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Can you fix takeoff shudder with stiff springs?

Discussion in '2nd Gen. Tacomas (2005-2015)' started by RT_Guy, Sep 1, 2024.

  1. Sep 1, 2024 at 9:53 AM
    #1
    RT_Guy

    RT_Guy [OP] Active Member

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    Hey TW.

    I have a 2014 4wd Access Cab SR5 that I've had for about a year now. The truck has been an ongoing project and has turned out really nice. I plan to put together a build thread once I get it finished documenting some of the work. I've worked on a lot of cars but this is my first Tacoma and my first time doing a lift so I am grateful for the forum as I have learned a lot from the folks who have already done it.

    I am running Dobinson Coil Overs in the front and Dobinson extended travel shocks in the rear. My springs are the Icon RTX pack on level 1 with 2 degree angle shims. The rear sits at 24.5" unloaded and the front is a little over 23" measured from the hub centers. This is really more lift than I wanted so I'm hesitant to go to level 2 or three with the Icons to fix it. I have a custom two-piece driveshaft with a double cardan after the carrier bearing. The carrier bearing is this one using a custom mount.

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00GAPDY6G?ie=UTF8

    I've adjusted the driveshaft angles and carrier drop distance and I get zero vibes anywhere.............except when accelerating from a stop. I'm sure that it is axle wrap and actually put a go pro under the truck to verify. Here is the video.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KlrnoTHTq7E

    You can see about halfway through the exhaust pipe start shaking as the diff housing reaches its apex.

    So, I get that in the grand scheme of things it doesn't look too bad and it may turn out that the best solution is to stop being so picky and live with it. Having said that, I'm curious what other people's experience has been.

    Looking at the RTX pack compared with some of the other options it appears that it is not as beefy near the front bushing (especially in option 1) as these.

    https://exitoffroad.com/product/dob...air-for-toyota-tacoma-2005-to-2023-l59-111-r/

    https://exitoffroad.com/product/all-pro-2005-2023-3-0-tacoma-leaf-springs-standard/

    I'm considering ditching the Icons for the Dobinsons. The L59-111-R seems like its a heavier spring but would put me close to the same lift as the Icons at level 1. I was hoping folks who have had similar experiences could chime in before I went ahead and bought the Dobinsons.


    My question is this

    For folks who have two piece drive lines (custom or otherwise) and full aftermarket leaf packs, were you able to get rid of your takeoff shudder with the stiffer leaf springs?

    For folks who have the Icons, do you think that they wrap more than some of the other options?

    Thanks
     
  2. Sep 1, 2024 at 10:57 AM
    #2
    GilbertOz

    GilbertOz Driver

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    Good post, lots of details.

    I have a 2014 AC V6 4.0L 6MT w/ stock engine and drivetrain. Stock 2-part rear driveshaft, no shims. Truck is suspension (not spacer) lifted about 2.25" front & rear, on FOX 2.5s w/DSC on all 4 corners, and Deaver U402 stage III rear leafs. Which are about as stiff as you can get. Regardless of how hard or soft I set the DSC adjusters on my FOX shocks, occasionally I get take-off shudder anyway. It only happens from time to time, I think it's with certain configurations of cargo weight / shock-absorber stiffness settings.

    It doesn't happen often enough to bother trying to track it down systematically. I just deal with it and use a very light touch on the gas pedal until I'm sure the truck is out of the 1st gear suspension+driveline flutter/resonance range.
     
  3. Sep 1, 2024 at 11:41 AM
    #3
    TacoTuesday1

    TacoTuesday1 Well-Known Member

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    Why do you have op1 and shims

    most people are op2 or 3 without shims
    It has been advised to not run op1 as it is said to flatten and I don’t see the point of op1’s reduced height and reduced carrying capacity.

    I run op3 with no shims. Previous owner of my used pack did.
    And don’t have shudder or wrap that I’m aware of.

    some is probably unavoidable without an anti wrap bar or different rear setup and may be nothing wrong with it.

    I’ve also got the common ford ranger poly IEDLS carrier bearing which requires putting spacers that can be machined to any height you want.

    a thick leaf pack such as op2 or op3 probably reduces wrap. Which you are not getting by running op1. I would look at that first before anything else.

    whether you run this shock or that shock, a higher op config will give you things like increased ground clearance for off roading that op1 is not - part of the point of upgrading leafs.
     
  4. Sep 1, 2024 at 11:46 AM
    #4
    gotoman1969

    gotoman1969 Well-Known Member

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    First. That’s not in any excessive movement of the diff. All leaf springs are gonna have some bit of deflection at take off and stop it’s how they work. The only true way to eliminate it is with a set of traction bars.
     
  5. Sep 1, 2024 at 11:59 AM
    #5
    TacoTuesday1

    TacoTuesday1 Well-Known Member

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    question is, is there a good one
    that fits common mods like hammer hangers and whatnot

    and without downsides like ruining off road articulation

    versus a flat low track xrunner where it'd be fine
     
  6. Sep 1, 2024 at 12:04 PM
    #6
    RT_Guy

    RT_Guy [OP] Active Member

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    Thanks for the replies.

    That is really what I am looking for. I had been rolling around the idea of anti-wrap/traction bars but I wanted to weigh it against possible easier solutions like a different spring pack.

    The shims that I am using are super thin and are only to adjust the pinion angle not to add lift. Option 1 already gives me 2.5". Other than the wrap, I don't have an issue with the Icons at level 1. I agree that opt 2 or 3 would would probably do better but i don't want the extra lift.
     
  7. Sep 1, 2024 at 12:31 PM
    #7
    RT_Guy

    RT_Guy [OP] Active Member

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    Not to hijack my own thread but I was looking at these.

    https://bds-suspension.com/products...mm3WhK_Zv9Ot2v9iay25ppM_pxvV3g7xoCNmQQAvD_BwE

    They have about 1" of compression travel so I think that they would not bind up the leaf springs without having to have the extra link. I have a custom mount partially designed. It would be bolt on modification if it worked. My only trouble is, it seems like too much for the Tacoma. The bars are 60" long 2" diameter. I mocked it up on my truck with fence poles and it seems like you lose a lot of ground clearance.

    IMG_8343.jpg
     
  8. Sep 2, 2024 at 7:58 AM
    #8
    gotoman1969

    gotoman1969 Well-Known Member

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    Yes the down fall of traction bars is the loss of ground clearance and you’ll lose some axle articulation.
     
  9. Sep 2, 2024 at 8:08 AM
    #9
    OffroadToy

    OffroadToy old, forgetful, and decomposing

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    Just curious... have you tried removing the pinion shims (from what i've read most with the rxt leafs don't need them) and adding some weight to the rear? I'm at option 2 with the weight of a canopy (double cab sb)... no pinion shim, vibs, or axle wrap.
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2024
  10. Sep 2, 2024 at 12:48 PM
    #10
    GilbertOz

    GilbertOz Driver

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    Is your truck auto transmission or manual?

    In my case I think at least part of my occasional take-off shudder may be due to clutch wear. Clutch has 80K on it and feels like it has maybe 20-25% life left. It's probably at least partly heat-glazed and may transmit pulses of torque during the earliest part of engagement, which could be translated into driveline resonance & shudders under high-torque / low rpm conditions. (I.e. first-gear take offs.)
     
    Knudsen likes this.
  11. Sep 2, 2024 at 1:13 PM
    #11
    Knudsen

    Knudsen Well-Known Member

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    To bet installed: bling grill, headlights, fog lights.
    A worn out pressure plate can certainly give a truck the shakes. Usually it’s more pronounced taking off in reverse.
     

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