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Broken crankshaft key leads to tear down and timing service

Discussion in '2nd Gen. Tacomas (2005-2015)' started by p16, Feb 12, 2024.

  1. Feb 12, 2024 at 5:38 PM
    #41
    TacoTuesday1

    TacoTuesday1 Well-Known Member

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    yes. Failure isn’t unheard of. And manufacturing that piece is easier than machining a crank.

    too bad they didn’t do that with the manual trans. Supposedly 3rd gen got it replaceable (TOB sleeve) and other vehicles including older Landcruiser.
     
    p16[OP] likes this.
  2. Feb 12, 2024 at 5:39 PM
    #42
    TacoTuesday1

    TacoTuesday1 Well-Known Member

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    I mean you’re already in there judging by the pics
    Timing cover is likely held on by bolts and a matter of cleaning it up. New seals and sealant. Replacing one time use bolts.

    You just haven’t taken it apart further deeper yet to be looking at the chains and taking them off to access the sprocket
     
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  3. Feb 12, 2024 at 5:49 PM
    #43
    TacoTuesday1

    TacoTuesday1 Well-Known Member

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    The more I look at parts pics

    the more it looks like unfortunately possible for the crank snout itself to be the one that is keyed. With the sprockets simply sliding onto those keys.

    am not seeing any key tab on the frontmost sprocket.

    however these pics suggests Toyota may use wood ruff keys
    And that it may have separately obtainable and replaceable (hopefully only that is what is broken) “wood ruff keys”

    if so, could be less involved
    And not require deeper timing chain R&R
    But might. If the front sprocket has to slide out to access the key.

    IMG_2666.jpg IMG_2665.jpg
     
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  4. Feb 12, 2024 at 5:53 PM
    #44
    p16

    p16 [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Yeah I’m pretty lost looking at it rn. I’m probably gonna go down to my mechanic tomorrow and show him the pics and see what he thinks. Whether or not he thinks the key can be replaced or if the entire crank has to be.
     
  5. Feb 12, 2024 at 5:56 PM
    #45
    TacoTuesday1

    TacoTuesday1 Well-Known Member

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    Depends on the mechanic.

    if it does use separate keys then it’s probably gonna involve
    -front cover remove
    -remove front sprocket and associated/required labor ops

    IMG_2667.jpg IMG_2668.jpg
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2024
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  6. Feb 12, 2024 at 5:57 PM
    #46
    TenBeers

    TenBeers Well-Known Member

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    Yeah.
    Replacing an entire engine or crankshaft for this seems extreme. You need a new harmonic balancer and seal, and it looks like there is enough key left. Slide the new pulley on and see if it catches on the key. If it does, clean things up, put a new seal in, and bolt things down. And don't go all nuts and mar the seal seat up worse than it already is.

    Is there an obvious gap where part of the key broke off? It just looks like the balancer broke due to deterioration.

    If that doesn't do it, I'm sure it can be fixed, just maybe not in your driveway.
     
    zimmmtaco, p16[OP] and Steves104x4 like this.
  7. Feb 12, 2024 at 6:08 PM
    #47
    TacoTuesday1

    TacoTuesday1 Well-Known Member

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    according to internet
    New key is $2
    OP is already at the point of being able to look at and touch the key with his hand

    to each his own
    If it was me I’d replace the key and drive off into the sunset.
    Looks like a worn pulley simply took out the metal key.

    some of the reasons repair manuals exist are as follows
    -a new engine comes out. Tech has never worked on it. Has to see how to
    -legal liability and warranty claim approve or deny. Did technician follow prescribed procedure laid out to the T or not. According to mfg guidelines. Cut and dry no grey area.

    theoretically it’s supposed to be so that it’s so easy a monkey can do it. Either the monkey followed the steps or didn’t.

    supposedly Toyota is using slot and wood ruff key 1980-present.

    IMG_2670.jpg

    it may even be possible to detention the chain enough for the sprocket to come off, exposing the key. Without having to change or undo the timing. By manually collapsing the tensioner(s).
    Marking the positions. Then verifying timing with crank rotate.

    OP: if you do not have PN: Confidence,
    it may be possible to obtain, by obtaining PN's:
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    Last edited: Feb 12, 2024
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  8. Feb 12, 2024 at 6:28 PM
    #48
    TenBeers

    TenBeers Well-Known Member

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    Yeah.
    I can't even see from the pics where it took out the key. It looks like there is still some sticking out, but maybe it's my eyes. But yeah, just replace the dang key if it is broken.
     
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  9. Feb 12, 2024 at 6:41 PM
    #49
    545

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    Op, get a pair of needle nose locking pliers (Milwaukee ones at Home Depot have an easy to crank after locked adjustment) lock it on to the key real tight and try and remove it
    You may be able to replace the key without removing timing cover, timing gears, etc

    or just use some sleeve retainer or similar on the shaft to balancer fit along with the damaged key

    https://www.amazon.com/Retaining-Compound-Cylindrical-Components-Assemblies/dp/B09VHBQ8W3
     
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  10. Feb 12, 2024 at 6:50 PM
    #50
    Steves104x4

    Steves104x4 Well-Known Member

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  11. Feb 12, 2024 at 6:51 PM
    #51
    TacoTuesday1

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    it might be able to slide out
    probably not, if interference fit designed so it never falls out on it's own during operation
    but doesn't hurt to try
     
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  12. Feb 12, 2024 at 8:57 PM
    #52
    p16

    p16 [OP] Well-Known Member

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    I think a good chunk of it is gone. Is the key just wedged in there? Yeah I suppose I could try the new pulley on there and see how it goes. My only concern is causing more damage to my engine somehow by leaving a fraction of a key on there. That being said, my truck drove perfectly fine up until when I took the pulley off and inspected.

    IMG_0892.png

    IMG_0901.jpg
     
  13. Feb 12, 2024 at 9:37 PM
    #53
    lynlan1819

    lynlan1819 Well-Known Member

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    Looks like half the key is left,put a new balancer slowly and you will be able too tell how much contact you are have while you slide it on.
     
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  14. Feb 13, 2024 at 6:11 AM
    #54
    Peter603Taco

    Peter603Taco Well-Known Member

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    Never heard of this or worked on a tacoma crankshaft, but this repair is very common in the miata world with early short nose 1.6 engines developing crank wobble and damaged keyway and such. I would look into those forums, you mentioned money is tight and a lot of those guys commonly repair it with JB weld or Loctite, and thats on ones where the whole crankshaft nose has damage from the key wobbling around. Again I could be wrong since I've never torn one of these engines down, but with most engines once you remove the timing chain crank sprocket you can simply tap the woodruff key out out replace if the groove isn't damaged. Can reseal the timing cover at the same time as others said.
     
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  15. Feb 13, 2024 at 6:32 AM
    #55
    GorgeRunner

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    If the crank has a slot in it, it uses a removable key.
    Take off the timing cover, replace the key.
    Crankshaft replacement is basically engine rebuild.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2024
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  16. Feb 13, 2024 at 10:03 AM
    #56
    Jimmyh

    Jimmyh Well-Known Member

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    If that uses a Wood Ruff key as shown in the images above, the timing cover will have to be removed and the gear removed in order to pull out the key due to the half moon shape. You will not be able to slide it out as the crankshaft is not slotted all the way out.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2024
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  17. Feb 13, 2024 at 10:44 AM
    #57
    TacoTuesday1

    TacoTuesday1 Well-Known Member

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    pics make it look like only outer small section of the key broke off
    That locks the damper in place. That broke due to worn damper.
    Looks like the rest of it still there inside holding the sprocket which is not wobbling

    if OP replaces it, given the sprocket is cheap
    He could also buy that from the dealer just in case it’s damaged and needs replacing. So it also does not end up wobbling and wearing. Given its $20. Or see if it needs it upon further disassemble. Or return it if not needed. Probably needs to be ordered and not kept in stock.

    Agreed. Realistically it’s going to be a lock fit that requires disassembly and otherwise won’t just fall out without R&R
     
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  18. Feb 13, 2024 at 12:30 PM
    #58
    Torspd

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    This right here.

    What's weird is that the first photos the harmonic balancer with two notches for the key. One is clearly the OEM slot. Someone didn't align it properly, and rammed it in. Chipping the pulley, and squishing the key. Also the rubber medium in the pulley is very degraded (just an observation).

    Someone also used a bolt screwed through the harmonic balancer, into the timing cover to help remove it. Best to use another method to remove the pulley in any future scenario.

    Timing cover removal, although lengthy, is the best method for access and repair.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2024
  19. Feb 14, 2024 at 7:40 AM
    #59
    Anteupp

    Anteupp Mega Member

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    the replies in this thread o_O sheesh, remove the timing chain cover, bar the engine over with the crank bolt to get good access to that woodruff key tap it out, throw a new key and dampener on, replace the crank seal and call it a day.

    Since you're already in there you might as well replace your timing chains and tensioners as well. Get on YouTube and lookup 1grfe P0016 repair , or stretched timing chain repair Tacoma fj 4rnr 4.0 etc.

    good luck!
     
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  20. Feb 14, 2024 at 7:46 AM
    #60
    TacoTuesday1

    TacoTuesday1 Well-Known Member

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    realistically
    Is it worth the extra money to do chains, or does it depend on maintenance history

    they seem to last a long time. Haven’t heard of high mile 1GR’s needing it, only ones that have been neglected and sludged
     
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