1. Welcome to Tacoma World!

    You are currently viewing as a guest! To get full-access, you need to register for a FREE account.

    As a registered member, you’ll be able to:
    • Participate in all Tacoma discussion topics
    • Communicate privately with other Tacoma owners from around the world
    • Post your own photos in our Members Gallery
    • Access all special features of the site

DIY: Secondary Air Filter Removal

Discussion in 'Performance and Tuning' started by 007Tacoma, Jul 7, 2007.

  1. Oct 28, 2013 at 3:25 PM
    #621
    AlexHermsen

    AlexHermsen Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2013
    Member:
    #115357
    Messages:
    39
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Alex
    Oceanside, CA
    Vehicle:
    2015 4.0l 4x4 Sport
    CAI, Flowmaster Super 44, HID's, Leveling kit, Camper shell
    So I went through this thread and didn't see anything about this effecting dust getting into the engine as it's just required for emissions. I am considering taking this carbon filter out on my '12 4cyl, and putting it back in when it comes time for me to get smogged.

    Anything I need to know?
     
  2. Oct 28, 2013 at 5:00 PM
    #622
    worthywads

    worthywads Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2011
    Member:
    #58841
    Messages:
    3,886
    Gender:
    Male
    Peoples Republic of Boulder
    Vehicle:
    05 5-lug access I4 Stick, 70 Challenger Vert
    Why would you want to do it?

    It has zero effect on engine performance, and no it doesn't effect dust since your air filter does that.

    You will have to break the plastic rivets that hold it in place and then find a way to reattach when emission time comes.

    It really is a pointless mod.
     
  3. Oct 28, 2013 at 8:30 PM
    #623
    Rich91710

    Rich91710 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2012
    Member:
    #73470
    Messages:
    16,406
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Rich
    Los Angeles
    Vehicle:
    08 Base
    Satoshi with FJ badge, factory cruise, factory intermittent wipers, Redline Tuning hood-lift struts, Hellwig Swaybar, Rosen DVD-Nav
    +1

    My truck will probably need smog next year... debating whether to chance it or just buy a new airbox lid.
    I really wish I had never popped that thing out.
     
  4. Oct 29, 2013 at 8:35 AM
    #624
    DonziGT230

    DonziGT230 Gearhead

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2013
    Member:
    #111514
    Messages:
    387
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Oscar
    Hacienda Hts, Ca.
    Vehicle:
    '07 base taco. Sold. Now Taco-less
    Factory cruise added, wood storage box in bed, wood center console/armrest, charcoal air filter delete.
    If you really want it gone I'll trade you for my cover, already cleanly deleted the charcoal filter.
    My smog guy is a buddy and won't check it, but if I could go back I'd have left it alone. There is no benefit to removing it and it'll never get dirty and need replacement. There's a minute possibility that leaving it there will help the air filter by blocking the gas fumes from getting to it; probably doesn't matter, but thought I'd throw a positive other than emissions reduction into the mix.
     
  5. Nov 16, 2013 at 11:08 AM
    #625
    jkorting1988

    jkorting1988 New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2013
    Member:
    #116007
    Messages:
    2
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    john
    norfolk, va
    Vehicle:
    05 tacoma base 4wd
    40-ft tow chain, 10-ft tow rope, 5% tint on back window, 20% on front windows, bug flector, rain guards
    I just recently removed the secondary filter, replaced plugs, and ran some lucas in the fuel. I still however see a lag in power when trying to accelerate.
     
  6. Dec 1, 2013 at 3:00 PM
    #626
    Todos Larry

    Todos Larry Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2013
    Member:
    #117661
    Messages:
    9
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Larry
    Baja Mexico
    Vehicle:
    TRD Sport
    JBL Stereo and full Nav K&N Cold air intake system
    Have any of you added the K&N 63 cold air system to replace the factory, what about improved MPG.
    My 2013 V^ auto is getting 275 per tank- uggg The truck seems to be running great but milage is horrible
     
  7. Dec 1, 2013 at 6:15 PM
    #627
    worthywads

    worthywads Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2011
    Member:
    #58841
    Messages:
    3,886
    Gender:
    Male
    Peoples Republic of Boulder
    Vehicle:
    05 5-lug access I4 Stick, 70 Challenger Vert
    Intakes don't improve mpg.
     
  8. Dec 26, 2013 at 11:22 AM
    #628
    Matt

    Matt Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2013
    Member:
    #119085
    Messages:
    32
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    PreRunner 2011
    I am new Tacoma member :D

    I have been getting around 20MPG on 2011 prerunner which is all stock. I went ahead and purchased aFe Pro Dry S air filter. I have been on the fence about removing the second filter. I am in Texas so shouldn't be an issue with emissions test.
     
  9. Dec 27, 2013 at 5:41 AM
    #629
    Todos Larry

    Todos Larry Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2013
    Member:
    #117661
    Messages:
    9
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Larry
    Baja Mexico
    Vehicle:
    TRD Sport
    JBL Stereo and full Nav K&N Cold air intake system
    Can't offer any real thughts on this, my 2013 is TRD is stock and runs great but gets around 14-16? I just bought the K&N and will install this week.
    Hoping for a power booast and better mileage
     
  10. Dec 27, 2013 at 1:24 PM
    #630
    Justus

    Justus fucks not given

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2013
    Member:
    #94417
    Messages:
    9,242
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Nabisco the kid
    In ur toolbox
    Vehicle:
    not so low, not so slow 2006 6 lug
    stockish
    people have reported hp losses as recorded by a Dyno from K&N intakes iirc.

    ymmv, just throwin that out there.
    they also have terrible filtering properties, and ya gotta make sure to keep the oil on the filter to a minimum and clean ur maf sensor regularly.
     
  11. Jan 28, 2014 at 11:09 AM
    #631
    DJ KRAZY K

    DJ KRAZY K Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2012
    Member:
    #76817
    Messages:
    72
    Gender:
    Male
    NM
    Vehicle:
    '15 TRD OFF ROAD 4X4 V6 Manual
    OME 886+Dakars, ARE Shell
    So, I know this thread is about taking of the secondary, but what about replacing it? Mine got a little wet after I went through some deep muddy water, I thought wasn't as deep as it was, and yes I did get out and check the depth but couldn't get to the middle of water.

    IMG_20140125_141705_881.jpg
     
  12. Jan 28, 2014 at 7:07 PM
    #632
    Rich91710

    Rich91710 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2012
    Member:
    #73470
    Messages:
    16,406
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Rich
    Los Angeles
    Vehicle:
    08 Base
    Satoshi with FJ badge, factory cruise, factory intermittent wipers, Redline Tuning hood-lift struts, Hellwig Swaybar, Rosen DVD-Nav
    It'll dry out quickly with the air being pulled through it.

    I'd be more concerned about water getting into the MAF and other sensors downstream of the filter... or did it get just enough water to dampen it and not flood out?
     
  13. Jan 29, 2014 at 7:00 AM
    #633
    DJ KRAZY K

    DJ KRAZY K Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2012
    Member:
    #76817
    Messages:
    72
    Gender:
    Male
    NM
    Vehicle:
    '15 TRD OFF ROAD 4X4 V6 Manual
    OME 886+Dakars, ARE Shell
    I am not 100% sure how far it got, I think some did get past the filters but not much, is there a thread on how to clean the sensors?

    Thanks!
     
  14. Feb 6, 2014 at 6:50 PM
    #634
    4x4fiend

    4x4fiend Member

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2014
    Member:
    #120434
    Messages:
    15
    Gender:
    Male
    So while you are busy cutting out part of the filtration in the system, you are concerned with debris entering your engine to the point of putting foil over the intake while it's idle?

    I understand it is another restriction in the system, but a charcoal filter is a pretty low differential element compared to the paper filter. In my opinion (however little it's worth) it's the same as a k&n filter, your sacrificing the life of the engine for very little gain. The finer dust is just as damaging as the larger.

    That being said, a small gain can be quite noticeable in a smaller engine. And with what some of us put our trucks through, it's probably the least of our concerns
     
  15. Feb 6, 2014 at 8:02 PM
    #635
    Rich91710

    Rich91710 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2012
    Member:
    #73470
    Messages:
    16,406
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Rich
    Los Angeles
    Vehicle:
    08 Base
    Satoshi with FJ badge, factory cruise, factory intermittent wipers, Redline Tuning hood-lift struts, Hellwig Swaybar, Rosen DVD-Nav
    The foil is simply a precaution and is a good idea any time the intake is removed from the throttle body for any length of time.

    The charcoal "filter" is not actually a filter at all, so removing it does not reduce the effectiveness of the intake filtration system.
    The charcoal mesh captures unburned hydrocarbons that rise out of the intake after engine shutdown. It self-purges when the engine is running.

    And yes, I agree that removing the filter does nothing but perhaps increase noise a bit.
     
  16. Feb 7, 2014 at 8:48 AM
    #636
    DonziGT230

    DonziGT230 Gearhead

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2013
    Member:
    #111514
    Messages:
    387
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Oscar
    Hacienda Hts, Ca.
    Vehicle:
    '07 base taco. Sold. Now Taco-less
    Factory cruise added, wood storage box in bed, wood center console/armrest, charcoal air filter delete.
    I think the title of this thread should be edited.

    DIY: Secondary Air Filter Removal; how to waste your time gaining nothing and breaking the law.

    I've verified that removing it makes no change using a scanner and watching the MAF numbers at full throttle acceleration. Three runs with and without to 85MPH, same amount of air flow so same amount of power. As for fuel economy; technically it'll be better with the charcoal trap, but to an unmeasurable amount.
     
  17. Feb 14, 2014 at 12:07 AM
    #637
    crobertson20

    crobertson20 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2013
    Member:
    #106105
    Messages:
    41
    Gender:
    Male
    Albuquerque, NM
    Vehicle:
    2009 TRD Sport DCSB
    Here are my last three tanks of gas:

    1st tank: normal driving, not aggressive but not overly conservative, "secondary filter" still in place....17.5 mpg

    2nd tank: conservative driving under 2k rpms, "secondary filter" still in place...18.5 mpg

    3rd tank: conservative driving under 2k rpms, secondary filter removed...~19.8 mpg

    Obviously i'll have to keep track for more than a few tanks, but I saw positive improvement. All the driving conditions were the same, city driving with mixed in highway. Hoping that if I do a drop in AFE Pro Dry S that it'll bump it up ever so slightly more!
     
  18. Feb 14, 2014 at 5:34 AM
    #638
    worthywads

    worthywads Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2011
    Member:
    #58841
    Messages:
    3,886
    Gender:
    Male
    Peoples Republic of Boulder
    Vehicle:
    05 5-lug access I4 Stick, 70 Challenger Vert
    Time to post this again. They found zero loss in MPG with filters clogged to the point of damaging the intake tubing.

    http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/pdfs/Air_Filter_Effects_02_26_2009.pdf

    There is good understanding why your intake has zero bearing on fuel economy. Modern fuel injection controls the fuel amount precisely, and the throttle plate controls the amount of air going in. Unless you are at full throttle the throttle plate will always be a bigger restriction than the air filter. It's job is to restriction so you control our speed.

    You are keeping rpms below 2000 rpm, your air filter isn't even 1/3 of it's max flow, there is no gain by having less restriction when it isn't needed.
     
  19. Feb 14, 2014 at 6:46 AM
    #639
    DonziGT230

    DonziGT230 Gearhead

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2013
    Member:
    #111514
    Messages:
    387
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Oscar
    Hacienda Hts, Ca.
    Vehicle:
    '07 base taco. Sold. Now Taco-less
    Factory cruise added, wood storage box in bed, wood center console/armrest, charcoal air filter delete.
    That is a really cool test, thanks for sharing. I did expect more loss from the carbed car and a small loss from the EFIs, but no. Regardless, you know we'll see another claim here from the next guy who spends a bunch of money on a filter, and the more he spends the better his economy and power will be.
     
  20. Feb 14, 2014 at 7:29 AM
    #640
    crobertson20

    crobertson20 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2013
    Member:
    #106105
    Messages:
    41
    Gender:
    Male
    Albuquerque, NM
    Vehicle:
    2009 TRD Sport DCSB
    Mmmmmm....ok? I guess my slight bump was just MAGIC! I understand the air/fuel component (took combustion in grad school), but the fact is the more air the better. And do you think it's possible that the fuel injector control isn't exactly as dead on as you think? I'm sure it's pretty damn close, but if it's just ever so slightly off at adjusting the amount of fuel it injects, it could be too rich to get complete combustion from the amount of air entering the combustion chamber. It's going to be a very small effect, but what else could possibly explain my increase in fuel mileage? I'm open to other suggestions if you have any since my driving has been exactly the same over the weeks I kept track of it...
     
To Top