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Cheap Upgrades to Gain HP and Torque

Discussion in '2nd Gen. Tacomas (2005-2015)' started by BabyT, Feb 4, 2011.

  1. Mar 27, 2011 at 9:56 PM
    #21
    08pretaco

    08pretaco Almost there

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    Im going to throw this into the mix just for fun and want to see what happens:

    If you want more power why not just run 91 octane.....

    let the discussion begin :D
     
  2. Mar 28, 2011 at 4:09 AM
    #22
    Doug2000

    Doug2000 Well-Known Member

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    I have read claims higher octane gas makes higher HP, I don't believe it. You only use higher octane if you have higher compression or boost. Your timing must be set for higher octane.
    That's how it was explained to me, my truck is to much of a pig to waste money on high octane, get a Mustang if you want to go fast.
     
  3. Mar 28, 2011 at 4:13 AM
    #23
    buddywh1

    buddywh1 Well-Known Member

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    Because it depends on how restrictive the intake was in the first place... apparently Tacoma's intakes aren't very restrictive so the gains just aren't there.

    With my '07 Rabbit, though, the stock intake is VERY restrictive. A CAI would net an easy 7HP/8-10 LbFt trq. across the power band with a CAI on a 2.5L Rabbit.
     
  4. Mar 28, 2011 at 5:03 AM
    #24
    Doug2000

    Doug2000 Well-Known Member

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    For the money put out, I doubt you shaved 0.20 seconds off your quarter mile. With that rear end on those leaf springs bouncing around, you could never really hook up.
     
  5. Mar 28, 2011 at 7:15 AM
    #25
    08pretaco

    08pretaco Almost there

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    Ya i kind of just through that in for the sake or arguement lol
     
  6. Mar 28, 2011 at 7:34 AM
    #26
    trdr6

    trdr6 Well-Known Member

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    OP, I have the AFE Stage 2si and am going to put on the TRD catback exhaust. Does it help power? Probably not significantly. Does it put a big smile on my face with the sound it makes? Yes it does. Good enough for me! :D

    If your wanting sound, do the intake and exhaust. If you want power, either put a blower on it or spend the doe to buy something meant to go fast. It sucks, but it's just the nature of the beast.
     
  7. Mar 28, 2011 at 8:26 AM
    #27
    BrokenTusk

    BrokenTusk I support a velociraptor free workplace.

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    I have an Xr, My rear end is Rock Solid :D
     
  8. Mar 28, 2011 at 2:10 PM
    #28
    The Kernwhole

    The Kernwhole New Member

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    Octane is not a higher energy additive in gas like most people think. It is a hydrocarbon molecule with a higher ignition temperature than the others present in gasoline such as heptane, methane, etc. (methane might not be there but its on of the few "thanes" I can think of at the moment.) Anyway, higher octane fuels have higher auto ignition temps than normal unleaded allowing you to run higher levels of compression or boost before you get auto ignition (pinging). Auto ignition being when the fuel air mixture detonates before the spark plug fires. Hope this clears up the premium v.s. regular myth.
     
  9. Mar 28, 2011 at 2:12 PM
    #29
    08pretaco

    08pretaco Almost there

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    Ya it was a joke, thats why I worded it the way I did but I appreciate your input!
     
  10. Mar 28, 2011 at 2:18 PM
    #30
    The Kernwhole

    The Kernwhole New Member

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    You're right, the ECU does use a specific fuel to air mixture (14.7:1 by mass usually) and that is the exact reason you have a flow sensor on your intake tube. But you're also right that a piggy back unit helps tremendously. The stock ECU only goes so far in adjusting flow and usually sides with safety, longevity, and fuel economy; not power like we would want.

    A blower is really the only substantial horse power additive available for the truck but for my money, i'd rather spend $5k on a sport bike and leave my daily driver for what it is :D
     
  11. Mar 28, 2011 at 2:32 PM
    #31
    Coupe

    Coupe Well-Known Member

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    Lots baby!
    To get back on topic.
    I went the normal route that most people go, and then some. This is the path I would take to more HP. You can stop, when you run out of money or you hit enough power.

    CAI, Use TRD First design or AFe.

    Cat back. Many available. I would use a TRD or Manaflow (2 1/2") 3" if S/C. I like URD's 3" catback.

    Headers. Doug Thorley Long tubes. (If in an smog check area, I would use JBA Short tubes) Long tubes are any easy install. Short tubes are a pain. I have had both.

    APR X-1. Currently hard to find. Worth every penny.

    URD y pipe.

    TRD or URD S/C. URD gives the best bang for the buck. You have to have an APR X1 for tuning it.

    NST blower pulley (if TRD)

    Your first Call should be to Gadget at URD (Underdog Racing Development). Super guy. Tell him how much money you have to burn and he will tell you how fast you can go.

    http://urdusa.com/

    I can't tell you how much he has helped me.

    For the Record, my last dyno run was at 354 HP.
     
  12. Mar 28, 2011 at 2:59 PM
    #32
    Sleeper362

    Sleeper362 One Convenient Locations ......In Africa

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    You would be making a poor assumption. Modern engine computers have what they call knock sensors. If you datalog your engine parameters the effect of these knock sensors will be called KR (knock retard). Basically what your ECU is doing is it is constantly hunting the proper timing for max efficiency. How it does this is over time is that it will increase timing to the point where you get spark knock (detonation) then it will dial the timing back to a safer level. It uses these knock sensors to pick up minuscule levels of spark knock to judge where it should pull timing. With 87 Octane it will hear the knock a whole lot sooner in the timing curve and retard it back. With 91 or 93 octane the motor will continually increase the timing much higher than it would with 87 octane, thus creating more power due to the engine's increased efficiency. In cars with forced induction (ie turbos, superchargers) this system is used to protect the motor more so than create more power. With our motors this is done to create more power by advancing the timing curve. Hope this helps explain how this works.
     
  13. Mar 28, 2011 at 3:20 PM
    #33
    sandjunkie

    sandjunkie Well-Known Member

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    Cheap HP and Torque???

    Good luck. That's like finding a hot woman who knows when to keep her mouth shut and cheap to maintain. It doesn't exist and if someone tells you it does, THEY'RE LYING!!
     
  14. Mar 28, 2011 at 3:55 PM
    #34
    knayrb

    knayrb Well-Known Member

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    If it was "cheap" to increase HP or torque then the manufacture would do it from the factory. Or better yet, if it was "cheap" and didn't ruin anything then they would already be doing it.

    The only real way to get more HP/torque is to install a supercharger or completely rebuild your engine with high performance internal parts like pistons, valves, cams, injectors, manifolds, heads, etc.

    I don't believe that the is anything you can buy off the shelf that is going to make significant difference.

    You're all entitled to my opinion on this.
     
  15. Mar 28, 2011 at 3:56 PM
    #35
    Sleeper362

    Sleeper362 One Convenient Locations ......In Africa

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    What you are missing is that there is no specific tune for a particular gas. The computer finds the tune for its self. It may take a couple tanks of gas for it to adjust accordingly but it will adjust. There is the possibility that they took the self adjustability away in favor of more consistancy, but for those people who have the years that state there is a difference, there will be a difference. Maybe not as high as they stated but it will ultimately have higher timing. These motors are new to me so anything I am saying is questionable, but having dealt with knock sensors and KR on Mazda motors for the past two years I have a very deep understanding of how systems like these work.

    Me and my neighbor changing the blower belt on my car
    [​IMG]

    And the Mazda that had adjustable timing
    [​IMG]
     
  16. Apr 9, 2011 at 8:44 PM
    #36
    Irish020

    Irish020 Well-Known Member

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    I've run higher octane in my '05 Taco with 4.0 since I bought it...if you look closely at the statistics the engine was "detuned" in horsepower and torque after '05...We also have a '04 4-Runner w/ 4.0 that we run the higher octane in...
     
  17. Apr 9, 2011 at 10:35 PM
    #37
    acdronin

    acdronin Well-Known Member

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    To the OP, look, this is physics really, these trucks are heavy with an engine that IMHO is somewhat underpowered to begin with so yes, like you, I sought out more HP and torque. What I learned along the way is having to separate fact from fiction and marry it to reality. My truck with two dudes in it and a half-tank of gas comes in right about 5000lbs, that's ALOT of vehicle to get up and make boogie. So right there is reality, this ain't a sports car and it's not a V8, without an SC, it's not going to do 12 sec 1/4 miles. Then it's what do you want to do with that power? If the answer is to drive fast, then good luck when it comes to any sudden turns, get a sports car, you'll live longer. Me, I wanted to have enough on tap to get up to freeway speeds quickly, pass quickly and pull the occasional heavy trailer. The insurance is too fucking expensive to drive fast anyways. So after MUCH research and having run across a few bogus claims along the way, here's what I did, it's still a work in progress but so far it's made DEFINITE improvements:
    1. URD MAF Calibrator, this will salvage your gas mileage after you put on a Cold Air Intake like the 63 series K&N that I put on. Be prepared to solder onto the wiring harness behind your glove box, price $212.00 shipped.
    2. Cat back exhaust, three inch stainless steel, nice exhaust note, minimal gains but I think I will gain more when I put on the shorty headers and Y pipe. $800 or so.
    3. Be realistic, I dropped about 1400-1500 plus the hours to put everything on and I still have a ways to go. I don't want to spin the tires and I would rarely ever need to go 110, but when I do it gets me there quicker than stock.
    I will probably end up dropping around another grand+ to get the shorty headers and Y pipe bought and installed, at that point I will have gotten all of the available power out of that engine short of a SC. I put in the best plugs and change the oil every 3000K religiously with only synthetic oil. My philosophy is simple, make it as easy as possible for the engine to breathe and don't do anything that will possibly wreck it or piss off the ECU.
    Bottom line my truck hauls ass for a 5000 lb, six cylinder truck. Yeah, it was worth it. To any Taco owners that don't think (therfore don't have), that the CAI and cat-back exhaust add HP and torque, I will GLADLY race you for pink slips!:eek:
     
  18. Apr 10, 2011 at 12:35 PM
    #38
    06TRDZombieHunter

    06TRDZombieHunter Well-Known Member

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    How is a K&N damaging to an engine? It makes sense that a higher flowing filter will feed the engine more air than it could get through the stock paper filter(s) and cluttered ducting and baffles..?

    Im curious about more info
     
  19. Apr 10, 2011 at 12:46 PM
    #39
    06TRDZombieHunter

    06TRDZombieHunter Well-Known Member

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    Excellent post. I agree that some performance parts are just that.. Performance enhancing. They will cost you though. I did the K&N aircharger kit, and Ported and polished my throttle body and those alone I can feel a stronger pull 0-60 and stronger yet from 45-80. . It kinda runs out of poop after that. It is a heavy truck for about 250 crank Hp. Plus 32.5" AT tires are alot heavier and have more rolling resistance than radials. But Im happy with it. I plan on spending some $$ on a smoother Y-pipe, and larger diameter exhaust from there back. I want headers, but they are pretty expensive and will be much later in my Tacoma future. Have you looked into light weight flywheel, pulleys, or exchanging the fan running from the crank for an electric fan like flex-a-lite? All of these would in theory lessen the load on the engine, putting more power to the ground rather than getting those parts up and moving...? Anyhow, good honest write up

    You get what you pay for.. Just dont buy any BS ebay power chips or special fluids that claim increases HP. I used to have a throttle body spacer on my scion tC, sounded cool, but no noticeable increase in power or mpg.
     
  20. Apr 10, 2011 at 2:53 PM
    #40
    maineah

    maineah Well-Known Member

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    X2 there is less heat energy in hi test.
     
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