Discount tire lug nut issue

Whats so wrong with the shank type lug nut with ET? It still centers it on the stud and if its hub centric it should be okay.

 

The cone on a shank style nut is also for securing the spare tire wheel, which is typically steel

 

That was my stance. As long as the wheel is HC the shank is good. If that wheel is offered as a "Toyota" option from the dealer then there's a 99% chance it's HC

 

True true i forgot about that.

I agree here. The texas edition exists and the wheels are OEM toyota it seems. It cant hurt anything, only help it.

 

I am just curious as to what you mean here? Do you mean because they are OEM they wouldn't use ET lug nuts, or because they are hub centric they wouldn't use ET lug nuts?

Just wondering because I have hub centric wheels that use ET lug nuts. The guy at Discount Tire Direct was pretty adamant about not using the ET ones I bought, but they work great (not a knock on Discount Tire Direct, may have just been the specific person I talked to).

 

DT sounds cracked out. Clean up the hub, push the fuckin wheel onto the hub and torque the lug nuts. Not rocket science, in the end if its centered and torqued down with the correct thread and size lug nut you are good.

 

In some dealer optioned and/or regional package applications the wheel can be both hub centric as well as using acorn nuts. I've had experience with some older Scion/Toyota dealer option "OEM" rims that were that way.

 

Let's summarize this before it's spins too far away from your original question.

-TD wasn't entirely wrong. True OEM Toyota alloy rims do use the shank nut.

-Your rims are a part of a regional package (Texas Edition). It's all sanctioned by Toyota but is not a true factory setup. It was probably done at a port location by Toyota Logistics Services.

-Your rims are technically aftermarket...but, are no doubt, hub centric as they should be.

-Many aftermarket rims (like yours) use acorn/tapered lug nuts. I'm confident the ones you have are correct.

-If you want to use the actual OEM shank nuts, it looks like your particular wheel will except them. If you go that route, be mindful that there are 2 different length. Most application use the shorter ones. Deeper lug wells use the longer ones for better accessibility and thread engagement. Yours look like the shorter ones will be fine. The longer one will work as well, but may stick out further.

You're good either way. Enjoy your truck

 

I only mean Toyota has historically designed their alloy wheels to be hub centric with shank style lug nuts that have clearance enough not to attempt to align the wheel to the studs. The center bore of the wheel is made to fit exactly on the outer diameter of the hub and the lug nuts are just expected to clamp the wheel to the surface.

I believe GM has traditionally not done this and aftermarket wheels don't usually follow this convention. Those use a tapered lug nut seat with clearance around the hub. As you tighten down the lug nuts the taper forces each bore to center around its bolt. It's the way to do it if you want a universal wheel. You size the center to fit the largest diameter you expect to encounter and will fit anything smaller but then it won't work to center the wheel anymore.

You could do both but there's no reason to normally. You just want the mass of the wheel and tire to be concentric with the center of the axle and hub. How that happens doesn't matter just as long as it does.

As an aside, I think this is why you get more balance issues with aftermarket wheels on Toyotas. How you torque down the wheels studs becomes important. When you put the wheel on at first it's off center hanging on the hub, put on the lug nuts and snug them too fast the wheel will be clamped slightly off center. You have to put tapered nuts on loose enough to let the wheel center adjust before cranking them down in the crossing pattern. It's little irritations like this that drive you mad. Just loosening and retorqueing your lug nuts will make vibrations come and go. The factory doesn't care, they have a tool that installs all 6 nuts at the same time and the wheel naturally centers since no one lug nut is holding the wheel significantly ahead of the others.

I think the Discount guy is just confused because normally a Toyota OEM alloy wheel will use shank lug nuts. I guess these wheels are a special case and aren't actually made by Toyota, essentially being aftermarket wheels resold by them.

 

My wife had a Yaris a few years back. There were "OEM" alloys available as an option...but only from the dealer, not the factory. They were hub centric but used acron style nuts. It's common on non-factory but Toyota sanctioned optional wheels.

 

That makes sense. Aftermarket wheel manufacturers aren't usually going to make brand and maybe even model specific hub centric shank style wheels. I would guess their processes don't guarantee tolerances that way or perhaps they don't even bother having tooling to machine non-tapered lug nut pockets. But being a Toyota-approved contract manufactured wheel they can spec the center bore diameter and can therefore still be hub centric. The only remotely potential downside to this is you may ask the wheel studs to deflect slightly but the reality is that would only happen if the wheel or hub were *really* poorly made. Ideally the stud should line up perfectly in the center of each bore so having a taper or not won't matter.

 

Thanks for the input!

After filing a complaint i did hear from the DT Manager this morning. After he viewed the pics was still behind his tech on the decision that the lug nuts on my wheels are considered “unsafe” and I should be using the stock shank nuts.

My concern with using the stock shank nuts (definitely wheels are not my niche in the knowledge bank) is the fact if they sit flat on the wheel, wouldn’t there be a space betweened the beveled opening and the bottom lip of lug nut? Here’s my attempt of a drawing to explain what i’m talking about.

 

Nope...that space is nothing to worry about. But seriously.....you're good either way.

 

You're picturing it correctly, true shank lug nuts are designed to have clearance. Their job is only to hold the wheel to the hub. The huge center bore of the wheel fits snug over the hub, which centers it on the axle.

With a taper the nut would center itself on the stud, doing both things. With a taper the center of the wheel can be loose on the hub.

True acorn types don't have the extended length (e.g. ET, extended thread) like the ones you have, which are kind of a hybrid of both and your wheels seems to be designed to accept either.

The difference here is really pretty small, so either way you're fine.

You run into a problem if the styles really don't mismatch. That's where you get a square edge interfacing to a ball or taper or vice versa. You need the lug nuts and wheels to match, the original lug nuts that came with your truck aren't necessarily the right ones for all wheels. That's even true of other OEM wheels, steel wheels are acorns and alloys are shank.