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Death Wobble With No Lift?

Discussion in '2nd Gen. Tacomas (2005-2015)' started by ColdWaterTaco, Mar 31, 2010.

  1. Mar 31, 2010 at 12:36 PM
    #1
    ColdWaterTaco

    ColdWaterTaco [OP] Member

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    2010 V6 Auto 4WD TRD. No lift. Leaf Spring TSB with Bilstein 5100's all around - fronts set to stock height. Repeat: No lift. 4,750 miles.

    Now I have wobble and shudder in the floor, seat, all over when starting from a stop, until about 20-25 MPH. Had the U-bolts retorqued and this had no effect. And now, since the retorqueing, a clunk from the rear end of the truck when I stop. This is my 4th tacoma - no problems with any of them and now this.

    Took it to the dealer - they are going to investigate. I don't believe that the TSB springs or shocks could cause this if installed properly. Any useful opinions?

    By the way, I still have an '07 2WD 2.7L Manual that has 58,000 miles on it and runs perfectly. No wobbles, no clunks, no vibrations - a really good truck. I had an '00 4WD TRD Manual that was perfect for more than 80,000 miles and I guess I should have kept it. My first one was a '78. It also didn't wobble clunk or vibrate.:confused:

    Took it to the dealer - they are going to investigate. I don't believe that the TSB springs or shocks could cause this if installed properly. Any useful opinions?

    Any of you REAL mechanical guys have any useful ideas?
     
  2. Mar 31, 2010 at 1:07 PM
    #2
    98tacoma27

    98tacoma27 is gooder 'en chicken Moderator

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    So this only started happening AFTER the TSB install?
     
  3. Mar 31, 2010 at 1:09 PM
    #3
    nvdeserted

    nvdeserted Well-Known Member

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    Maybe they mounted a wheel improperly???

    Ooh, and a "clunk", they might have f'ed up your Ujoint. Try this: get moving then sort of coast (low RPM) then hit the gas hard, if it clunks it's probably the Ujoint.
     
  4. Mar 31, 2010 at 1:17 PM
    #4
    Andrew H

    Andrew H What is this "search" you speak of?

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    You said it started right after getting the work done right? Why didn't you turn around immediately after leaving the shop and give it right back to them?
     
  5. Mar 31, 2010 at 6:07 PM
    #5
    ColdWaterTaco

    ColdWaterTaco [OP] Member

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    This wobble/shudder thing didn't show up until over a week after the leaf spring TSB. I went back to the dealer as soon as it appeared (within 48 hours.) They said that perhaps the u-bolts had stretched and needed to be re-torqued. This re-torque had no effect.

    Tomorrow I'm going to the very reputable tire place that put my Bilstein 5100s a day or two after the leaf springs were installed. If the shocks are good to go, the only place to look is at the leaf spring installation and its possible effects. I demonstrated it to the service advisor guy who acknowledged that he felt it "all over the truck".

    I guess the ball is in their court. I don't believe that the leaf spings would cause this motion if properly installed. They, and the Bilstein 5100s would reduce axle wrap, wouldn't they?

    How could they have screwed up my U joint in this process? I'm asking because I'm not a mechanic and I've never replaced leaf spings before. I assume that they would detach the driveshaft prior to dropping the axle?
     
  6. Mar 31, 2010 at 7:13 PM
    #6
    OZ-T

    OZ-T Quite an experience to live in fear , isn't it ?

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    Did you get an alignment after the billy install ?

    OZ
     
  7. Mar 31, 2010 at 7:15 PM
    #7
    Andrew H

    Andrew H What is this "search" you speak of?

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  8. Mar 31, 2010 at 7:26 PM
    #8
    nvdeserted

    nvdeserted Well-Known Member

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    What PSI are your tires at? Any chance you lost a wheel weight or 2?
     
  9. Mar 31, 2010 at 7:42 PM
    #9
    Janster

    Janster Old & Forgetful

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    First off...you are not experiencing death wobble.

    Death wobble gets it name DEATH for a reason - because it'll scare the livin shit out of you when you experience it.

    Basically, due to a variety of things that start it to occur - the vehicle will start vibrating and occilating to the point you'll want to counter steer to correct it. The counter steer makes it even worse... normally at highway speeds, the occilations get sooo bad...you'll swear the vehicle will flip over and you're gonna die. Believe me, I've felt it. Scariest frigin thing I've ever experienced on the highway (in my jeep).

    What was it that you're experiencing again? A minor vibration....??

    It's a new truck, keep taking it back to the dealer.
     
  10. Mar 31, 2010 at 8:16 PM
    #10
    ColdWaterTaco

    ColdWaterTaco [OP] Member

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    Very Excuse Me So Much for my unacceptably ignorant use of a term not defined in any dictionary that I am aware of ("death wobble").

    Responses to useful posts:

    1. I had an alignnment right after the leaf spring installation.

    2. I will have the two rear tires checked for balance and roundness tomorrow, when the shocks are checked out. That was a good suggestion. It is not the front wheels - the steering wheel feels just fine. This is coming from somewhere behind the engine - feels like somewhere in the driveline/rear axle. It has nothing to do with the front end alignment. And the rear thrust angle was fine according to the alignment sheet.

    3. It is not a mild vibration. Its a shuddering wobble that is absolutely ridiculous. I've been driving Toyota and Nissan trucks, both 2wd and 4wd, for 30+ years. I know when something is not right. My other Taco, an 07 2WD doesn't wobble and shudder when leaving stasis for 3 seconds. Nor have any of my other trucks -- not ever.

    A very puzzling situation for an ignorant trogodolyte goober like me.

    You can bet I'll be at the dealer until it is fixed or returned.
     
  11. Mar 31, 2010 at 8:19 PM
    #11
    OZ-T

    OZ-T Quite an experience to live in fear , isn't it ?

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    I was wondering about a dropped wheel weight ( or 3 ) as well ,

    OZ
     
  12. Mar 31, 2010 at 8:27 PM
    #12
    SC4333

    SC4333 Well-Known Member

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    Exactly what I was thinking. Nothing like some good old Jeep induced "Death Wobble."

    Considering how the front end of a Tacoma is setup, the probability for death wobble is pretty nil.
     
  13. Mar 31, 2010 at 8:28 PM
    #13
    nvdeserted

    nvdeserted Well-Known Member

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    Possibly even 4.

    But it def sounds like a driveline issue. I bent a driveline before an it was real wobbley, unbareable really...Jeep. Bad Ujoints do it too but not at 4000miles unless it was defective. maybe forgot a bushing in the leafpack eylets etc.

    But this really shouldn't be hard to figure out for a machanic with the truck sitting infront of him. It could only be a handful of things causing it.

    Maybe the carrier bearing is still on someone's workbench... who knows.
     
  14. Mar 31, 2010 at 8:29 PM
    #14
    OZ-T

    OZ-T Quite an experience to live in fear , isn't it ?

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    3 1/10

    oz
     
  15. Mar 31, 2010 at 8:30 PM
    #15
    bmxutah

    bmxutah Member

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  16. Mar 31, 2010 at 8:31 PM
    #16
    ColdWaterTaco

    ColdWaterTaco [OP] Member

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    Definitely a good idea to check out the wheel weights. Good thought. Tomorrow I will have the wheel balances verified.

    I'm also going to see if the spare tire is cinched in as it should be. I read in another forum that they can work loose and shake during acceleration and bump during a stop.

    I love this truck otherwise - would like to keep it. The engine is a smooth whoosh, and it crawls around in the muck and ruts with aplomb. And it's beautiful....
     
  17. Mar 31, 2010 at 8:54 PM
    #17
    ShadowFalken

    ShadowFalken Well-Known Member

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    You stated that you had the front end alignment "right after the springs" and that confuses me a little. I thought the spring TSB included an alignment as part of the work. This makes sense because of the change in ride height having an impact on the alignment. The only variable on the TSB was if it included new shocks or not. TRD trucks did not get shocks, non TRD got them.

    Back to your issue. Since it came up after the install by a couple of days, your description of the feel I would look from the transfer case back to start. Spring shackles not tight, drive-shaft (even if I had to pull it out to check joints for smooth articulation) and or carrier bearing.

    Does the vibration feel linear (surging) or more side to side wobble.

    Please do not take the "death wobble" comments wrong. When I read your post I had the same thought of "OH CRAP". I have felt the original death wobble and we are talking about something that could break your arm if the steering wheel got away from you. So with those that have seen it, the "death wobble" is like the Highlander........"there can be only one" :D
     
  18. Mar 31, 2010 at 9:24 PM
    #18
    Yoytoda

    Yoytoda The Little Truck That Could

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    x2 on death wobble... my old k5 i bent a tie rod and got death wobble on the way home from the trail. it was so bad i lost control and went flying off the road into a ditch. lucky me i had lockers and just climbed back onto the road. a "bad shimmy in the truck wont give you "deathwobble" Not trying to belittle your problem but Janster is right death wobble is real hell...

    I would say "death wobble defined as a problem which causes to wheels to go back and forth getting progressively worse cause total loss of streering control" kinda like speed wobble on a skate board or a tank slapper on a motorcycle

    with that said, you said in OP that the vibration is up to 20-25mph. After that does it smooth out??? alot of people note a vibration after they install lift springs in the rear if the axle angle doesnt match the drive shaft angle causing strain on the u joints. an angle shim in between the axle and leaf will sometimes get rid of it. i doubt there is anything defective with the driveline. also, if you go the same speed where the vibration is the worst and shift into neutral see if it goes away...
     
  19. Mar 31, 2010 at 9:27 PM
    #19
    OZ-T

    OZ-T Quite an experience to live in fear , isn't it ?

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    Any chance your 2010 numbers match the 2010 driveshaft TSB ?

    just saying,

    OZ
     
  20. Apr 1, 2010 at 5:49 PM
    #20
    xJuice

    xJuice My spoon is too Big!

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    My truck has done this for as long as i can remember. Pre and post TSB leafs. And I've heard of many others on this forum. No good solution found.
     
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