Calling all Virginians (Tidewater area)

Is he doing the frame coating applications too? This is appealing to me because I have not found a Toyota service department that I can fully trust yet

 

I was told to try different dealerships but that a drive for me but I can get it done sooner some where else I'd drive back to home to western Maryland for it thanks I'll have to give them a call tomorrow and what they estimate I wait would be

 

Yeah.. Call em up.. Ask about getting Randy Stevens for your tech.. His name is know across the area at both Nissan and Toyota shops from Williamsburg to NN to Gloucester.. Tell them his Dad mentioned the dealership..

 

This is good to know... Ill keep him in mind if I run i to issues at all with my truck

@07 taco13 Thatd be the absolute dumbest fucking thing you could possibly do... Yes weld something to your rusted out frame so when you bring it back to toyota they tell you to kick rocks because you welded something to the frame that wasn't intended to go there... And structurally the flat bar wont do much... Youd be heating the frame so much with the weld and all that rust itd just make the metal even weaker...

 

50/50 on Williamsburg C&C this weekend. Waiting to see if I'll have to work on Saturday.

 

Good morning folks.

 

I'll be working this Saturday.. We are transitioning our schedules.

 

Ordering me some new sliders today. My Kickout saved me... SOME, but need bigger!

 

Anyone ever have code: P1613 air injection pump? Toyota tried to say that it was my fault and the pump and underneath had appeared to be wet which may have caused it. (just washed my truck)

 

Sounds like some bullshit...i dont have an air pump. Started in 2012.

 

Yeah I hear bullshit too.. Sounds like they were trying to pin me for being at the fault... They were mumbling about my truck being modded and different things wired into my SPOD... They were not fans

 

Yes they do the frame coating service there too... We talked about that at length last night. Apparently the Frame (rust inhibitor) spray is 'Top of the line' stuff - so some may consider getting the inspection, and if rust is insufficient to warrant frame replacement (&upon recommendation from the tech) - may want to consider doing a frame spray job - to avoid the continued rust & eventual frame replacement. I forgot to ask who pays for the Frame Spraying... As it is preventative maintenance, assume it is the customer...

 

According to the tsb notice I received if I am reading it correctly Toyota pays for it to be done. I will re-read it again to make sure.

 

Just checked my letter and it says Toyota will pay for the remedy aka the CRC application

 

This conversation should be considered insight... As I do not represent Toyota nor claim to..

#1. I was wrong (or perhaps a better word is unclear) about who pays for Frame spraying (under what conditions) as related to the TSP... I talked with my son again for clearer definition.. Warrantied frame spraying is a corrective measure both recognizing that Rust that is "present", But Used: when diagnosed to be insufficient to require frame replacement - point being that if left untreated, would result in rust through requiring frame replacement. I don't work for Toyota, so please bear with me if I err in clarity as in my comment yesterday, related more to 'Elective' spraying vice TSP warrantied work. I misunderstood the criteria for Frame replacement - diagnosis cutoff. Nor claim to recognize the subtle differences easily recognized by professionals.

#2. Talking with my son, I asked about the specifics related to qualifying for Frame Replacement. The diagnosis of frame failure has undeniable criteria. I know what he told me, but will refrain from specifically repeating it here so as not to comment in anyway representative of fact over perception. For the customer though, simply know that Rust, if present, is not the only qualifier. It is the diameter of the Rust-Through "hole". Deterioration deemed capable of compromising vehicular control under varying conditions - is unacceptable. If the Rust created hole is of a big enough diameter, then the Frame is replaced. If not, then the Frame is sprayed. The determination of Spray or Replace is made by the inspecting technician At The Toyota Dealership.. and this inspection is not merely 'eyeballing' the frame. Of course, the Tech's eye is trained to suspect a spot, but it's his hammer that defines the corrosion... Randy told me that his hammer recently dislodge rust by the bag load... Weighing in at an incredible 40 pounds when collected afterwards. Diagnosis obviously - Frame replacement...

For your understanding - and to be 100% clear - this IS a big deal to Toyota. So much so that for Safety's Sake they are paying for the failure when warranted. It costs $12,000 per vehicle to replace the frame (according to my son).

#2a. Let me help you all understand this particular point... The dealerships conducting Frame Replacements are not dragging their feet here. What feels like evasive maneuvering to the customer, who have been told their Frame is affected... Are (like Toyota) experiencing nothing more than an "Out of stock" condition on Frame availability. Individual Dealerships, and their respective Frame Replacing Tech(s) - are being well paid by Toyota for this Warranty Frame spray or replacement work. The Dealership has no reason not to replace your frame if it meets the criteria - in fact they have every reason in the world to qualify your truck - and every reason is $$green$$.

#3. Let's say your vehicle has been diagnosed as "Qualifying" for Frame Replacement, and the Frame came in this morning.. You live right next door to the Dealership and you saw the truck come in on Monday and it had 4 Frames on it. You wonder why they haven't called you for the replacement.. As you can imagine - There is a list of customers who Also Qualify and you are somewhere on it - but perhaps Not Next. (That is one delay for you specifically). Another delay customer's don't consider: The Frame is only One component of the replacement. According to my son, the arrival of the Frame(s) is the Dealership's "Go Ahead" trigger to order All the other components related to the replacement that must be "On Hand" before you get the call. (Another delay for you specifically). As you may imagine, Dealerships do not order, pay for, and stock these components just to store them. They are order JIT (just in time) for install, so that each part is added to the parts list along with the Frame, - for reimbursement for all parts from Toyota at one time. These additional parts and related costs are not carried 'Unpaid For" and stored awaiting the Frame. To do it otherwise, considering the availability of the Frames - is just bad business...

#4. I had my son - Randy Stevens at Gloucester Toyota - Speak to the Service Manager there about the SMs willingness to be the Point of Contact for interested local Tacoma World guys (if you have any specific questions about your vehicle...) Especially if you have had a previous diagnosis of Frame Failure at another dealership - but don't trust that 'other dealership' for whatever reason (as some have mentioned on here.). The Service manager IS Willing and his name is Doug Updike. Since he is very busy as you may imagine - he requests your contact be via email. His email address is doug@gloucestertoyota.com (I have not tried the email address and it was 'spoken' to me so I hope there is not a period or something between Gloucester and Toyota.). Randy (my son) also offered this information related to those who get their Frame replaced at the Gloucester Dealership. #4a. Gloucester shop fees may be somewhat less than 'Big City' dealerships especially during Frame Replacement.

#5. Example If you have other work that needs to be done - he recommended you consider doing it during the Frame Replacement process to save money. Consider your vehicle's Frame will be totally disassembled for component removal once the body is off... Shocks, Brake Lines, Calipers, electrical harnesses etc.etc.etc. At your discretion many of these components could be upgraded during the replacement process at a substantial savings. Those upgrades requiring deeper disassembly (Like removing old/reinstalling new brake pads, or caliper rebuilds, vice simply taking the calipers off and putting them back on intact) may have more labor costs than other upgrades (like shocks) that are more a matter of putting the new component in during reassembly vice the old one. A question I would ask Doug if I were getting my Frame replaced would be something like: "If I supply Bilstein 5100s F/R when I bring in my truck for Frame Replacement - can they be installed during the rebuild process for less than full labor costs?" Installing 5100s F/R is approximately $250 in labor costs in Williamsburg.. This Potential cost savings for those who do not consider themselves to be driveway DIYrs or lack the necessary tool. While I don't know exactly how much you'd save - my son indicated a willingness to consider 'by the component you ask about' savings - it remains up to you to negotiate your savings dependent upon what you want done. Randy also mentioned that since the entire suspension is removed from the Frame to be reinstalled (or components you negotiate are replaced) that the Frame Replacement includes an alignment as part of the warrantied work.. So you can see the mounting savings of certain component replacements during the frame replacement work that if done seperately - would also require an alignment. I know if I had a high mileage truck and was considering shock replacement that they'd be laying on the front seat when I took it in for a frame replacement to take advantage of upgrading to Bilstein 5100 during frame replacement as a minimum.

#6. Randy is the exclusive Frame replacement tech at Gloucester Toyota. He has replaced 13 Frames this year, and 25 total so far, and has 6 in the que when future Frames arrive. That is sure to increase as Frame availability improves. To hear him tell it - he loves the work.. Regarding the past, he's is proud to say he's not had one complaint, or one call back and feels that his work results in what most would say is a frame put back to factory spec at a minimum. He's gained ever increasing experience since 16 when he and I disassembled and reconditioned a VW in the driveway. He has attended factory level schools spanning a 20 plus year career in the industry. He and Doug Updike moved together as a team from Nissan to Toyota some 5 years ago, maintaining a working continuity and trust that I have never heard the like of before. When a new NISSAN dealership opened here in Williamsburg, I mentioned my son's name and our relationship - He was well known to them here. My previous vehicle of choice was NISSAN Zs. Owning both a 350Z convertible and a 40th Anniversary 370Z. I upgraded the suspension on the 350 and took it to Randy for alignment. Though it took a few hours he mathimatically corrected for all the aftermarket hardware - to true up the alignment - from scratch - outside factory known presets. Upon completion he told me there was not another Z in the country that drove straighter or cornered better than mine. It was made for the Dragon. Getting back to frames... He has (according to him) made Frame replacement a fine science. He could tell you how long it takes to get the body off, then how long it takes to remove all the components from the frame and reverse the process. But what he told me to tell you was that a customer should plan on a 5 day job.. (More often 4, barring any unforeseen 'special' problem) He mentioned that the warrantied work included a rental vehicle. Though he was unfamiliar with the circumstances that could result in the earlier comment made by one Tacoma World user about Less than Full coverage insurance affecting rentals. (That TW user should ask more questions... As rental agreements usually allow for a small fee elective for Rental Insurance above and beyond their own insurance coverage)

Side note: (These comments are my own - and should only be considered "Food for thought") I agree with the member who recommended "against welding any interim frame support or otherwise altering the frame" as another member suggested that they intended to attempt. While we did not talk about it at length - the gist of the conversation was that welding a rusted frame would give a false sense of security that may only produce an UNPREDICTABLE Result. For instance (worse case scenario) a crumple zone near a reinforcing - owner installed - plate weld, may cause the rusted frame to separate, break away, and possibly enter the cab through the floorboard. My personal recommendation is: Take your truck to Randy for inspection before your next State inspection... Randy said: A State Inspector (Randy is one) could fail your truck and force you park it - whereas if inspected at the dealership you will learn the condition of the frame and considering the reliability of the frame will know right then what your solution will be. Don't quote me, but I heard that to mean that you make be going home in a rental dependent upon the level of deterioration. It's that big of a deal. Consider: This entire Frame Replacement program is wrapped up in the NHTSA safety program and the resulting view that frame failures that could potentially result in unpredictable vehicle operating conditions and increased highway accidents involving multiple individuals. Consumer perception - future buying dollars (and the laws concerning vehicle safety standards - and potential lawsuits) - Are all separate issues any one of which would demand that Toyota Act.

So - here at the end of this long drawn out overview regarding Frame Replacements I would attach this disclaimer. In it's entirety it is just that - an overview... Written by one Tacoma World user who had a conversation that resulted in this understanding. It in no way obligates Gloucester Toyota to meet a specific demand nor does it obligate the aforementioned employees against some future claim or expectation. It is merely my hope to alleviate some of the concern related to the topic, and to hopefully provide a valid solution for those here who I hope to call friends in response to a perceived (on my part) need. I hope you found it helpful.

At the end of the day... Toyota knows that waiting is a bummer. But hopes too that you understand the local dealership near you is not to blame. The availability of frames is the culprit.

If you Do intend to contact and use Gloucester Toyota because of this message... and intend to contact Doug... Mention my name (Sam) as Randy's Dad and that you were given this information on Tacoma World - it would be interesting to me to learn in the future - what 'greater good' resulted from this email. Rest assured - Randy will tell me all about the the increased business from Va Beach and surrounding localities.. In advance - he thanks you all for it.

P.S. remember if you are going to request upgrades during reassembling... Start gathering your parts and spreading out the costs Now while waiting for your frame to come in... Because once the diagnosis determines Frame Replacement Required it is no longer a matter of IF but When... But remember to ask/verify with the service manager about the potential labor costs savings - Before You Buy Them.

Just my two cents...
DP

 

Thank you for your insight DP. That is very helpful. I just wish Gloucester wasn't as far away as it is. I'm not expecting a full frame replacement as I think this has been caught in enough time for my truck but if so then I may definitely take advantage of it by adding bushings and possibly new shocks and a leaf spring replacement.

 

+1 for Gloucester Toyota. Purchased my truck there in 2012 and they are awesome every time I go in there.

 

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