Anyone rock crawl a 3rd gen?

andrew8404 · Sep 12, 2019

svdude said: ↑

I disagree. The Jeep has a lot more options for bolt on parts that may make it seem like a better rock crawler. However, I think that what stops most people is that they aren't willing to cut up a Tacoma to make it a better rock crawler, ex: solid axle, dual cases, etc. Those can be had for about 15 grand (more or less depending on front suspension setup) and the Tacoma will run laps around most jeeps with 15k in them.

If you're only counting bolt on parts then maybe you're right but some of us have taken our tacomas places where the jeep guys would would wonder why they didn't buy a Tacoma.
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Umm you have no idea what your talking about.

Ackrite · Sep 12, 2019

SubCultureNM said: ↑

To address your points (in a constructive manner, as this is a conversation that needs to be had):

1) They're much cheaper. A SxS, ready to run, can be had for $12k, new. Most people buying them already have a DD capable of pulling one, so I'd say it's rare to find someone who will go out and buy both. And we don't need to get into the cost of new Jeeps or Tacomas, or modifying older models for serious 'wheeling.

3) Weight has virtually nothing to do with impact, when discussing the vehicles we are. In terms of overall impact, my 5,200 lb Jeep with 235:1 gear reduction has WAY less impact on a trail than a vehicle designed to go fast, lacking a true low range, which then relies on wheel speed to climb obstacles. All you have to do is look at heavily traveled areas, such as the Rio Puerco valley west of Albuquerque, NM, where I learned how to 'wheel, to see the devastation caused by the onslaught of ATVs in recent years. They are not, in fact, meant to be replacements for properly built and capable full-size 4x4s. They just aren't. But many people seem to think they are.

Here's the thing: I don't have anything against SxSs themselves as much as irresponsible users. It's been my experience, over the last 20 years, that ATVs have a higher percentage of irresponsible operators than Jeeps and other full-size 4x4s. To address your second point, then, from encounters I've had in the last 5 years especially, the lack of concern for trails and for the environment I've personally seen from ATV operators serves to ostracize themselves (unless you have no problem with their actions). As recent as our trip to Colorado this past August, SxSs were like flies on shit on the trails; the operators had zero knowledge of trail etiquette, very little regard for safety (theirs or others') and clearly no regard for the environment. The first few groups we encountered parked off trail, on tundra (which is illegal in CO, BTW) I approached in a friendly manner, trying to give them a heads-up that they shouldn't be parked there. (I mean, how else are they going to learn unless someone offers constructive criticism?) Literally one person out of perhaps 30 moved their ATV. The rest acted like I was the one being a jerk. I gave up after awhile.

Edit to add--we probably encountered ATVs in a 3:1 or 4:1 ratio to Jeeps and Toyotas on that trip. We did not see any of the full-size vehicles off trail, or otherwise behaving badly.

It's quite obvious that the majority of SxS owners, or maybe the off-road crowd in general, no longer have the experience and knowledge base that we had access to when I was a newbie. Frankly, at the rate we're going, we will continue to lose access at a rapid pace. And, if SxSs continue to outnumber traditional 4x4s by the ratios I've seen recently, then yes, they will be the ones mostly responsible for that loss.
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Sounds like you are describing Mexicans on a SxS.

I toss my empty beers in the bed of my truck, or in the ice chest, or behind my seat. They just toss them out while driving.

Ackrite · Sep 12, 2019

And full disclosure, I am a first generation American with both parents born in Mexico.

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Anyone rock crawl a 3rd gen?

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Anyone rock crawl a 3rd gen?

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