Alignment Issues/ Caster Adjustment

Hey guys,
So I've been trying to do my own research on this before posting, but I'm about to rip my hair out. My current setup is roughly a 3" lift, King Coilovers, and TC Uppers, on 17x8.5 4.3 BS SCS wheels. So I installed my King Coilovers a month or so ago and went to get an alignment, I requested for the tech to push the Caster up into the 3.0 range to get my tires off the fender and cab mount. The tech said his shop doesn't allow out of spec alignments, but he'd do what he could hiding it off the print out, which I said was fine. I get my truck back and he said he could only get .2 degrees out of it putting it at 2.4 on both sides. I wasn't happy about it, but I was going on a trip that same day so didn't have the time to argue with him.

So I just brought my truck in to get another alignment today after hearing this specific dealership has done @Mademan925's alignments and that they know what they're doing, so I said what the hell. The techs came in with the print-out, and managed to get 3.0 Caster on one side, but only 2.1 on the other and he said it was maxed out on both sides."It's good, but it pulls to the right pretty bad." After talking to them about it, and not getting any straight answers or explanation on how the Caster could go from 2.4 to 2.1 and now be maxed out and how the driver side could get up to 3.0 and not the passenger. Keep in mind, this is 20 minutes from when they close for the day @6pm on a weekday, so my thinking as of right now is just laziness? After reading about how so many people get these 3.0 Caster numbers with aftermarket UCA's, I'm not understanding how my truck could be already be at its limit. The truck is spending the night at the dealership and tomorrow they're doing a re-alignment, also didn't grab the printout they had cause I was so bent out of shape about seeing how they expected me to be happy with that alignment. Any input is appreciated guys. Just trying to understand from people who can really help me out and give me answers.

 

Bumpity McBump Face

 

3" lift is a lot

TC uppers only allow an additional ~2° caster

Maximum caster is always different from passenger to driver side.

The folks you see getting 3°+ caster are likely using SPC arms which allow for much higher caster. They also might not be running as much lift as you.

Caster and camber are "linked" so your "maximum caster" will depend on the maximum amount of camber the tech is willing to apply.
Too much camber leads to tire wear. Even being "in-spec" the camber can easily be high enough to cause tire wear.

 

Anything over 2* with 3" lift is good. You could expect on stock ucas to get 1-1.5* max. People don't realize that stock ucas and max caster gives more clearance at firewall and cab mount. Tc arms give 2* more caster but it pulls the tire towards the firewall causing more rub.

Best option is to run spcs set all the way forward and lca aligned cams fully maxed. You only will get 1.5-2* caster but maximum firewall and cab mount clearance.

In your situation have them match the caster side to side. If you still rub you need to cut the cab mount.

 

But does that make sense? How my caster went from 2.4 to 2.1 now being maxed out?

 

As @Justinlhc mentioned, Castor and camber are linked, so one tech may have let the camber go a little more to gain castor. Honestly, there's an incredible thread on here on how to do your own alignments. It's really not that difficult. The most important measurement to prevent bad tire wear is toe. You can have weird Castor and camber numbers, and still not wear your tires out too badly, as long as toe is in spec.

Spc uca's definitely help a lot though. I did my own alignment, all I did was push my lca's as far forward as possible, then set my camber just using my uca's. Then set toe and call it good.

For my uses, which is majority on dirt, perfect alignment isn't as important as it would be on a daily driver either.

 

Yes it makes sense since changing the lca cam bolt adjusts caster and camber. To get camber good he may have lost some caster.

Spcs have there own caster and camber settings allowing major adjustments.

 

Livermore Toyota has done a few alignments for me. They have the TC alignment instructions for my LT kit in my file. They have always been able to follow the instructions and get almost 4 degrees of caster but again this is with LT so it might be different. My local firestone who does the majority of my alignments can usually only get me about 3.5. Goodluck. I usually knock my alignments out of alignment after a week anyway due to offroading. I get about 12 a year.

 

Haha the guy that ended up working on my truck this morning is the guy that works on your truck lol.
So he called back after 3 hours and said he's done 4 alignments on it and now the Caster is at 3.9 on driver side, and 3.1 on Passenger. But both are maxed out now. He can't bring the driver side lower and he can't bring the passenger side higher. Lol, he's at a loss of what to do and I'm over here trying to figure out what to do next. Before I had brought it in, both sides were at 2.4. And now he can't bring it down any lower..?

Help, I need an adult.

 

Calling the "adult" @jberry813

 

Will be heading over there after class and I'll get whatever pics you need Mr. Alignment Sorcerer.

 

He wants pics of the sheet.

 

Haven't been to the shop since yesterday. Only talked to the mech on the phone. So I don't have the truck nor the printouts just yet.

 

@jberry813 Here's driver eccentric's.

 

Here are the print outs. First one is last night's alignment, second is current.

 

I'm using all-pro UCA's and about 2.5" lift with 885's. My caster is maxed out at about 4.5 keeping my camber at close to zero. You might want to go down to 2.5" from 3" to get more adjustments.

 

Both are "maxed" but I don't understand why he's saying he can't go any lower. There is plenty of room to go lower.

 

I think you posted the same picture twice.