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Brakes

Discussion in '2nd Gen. Tacomas (2005-2015)' started by Sfcmcmahon, Jun 22, 2023.

  1. Jun 23, 2023 at 7:34 AM
    #21
    Sfcmcmahon

    Sfcmcmahon [OP] Well-Known Member

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    First Name:
    Chris
    Central Florida
    Vehicle:
    2013 Tacoma TRD Sport 4x4
  2. Jun 23, 2023 at 7:43 AM
    #22
    lbhsbz

    lbhsbz Well-Known Member

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    If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

    Look at the number of "warped rotor" post you see just on this forum...If I took 100 of those "warped" rotors and measured them up on my fixture...I might find one, maybe 2...but that's a stretch, that are actually warped.

    If you read the service instruction in the FSM for rotor replacement, there is a maximum runout specification and the technician needs to set up a dial indicator and measure runout when the new rotor goes on the hub to make sure the hub/wheel bearing/rotor ASSEMBLY is within spec...off the top of my head the max allowable runout is in the 0.002" range, maybe a bit less.

    With certainty, I can make the statement that 99% of rotors that are machined or replaced never get a dial indicator on them. After the brake job, if things are smooth on the road test, all is well and it goes out the door...only to return in 5K miles or so with "warped" rotors. One of my favorite excuses is that "new rotors are thin junk and you can't machine 'em cuz then they can't handle the heat and they warp". Bullshit. Otherwise, people just blame "junk china rotors". Also bullshit.

    I can take a rotor and machine .010" (5 times the limit) of runout into it and put it on my tacoma and things will be smooth as silk...in the beginning...until the friction transfer layer from the pads starts developing to a different degree on the high spots, creating first a torque variation (steering wheel vibration), then a thickness variation (pedal pulsation).

    I have no problem machining rotor CORRECTLY or replacing rotor CORRECTLY...the problem is that nobody does it correctly. Most bench brake lathes and their adapters (fixtures) are not treated like the precision pieces of equipment that they are...rotor adapters get dropped, used on the press, and have rusty beat up rotors banged against 'em constantly...hardly a precision fixture at that point. Most people machining rotors will have to take at least 2 passes to get a clean cut over all 360° of the rotor...and they think when they see that that the rotor is warped and they're fixing it. Also bullshit. They've taken a perfectly good rotor, clamped it between two fucked up adapters so it's fixtured crooked...and are now machining more runout into the rotor than it had in the first place....but they're happy with the work because it was smooth on the road test.

    Same thing happens with new rotors...I've personally tested over 1000 new rotors in a fixture that I designed and built to measure both runout and thickness variation...and can count on one hand the number of rotors that were questionable, from the cheapest of china junk to top shelf chinese manufactured rotor to OEM. But what good is a perfect rotor when you put on a bent or rusty hub? Not much good at all...and nobody notices that the hub or rust on the hub has created an assembly (even with a new rotor) that has 3 or 4 times the allowable runout because they're too lazy or ignorant to put a dial indicator on it after installation.

    So...if the old rotors have been on the hubs for 100K miles and show no real wear, and there are no symptoms pointing to a thickness variation, uneven surface condition, or excessive runout condition after 100K miles....that's because their isn't one....and for all practical purposes, that rotor on that hub is about as perfect of an assembly as anyone could ask for. Leave it the fuck alone. lol.

    Customers always ask if I warranty the rotors I sell against warping. My answer is no...because rotors don't warp. If you get a pulsation and you measured and confirmed runout was within spec during install, the pads are garbage or for an inappropriate heat range, or an uneven surface condition on the rotor has developed due to rust...I can't warranty cast iron against rust. If neither of those 2 conditions exist, then the rotors had excessive runout when they were installed on the hub and that should have been sorted out during installation. I don't warranty against cracking either. If you cracked your rotors on the street, you were driving like a dickhead and that's on you. lol
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2023
  3. Jun 23, 2023 at 7:45 AM
    #23
    lbhsbz

    lbhsbz Well-Known Member

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    You'll be happy with these
    https://autobrakesolutions.com/prod...rmance-brake-pads?_pos=8&_sid=8a39133eb&_ss=r
     
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