Help Me Get A Lift

So then without preloading the springs... on the 5/6th notch its at about 2"?

 

mhm I was kinda disappointed especially since it will sag over time and if I plan on a front bumper well yeah lol, that's y I was gonna drop a 1/2" spacer on the driver side with 1/4" passenger to still compensate for the lean and see in that makes it any better, I really don't want to get new coils/shocks and redo all the bs

 

I really don't know.

 

King’s aren’t the best just FYI. The quality of their components and coatings is different than ADS. Not to mention ADS is progressive compression and digressive expansion...just saying

 

Can you ellaborate on the bold? I haven’t heard this before. Also not familiar with “expansion”.

 

It’s the type of valving the shock has when it compresses and when it rebounds. Progressive is better as a daily driver which is why Fox gets such good reviews on highway/road driving, but you have to spend a lot of $$$ to get great quality with Fox as compared to what you get with a phenomenal company like ADS. Digressive valving is good for bumpy roads and washboard above 25mph. ADS adjustable extended travel shocks are awesomely equipped for daily driving and Offroad situations. The adjustable reservoirs allow 20 different settings from soft to firm, so depending on if you are daily driving, towing, or off-roading you are covered. ADS is spendy compared to Bilstein regular shocks. I almost went with the Bilstein 8112’s due to the cool technology, but I need a 700lb spring and the Billys only come with 600#

 

nice, what setup you running?

 

I've got 8112s with 700lb springs

 

Also, when you get bigger tires...285’s are a lot heavier than 255’s or 265’s...if you want to enjoy the power and better mpg, stick to 255 or 265 width. (I’m a 255 guy myself because I love being lifted with Dakar’s and amor and still netting -18-22mpg

Nice I wanna see em

 

I'll post pictures Friday..

 

I have to ask, do you get commissions from ADS for endorsing their product?

The "expansion" you're referring to is known as rebound. This is the first time I have heard ADS uses progressive compression and digressive rebound. I was under the impression that only Icon did this. I have yet to get my hands on ADS, as there has been a lot of hype about them but very little factual information to be found. I also believe you have the pros/cons in reverse. Digressive typically gets a better hype of good road characteristics and progressive is typically more consistent off road, yet provides a little more body roll. This is mainly due to the pre-tension that the valves in a digressive shock have on them. This also causes them to be a little more stiff on choppy/bumpy roads until you provide enough force to fully open the valves. I don't believe it's necessarily a speed factor, although typically hard hits are at faster speeds. We also have to remember that shock valving is mainly driver's preference. You may like a stiffer ride and little body roll, I may like a softer ride and not mind body roll. It's often times per the individual.

I'm also disagree that Fox gets good on road driving reviews. They tend to be awfully stiff from the factory, again this is driver's preference. I'd like to understand where your spending lots of money to get good quality out of one of the top performance manufacturers like Fox/King? I believe both products have pros/cons in their own way, although Fox has a little more broad of a lineup for a variety of budgets.

I do see that possibility that ADS has a better QA and machining tolerances. They are a much smaller company than any of the previously mentioned and I could see them keeping a higher expectation on what their machine work is putting out. I have a hard time believing that your average Joe would notice a difference in machine quality. I personally believe that ADS has smaller market of more serious drivers that allows them to tune their shocks accordingly, and therefore getting a high rep from people who seriously use their vehicles. This is just a guess though.

 

Sweet and also how much preload/lift?

 

No I don’t get commission. It’s my opinion as someone who appreciates when a company uses good components, are American made, and aren’t a big commercialized company. ADS is known to focus on quality.

I don’t like stiff shocks unless I am towing and I have heard from many that they think Icon is stiff.

ADS has unique valving for both on road almost stock like ride and great control and rebound Offroad. Progressive compression and digressive rebound.

All companies are good companies. I just think ADS puts a little more into their product.


This is part of an email from Marie at Headstrong when I was asking what she recommends for shocks for my ride. She supported all companies, but pointed out this info below:

“...
Bilstein B8 8112 (ZoneControl) CR suspension kits are a direct fit, position sensitive coilover designed for light trucks and SUV’s. ZoneControl CR is a revolutionary technology delivering position sensitive damping. The system incorporates a triple piston design, offering 3 stages of compression valving and 2 stages of rebound valving. The coilover module utilizes a threaded spring seat for ride height adjustability ranging from .5-2.5”. The coilover is supplied with a remote reservoir for increased cooling and an accompanied, bolt-on anodized reservoir chassis mount. BILSTEIN B8 8112 (ZoneControl) CR position sensitive coilovers will offer unparalleled ride comfort during every day driving combined with maximum control over large suspension inputs.


Outside of the 8112 I have a lot of people who ask about the performance coilovers and they tend to debate between brands. Since that is the case I find it helpful to provide a general comparison of the various coilover brands and their standard offerings so you can compare them side-by-side and see which one, if any, speaks to you and your needs.


Icon has stock replacement 2.5” diameter coilovers that are sold in either extended travel (requiring ucas) or standard travel. The standard travel do not require them but can need them if the coilover is adjusted up for lift and alignment cannot be achieved. They can come either with or without reservoir and compression adjustors. They come standard with a 650lb spring rate but can be upgraded to a 700lb spring for an additional fee. They have steel body and aluminum components. They have a digressive valving which some feel can provide a stiffer on-road ride quality, depending on terrain and speed. The valving does seem to do very well off-road at higher speeds over larger bumps/whoops. They come preset to provide around 2.5" of lift on the 05-15's and around 1.5" on the 2016+ models. They can be adjusted to provide more or less lift depending on what suits your needs. Keep in mind, whenever adjusting a coilover you need to make sure that they are not adjusted to a point that will cause coil bind on compression. They have their rear 2.0 rear shocks, 2.0 rear with reservoir, and a 2.5" rear shock available as well. Depending on the rear lift chosen you should have an option available that will accommodate the lift. The Icon kits listed on the site feature their add-a-leaf so if you were to look at a full leaf pack replacement the rear shocks within that kit may or may not work.


Fox has stock replacement 2.0 and 2.5” diameter coilovers. Their 2.0 coilover is standard travel and their 2.5 comes in standard travel or extended travel (requiring uca's). The standard travel do not require them but can need them if the coilover is adjusted up for lift and alignment cannot be achieved. The Fox 2.5’s can come with or without reservoirs and compression adjustors. They come standard with a 13” 600lb spring rate coil. Fox does not offer coil changes so if you wanted a higher spring rate they would have to be sourced separately. We do offer this service for our clients. We carry a 14" 600lb, 14" 650lb, and a 14" 700lb and it is an additional $250 total for the coils and the labor to switch them out. Their 2.0 performance series shocks have an aluminum body. Their 2.5” shocks have an alloy body and steel shaft that has been Zinc-plated and double-clear coated. They have a progressive valving which some feel can provide a plusher on-road ride quality, depending on terrain and speed. Fox specs out the standard travel coilovers to provide around 0-2” of lift and the extended travel 0-3” of lift. They come preset to provide around 2" of lift on the 05-15's and around 1" on the 2016+ models. They can be adjusted to provide more or less lift depending on what suits your needs however due to their design it is required to make the adjustments off of the vehicle and utilize a spring compressor to take the tension off of the collar. Keep in mind, whenever adjusting a coilover you need to make sure that they are not adjusted to a point that will cause coil bind on compression. For the rear Fox has their rear 2.0 rear shocks, 2.0 rear with reservoir, and a 2.5" rear shock available as well. Fox has a very conservative extended length for their shocks so we do make pairings based on the rear lift chosen and actual specifications of the rear shock instead of going off of Fox's lift guide.


ADS utilizes similar components in their OE lines as they do their race lines so that is a nice benefit. ADS has 2.5” diameter coilovers the come in standard travel however we have a proprietary extended travel version available. They come in an IFP version as well as there is a reservoir version with optional compression adjustors available as well. We have options for 600lb, 650lb and 700lb coils available at no extra charge. They have steel body and aluminum components. From the feedback I do have from people who have run a variety of these coilovers most feel like these stood up to road salts better than some of the other brands listed. I cannot personally speak directly to this since I am not located in an area that contends with salt but people seem to like the ADS’s coating better than others. Their OEM bolt in Tacoma coil-overs are digressively valved on the rebound side and run progressive valving on the compression. The main reason for this is to give you the stable ride for on road and less of the harshness when traveling off-road. They come preset to provide around 2.5" of lift on the 05-15's and around 1.5" on the 2016+ models. They can be adjusted to provide more or less lift depending on what suits your needs. Keep in mind, whenever adjusting a coilover you need to make sure that they are not adjusted to a point that will cause coil bind on compression. For the rear ADS has a 2.5" with piggyback reservoir and a 2.5" with hose reservoir and compression adjusters. We have worked with ADS to develop both standard and extended travel rear shocks to pair with either the add-a-leafs and small blocks and the full lift leaf pack replacements and taller blocks.


King has a 2.5” diameter coilover that comes only in standard travel with a hose reservoir. They do have an optional compression adjustor available. The come built with a 600 lb spring rate. They have steel body and aluminum components. They have a progressive valving. They come preset to provide around 2.5" of lift on the 05-15's and around 1.5" on the 2016+ models. They can be adjusted to provide more or less lift depending on what suits your needs. Keep in mind, whenever adjusting a coilover you need to make sure that they are not adjusted to a point that will cause coil bind on compression. For the rear King has a 2.5" with hose reservoir and a 2.5" with hose reservoir and compression adjusters. They developed their shocks to work within the confines of other rear components (like brake lines for example). Since that is the case they are considered a standard travel which means that they will work fine with one of the add-a-leafs or even a small block. However they could be the limiting factory when it comes to a full leaf pack replacement. Some places markets an "extended" travel King shock (both front and rear) but they are generally the same shock with an internal spacer removed which provides around 1/4" more travel. Which is usually still very conservative for some of the rear lift leaf packs.


Progressive vs Digressive:


Progressive dampening progressively gets more firm as the shock shaft Velocity increases. Digressive shocks have more firm dampening at lower shaft velocity, and softer dampening at higher shaft speeds.


Progressive rate CO's ride much softer on the street, and off road at speeds below 20 mph (depending on terrain), while the Digressive CO's give a more firm ride on the street, and at speeds below 20 mpg off road(once again, depending on terrain). Off road at speeds over 25 mph, the digressive shocks are great. You can re valve the digressive shocks to be a little softer in the "low speed" dampening, which gives a better on road ride, and still maintains the high speed dampening characteristics.



Please let me know if there is anything else that I can assist you with.

Thank you so much.

Mariewww.headstrongoffroad.com
mailto:sales@headstrongoffroad.com

 

We'll see, they're a 1 off r and d set and my bumper isn't here get. Should get 3 and sag to 2.5 once the bumper, sliders, and rack are installed. I'm doing a major upgrade over Christmas break, it's going to look like a new truck. I've got 5k of parts to install over the break hopefully. Dissent bumper (hopefully) winch, sliders, dissent rack and custom rear rack ( prototype), icon delta joint ucas, and a pile of black oak lights.

 

Hmmm sweet

 

I appreciate the fact that you appreciate their product!

I simply give caution when an individual makes such bold claims with little supporting evidence. Saying that the other manufacturers are using, sub par quality products or are not "American made" may be a little elaborate without providing some kind of support. I won't disagree with the commercialized company, Im not sure how big King is but I know Fox has grown substantially with their entrance to the OE world.

I agree. Stiff shocks suck. Icon tends to be favored from people who don't see the dirt that often. I personally will deal with body roll for greater off road performance. Even Fox does a poor job at the "off the shelf valving." It's unfortunate because they make a solid product line, yet lack in one of the most important areas and get a bad rep for it in comparison to their leading competition.

All valving is technically "unique." The key is fitting the performance to the vehicle and application.

 

I added some info from Marie at Headstrong to my original post in case you are interested.

 

Light. I run medium and they are a tad stiff with no weight in bed

 

Hey everyone- here is what I’m going to pull the trigger on I think:

https://www.rogue-offroad.com/product-p/tacostage3.htm

They also have the dakar kit:
https://www.rogue-offroad.com/product-p/tacostage4-.htm

Is there a real benefit to going the Dakar or can I still get what I want with the AAL?

Also, I’ll be getting UCAs eventually and shaun at rogue said they don’t think the egcs bushing is necessary. Any thoughts?

 

It looks like a deal! Good Luck and hope to see you out on the trail.