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Enough Already! Your Truck's T, HP and RPM Explained

Discussion in '3rd Gen. Tacomas (2016+)' started by hiPSI, Oct 24, 2018.

  1. Oct 16, 2020 at 6:17 PM
    #601
    hiPSI

    hiPSI [OP] Laminar Flow

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    I'll just stay here and enjoy the atmosphere. Seriously... some of those guys are really not smart.
     
  2. Oct 16, 2020 at 6:26 PM
    #602
    Spraynard

    Spraynard Priapism survivor

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    It's not so bad. You do see pitchforks if the scientific method hoves into view and there is an increasing mistrust of the Toyota Engineering department.
     
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  3. Oct 16, 2020 at 6:48 PM
    #603
    hiPSI

    hiPSI [OP] Laminar Flow

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    Yea no. I come here and hopefully help out by writing articles like the first post in this thread. Not to deal with dumbass old guys who have no clue. And I'm 57!
     
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  4. Oct 16, 2020 at 7:02 PM
    #604
    melikeymy beer

    melikeymy beer Hold my beer and watch this

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    I find Tundras.com somewhat similar to TW. If I accept that Toyota engineers know more about designing a truck than me (crazy I know) and I'm OK changing my synthetic oil at intervals above 3k miles, I can just concentrate on shit posting.

    Edit: youngster

    2xumjs.jpg
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2020 at 7:13 PM
  5. Oct 16, 2020 at 7:47 PM
    #605
    hiPSI

    hiPSI [OP] Laminar Flow

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    Haha yea, I know. As you probably figured out, I don't come to forums to get help but to have a bit of laughs and maybe help others. This is a good place. I think I will stay...
     
  6. Oct 18, 2020 at 9:41 AM
    #606
    GrundleJuice

    GrundleJuice Well-Known Member

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    This seems like as good a place as any to ask: are there any tq curve graphs for the 4.0L vs the 3.5L?

    My 2015 is almost certainly going to be a total loss and finding a 2nd gen DCLB is pretty much impossible without traveling several hundreds of miles to even look at one so looks like I might be shopping 3rd gens. The engine performance difference is not a deal breaker, just curious to how they compare.
     
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  7. Oct 20, 2020 at 3:46 PM
    #607
    hiPSI

    hiPSI [OP] Laminar Flow

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    I don't know how mathematical you are but just imagine a 500 rpm amplitude shift. About the same hp and torque.
    I had a few 4Runners with the 4.0 so I have experience with both and they are comparable.
     
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  8. Oct 20, 2020 at 4:05 PM
    #608
    GrundleJuice

    GrundleJuice Well-Known Member

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    Remembered K&N supplies dyno charts for their intake systems. As many would know, K&N is less than ideal source for real HP/TQ numbers but hopefully the tq curve shapes should give an idea of how these engines make power. Also, any dyno testing not done back to back or in a controlled environment (like a lab, not a heated garage) by a competent operator, is not comparable for actual power figures. So basically ignore the peak number, take the curves location on the x-axis with a handful of salt and so on...

    Looks like the 4.0L makes significant amount of peak tq very early in the RPM range, which matches my experience. It takes some right foot to get to that power, but if the pedal is pushed far enough it's easy to break the tires free from a stop and acceleration/passing tq feel linear and flat.

    I just test drove a 2016 last night, 42k miles and looked to be in good shape. I have read various opinions about it feeling gutless and I would have to mostly agree with that unless it's wound up near peak RPM. I felt that power would come on unevenly as RPMs rise and then a surge toward the peak RPMs before a gear shift. The graph shows that power comes on and wavers before a brief surge above 5k rpm. The dyno graph below shows a really ugly tq curve that winds up and down before the final peak tq spike around 5.5k rpm, though it holds pretty steady and flat above 4k, pretty much matching my observation exactly. Not a terrible trade off for the added MPG's, but something that will be noticeable coming from the 4.0L. I suspect that aggressive tuning for fuel efficiency and emissions is a big part of why tq is so unsteady in the lower 2/3's of the RPM band, but that is just a theory. If I am correct, some tuning could (should?) wake this engine up significantly as long as there is no hardware restricting tq production in lower rpm's but not at higher RPMs.

    KN2012.jpg KN2016.jpg
     
  9. Oct 20, 2020 at 4:35 PM
    #609
    GrundleJuice

    GrundleJuice Well-Known Member

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    It looks to be more like 1500+rpm shift and a atrocious tq curve shape to go with it. Ive seen tq delivery like that on other N/A engines. One that comes to mind is the 2.5L subaru EJ253. A tune to eliminate the CL to OL delay and some MAF calibrating made a huge difference on that engine. My somewhat ignorant theory of the 3.5L Tacoma engine, from having driven one and now seeing the tq curve shape, is that a similar tune to nail down MAF, clean up fueling and take out the O2 sensor feedback early may really give this engine some low RPM life. I should start reading the hundreds of pages in the VF tune thread.
     
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  10. Oct 20, 2020 at 5:05 PM
    #610
    MOC221_

    MOC221_ Humble subject of King Shit

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    :thumbsup:
     
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  11. Oct 20, 2020 at 5:15 PM
    #611
    hiPSI

    hiPSI [OP] Laminar Flow

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    OV Tune will help but it can't fundamentally change the curve that much.
    It's not 1500 rpm difference lol.
     
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  12. Oct 20, 2020 at 5:21 PM
    #612
    MOC221_

    MOC221_ Humble subject of King Shit

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    You'd be surprised, actually. No, peak torque doesn't change considerably.. but the whole area below that peak does.
    OVT allows access to power that this little V6 can produce down low.
     
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  13. Oct 20, 2020 at 5:22 PM
    #613
    hiPSI

    hiPSI [OP] Laminar Flow

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    Just noticed your curve posted. Thanks for that! Look where the engine lives though between 2500 and 3500.
     
  14. Oct 20, 2020 at 5:23 PM
    #614
    Mrtacoman88

    Mrtacoman88 TRDude

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    Will agree, the low end torque is quite strong on the SFOB premium. Its day and night compared to stock tuning. First gear is insanely fast now.
     
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  15. Oct 20, 2020 at 5:27 PM
    #615
    MOC221_

    MOC221_ Humble subject of King Shit

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    I don't know about insanely fast lol.. how about "immediate".
    There are 2D tables in the stock calibration whose sole purpose is to limit throttle in 1st gear. Nope!
     
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  16. Oct 20, 2020 at 5:32 PM
    #616
    Mrtacoman88

    Mrtacoman88 TRDude

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    It feels like its going 2 times faster in first and the wheels wanna spin when im accelerating to around 5k rpm on dry pavement. I felt a huge difference. It does feel insane to me i guess;)
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2020 at 5:37 PM
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  17. Oct 20, 2020 at 5:43 PM
    #617
    MOC221_

    MOC221_ Humble subject of King Shit

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    The change in low end torque delivery is a game changer for me.
    I can putt along at 1100-1200RPM in 6th gear on back roads with light throttle no sweat. It will accelerate with just a bit more pedal. Need a little more if the back road gets a little hilly? 5th all day.
    2nd gear parking lot shenanigans are the norm now.
    Starting in 2nd.. well I don't make a habit of it but it's much easier.
    Most of my shifts happen at 2k or less, unless it's an on ramp launch or I'm feeling sassy lol
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2020 at 3:25 AM
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  18. Oct 20, 2020 at 5:57 PM
    #618
    GrundleJuice

    GrundleJuice Well-Known Member

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    I was using the rpm where each curve crossed 200ft/lb as a reference. Looks like about 1600+rpm delta.

    Seems like someone here might have some insight on this so I'll ask, how are the ignition timing tables affected by fuel octane on the stock tune? Any timing advance/ignition advance multiplier/etc gained with 91 octane?
     
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  19. Oct 20, 2020 at 6:02 PM
    #619
    4x4Runner

    4x4Runner Now with more Oi Vey! Moderator

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    136HP and 105lbft torques with a 6speed manual FTW!!!
     
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  20. Oct 20, 2020 at 6:16 PM
    #620
    MOC221_

    MOC221_ Humble subject of King Shit

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    Best person to answer that question WRT stock calibration would be Mat from OVtune. He definitely set up his "premium" files for more advance on 91 and above. In fact, on his latest 2.0 tunes, an octane learning function was coded.
     
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