part (Ok, I consider myself a technician, which is a different class, but a Mallard is still a duck...lol) so when people say mechanics are a crook, I add 2 + 2 and get 4. I know from being in the industry that we are not all that way, so I feel like I should defend myself. I own a business in the field and my livelihood DEPENDS on my customers, current and new, knowing that I take good care of their car/truck for a fair price.

Like I said, last night was not a good night for me, and I should have refrained from the way I went about responding to it. I also apologized this morning. We are human and make mistakes. Doesn't mean I can't look back the next day and shrug it off and realize I could have done a better job at it. I admit that I DO take some opinions personal, because to me they ARE personal. But I am also able to debate facts and figures all day without being offended. I will do my best to no longer fire back when someone says something about my profession. I just take pride in what I do....It's just the person that I am.

Again sorry if I overreacted. I'm not trying to be a dick here.

I KNEW miners were not a bunch of uneducated hillbillies.....Just simple hillbillies.....

 

Bill, thanks for the advice.

Can you get OE Toyota / Denso parts for those? We've had a couple of guys in the club get Napa units on the compressors and they crap out more quickly than the Denso ones it seems.

I'd be interested in getting a quote on the pieces you recommended replacing to do the R134a conversion.

Just so this is all up front and no expectations are mis-managed: There's a Toyota dealership in GA that discounts parts for club members, and I'm going to get a quote from him as well. Nothing personal, just business. I need to scrimp every penny I can at the moment.

 

dont forget camelback on here as well. think they are in arizona or something??

 

No worries. I do the same thing and have several different vendors for different types of parts. I would recommend getting a rebuilt Denso compressor. They are cheaper than a brand new one, and some dealerships actually carry the rebuilds as well. Here is a lit of what I think you will need. Let me know if you feel you should add or subtract to/from the list. Also, to be sure I get all the right prices, can you post the VIN number?

Compressor (Denso-reman)
Receiver/dryer
TXV/orifice
PAG oil (oil for a R134a system)
R134a (amount TBD once I have VIN)

 

Look, Bill, I got my car fixed and blowing cold correctly for $200 in parts + $200 in tools. The estimates I got were in the $2000 range, and the work was not very difficult or time consuming. If I actually had training, I could have had my AC fixed in maybe 4 hours of shop time. Accounting for the fact that most shops would sell me a new or reman compressor for $400 instead of the $115 I spent on one out of a 96, and $100 in parts for a couple of cans of r134a, evap core, exp valve, and receiver/drier, that's still $1500 profit for 4 hours of labor.

So no, the prices I was quoted are ridiculous and fleecing the customer, straight up. You can get defensive all you want, getting a shop to do your AC is a major ripoff.

 

Nah, AC is easy man, you should be set if you have all the tools. I am sure there is an FJ80 r134a conversion tutorial with pictures someplace on the internet, too. It is under high pressure, but just make sure you get a good seal kit, oil all the seals, and run a vacuum like justin said before you fill up as a good first-pass test.

I had a leak the first time through (accidentally got a seal goofed up and crushed on the miata), caught it on the vac, no big deal. Even if I had filled anyway though, the AC would have just bled refrigerant, I would have been OK. And wear gloves and eyes of course while doing the work.

The only thing you do need a pro for is to evac out refrigerant if it does have any left.

 

I've heard that the lines need to be flushed to make sure everything is out of them that could mix and cause problems, and that pulling a vacuum won't necessarily do it.

a) is that accurate
b) if so, how hard is that to do (I read just shoot brake cleaner through them, but then somewhere else I read that's a recipe for oxidation and corrosion)
c) if all of that is accurate, and b) sucks to do, what do the lines cost?

 

if your buddy that has a recovery system hooks up to it then you dont have to worry. if someone tells you you need to flush them then let them flush it in exchange for your ocean front property in ID! if you see what im saying. your oil stays in its home unless you F up and hit a ridiculous amount of pressure through the low side and force it out of its home. so its not like there is anything to clean out. refrigerant is very clean perse as in no residue. actually its a fantastic way to clean tubing... as it eats everything it can before evap. and oh yeah the whole illegal to release into the atmosphere thing too. but anything that the recovery system cant get out your vacuum will pull out. Ive switched systems from R22 to R507 and the over to R404a and done R22 to R410a and all kinds of other things like that and its easy to do the work of that its just wrenching that is a pain because the compressors dont like to be removed.

 

Yeah, it's not the refrigerant, I know that shit is going to boil off and go with a vacuum. My understanding (and again, I could be wrong) is that the oil used with R12 is mineral oil, and the PAG mixing with it is the issue?? Obviously if you're exchanging the dryer, expansion valve, compressor, etc, anywhere that oil could just sit is being exchanged. Just wasn't sure about the lines.

Oh, and Bill I don't have the VIN on me. I'll have to get it when I'm at home.

 

Have to work tomorrow, no surprise. Still have Sunday free, and even Saturday evening.

 

if you wanted to just be completely safe you could get your HVAC buddy to run a quick flush on the lines with a real cleaner(he should have some from doing HVAC) but i wouldnt see that as necessary, unless auto ac is the complete opposite of general HVAC your oil shouldnt just be going all throughout the system all willy nilly. now i may be totally wrong on that part? I dont know, just know that in general HVAC your oil is isolated and does not travel through the system, when it does that is when you have issue.

 

well they are saying another line of storms may be moving in sat even and if not then def sunday, plus i will prob have to go up to school to do group work sunday.

 

Oil goes all over the place, you fill the system by introducing it into a given component and letting it circulate. I could see this being an issue if PAG and mineral oil combine to something corrosive, but I would think that if you just rinse the lines out with brake cleaner or anything else and make sure they dry out very thoroughly before using them, the vacuum will get rid of any remaining moisture and the new oil will take care of the rest. But take that with a grain of salt, I've never read about the conversions very thoroughly.

 

So... my "buddy that does HVAC" and has the gauges actually administers a nursing home for a living, and bought the gauges to do his truck.

Edit... oh duh, the guy I was talking about earlier. Now he might have some of that cleaner. Good thinkin.

Jim, the corrosive part seems to be "internet truth" at least from what I've read. I'm having some trouble finding precisely what the combination is of which of the three lubricants, mineral oil, ester, or PAG.

 

Yeah, I don't know why PAG + another oil should be corrosive, but I ain't no chemE. One thing I do know is that vacuuming gets moisture out partially by a sort of boiling/drying effect from introducing a vacuum for a decent period of time (like a half hour), I imagine this doesn't affect oil the same way. I do know that the oil doesn't come out, for whatever that's worth, so if the two oils mixed do cause corrosion, you probably do need to clean the lines.

 

Further digging... looks like it's moisture + oxygen + refrigerant + heat that makes acid. So I guess as long as everything is sealed, and you pull a vacuum for a half hour - 45 min, you're taking care of the moisture part, and most of the O2.

 

Oh, well that's just true of AC in general, nothing to do with PAG vs other oil. You certainly don't want to leave your system opened up for a long period of time if you can help it.

That being said, I bought a used compressor and it's still OK, I figured as long as I pull a good vacuum on it and replace the receiver/drier, there won't be an issue (or at least not for a long time).