1. Welcome to Tacoma World!

    You are currently viewing as a guest! To get full-access, you need to register for a FREE account.

    As a registered member, you’ll be able to:
    • Participate in all Tacoma discussion topics
    • Communicate privately with other Tacoma owners from around the world
    • Post your own photos in our Members Gallery
    • Access all special features of the site

HELP! Possible Short? Hella 500 install trouble

Discussion in 'Lighting' started by holeinone604, Jan 7, 2011.

  1. Jan 7, 2011 at 7:15 PM
    #1
    holeinone604

    holeinone604 [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Member:
    #36862
    Messages:
    50
    Gender:
    Male
    Great White North
    Vehicle:
    09 SR5 Black 4x4
    So I installed hella 500 black magics behind the grill and followed this guide to a tee: http://www.tacomaworld.com/forum/lighting/79832-hella-500-hid-conversion-mount-behind-satoshi-how-w-pics.html

    The only difference that I did with the wiring of them was I drew power for my switch from the fuse box in the cabin of the truck using an "add a fuse" pictured below:
    [​IMG]

    I put the add a fuse into the 10A - Tail slot.

    So this was my first time really wiring anything so I did a lot of research and followed all the instructions as closely as I could. Everything has been fine for the past couple weeks but there was the odd rare occasion that I thought I could smell a really faint burnt/dusty smell. Visually all the wires looked fine and everything was working fine so I chalked this up to my paranoia.

    The fog light housings I ordered arrived from ebay so I poped them in a couple nights ago. Truck is all prewired for the fogs so it was a really easy install with a stock OEM switch and OEM Denso relay for fuse box under the hood. Only add on to this was the DDM raptor 35W, 3000K kit (it was a really easy plug and play add on though).

    All is working fine both hellas and the fogs.

    Today I go to fire up the truck after its been parked in the cold for about 9 hours and it was really slow to turn over. I probably could have got it to turn over on the first attempt if I held on a little longer but didn't and it fired up on the second attempt after some noticeable delay.

    Whats the problem the new OEM fogs with the DDM kit or my wiring job on the hellas?

    I assumed my wiring job so I have disconnected the power to the switch and the power to the relay from the battery until I figure things out. I have started the truck a few times since coming home and it fires up as normal and all the lights worked fine up until I disconnected the power to the hellas. I didn't want to mess with a slow leak until I get some feedback on this. Does it sound like a short of some sort?

    Thanks in advance for feedback!

    If it helps here is a rough pic of how I wired everything up: (ground from switch is in cabin behind kick panel not though firewall as shown in picture)
    [​IMG]

    Used this switch:
    [​IMG]
     
  2. Jan 8, 2011 at 8:20 PM
    #2
    wing103

    wing103 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2008
    Member:
    #7807
    Messages:
    1,044
    Gender:
    Male
    Boston
    Vehicle:
    Tacoma TRD Sport / Dark Gray
    Grill Craft upper & Lower Grill WetOK Seat Cover, Devil Horn, Bug, Windows Deflector, Side step Bar, HID 55W 8000K Headlight, HID 35W 4000K Foglight, Fog Light Mod, Interior LED Map Light Mod, Electric Tail Gate Lock, Leer Cab, Key ring light, Bed LED lights Mod, Kenwood DNX5120, Signal Mirror with Heat
    So did you blow the fuse? My theory is I believe you did not need a relay for it.
    I install the same set up with a 55w 6000k on it, but I have not do the switch part yet, since it is too cold outside.
     
  3. Jan 8, 2011 at 8:27 PM
    #3
    achirdo

    achirdo First Class White Trash

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2010
    Member:
    #34819
    Messages:
    10,164
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Adam
    North DFW
    Vehicle:
    06 dodge ram 3500 5.9 cummins
    I'm confused about what the problem actually is. Do the lights still turn on or doesthe fuse blow?
     
  4. Jan 8, 2011 at 8:30 PM
    #4
    epa4wd

    epa4wd Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2009
    Member:
    #14828
    Messages:
    2,066
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Eduardo
    Vehicle:
    2015 TRD Sport 2WD
    Clazzio Seat Covers Extang Tri-Fold Soft Tonneau Cover TRD Skid Plate Side Steps 43% Front Tint Pop and Lock TRD Exhaust
    for the hellas its better if he uses the relay. The switch he used is rated at 21A @ 14V, but I would not risk it. Using a relay is safer.
     
  5. Jan 8, 2011 at 8:35 PM
    #5
    epa4wd

    epa4wd Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2009
    Member:
    #14828
    Messages:
    2,066
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Eduardo
    Vehicle:
    2015 TRD Sport 2WD
    Clazzio Seat Covers Extang Tri-Fold Soft Tonneau Cover TRD Skid Plate Side Steps 43% Front Tint Pop and Lock TRD Exhaust
    From what I've talked with him trough PMs, fuses did not blow. From what I understand he had problems starting the truck as he stated in his post, but I honestly don't know how the wiring could be related to causing that, unless something is drawing power when the truck is off thus draining the battery a bit, but from that wiring diagram, all power would be cutoff when the truck is off.

    That wiring diagram is correct asuming they are all connected to the appropiate pins on the relay and switch.
     
  6. Jan 9, 2011 at 12:11 PM
    #6
    holeinone604

    holeinone604 [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Member:
    #36862
    Messages:
    50
    Gender:
    Male
    Great White North
    Vehicle:
    09 SR5 Black 4x4
    No blown fuse, lights have worked fine at all times.

    Problem is the truck being very very slow to turn over the other day. My thoughts are something has drained the battery to cause this. I can't help but think it must have something to do with the lights I have installed. Since I have disconnected power to the relay and switch for the hellas I have not had any problem.
     
  7. Jan 9, 2011 at 12:13 PM
    #7
    holeinone604

    holeinone604 [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Member:
    #36862
    Messages:
    50
    Gender:
    Male
    Great White North
    Vehicle:
    09 SR5 Black 4x4
    Yeah I was really careful to connect all the pins to the correct locations on the relay and switch. Would it even work if they weren't connected to the right locations on the switch?
     
  8. Jan 9, 2011 at 12:17 PM
    #8
    holeinone604

    holeinone604 [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Member:
    #36862
    Messages:
    50
    Gender:
    Male
    Great White North
    Vehicle:
    09 SR5 Black 4x4
    Just curious since I installed the OEM fogs with the DDM kit (35W, 3000K) I have been running them a lot while driving (early morning and night).

    Would frequent/extended use of the OEM fogs with the DDM kit be causing an excessive drain on the battery?

    Is it possible a bad connection somewhere in my wiring of the hellas would cause an excessive drain on the battery while at the same time the lights work fine?
     
  9. Jan 9, 2011 at 1:16 PM
    #9
    84Hilux

    84Hilux Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2010
    Member:
    #39877
    Messages:
    543
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Gary
    Vancouver, Canada
    Vehicle:
    09 SR5 Access Cab V6 4X4
    Stock Fog Lights, Camera Mirror, Arrow Canopy, Lighted 4x4switch, Weathertech Mats (Black), Wet Okoles- Black/Charcoal, Alpine CDA117 Headunit/ Alpine PDX4150 Amp/Alpine PDX M6 Amp/ Hybrid Legatia SE Components/ JL 10W6V2 Subwoofer/ Prototype MR Marv Sub Enclosure
    Have you had any problems since the first time you had weak cranking? I think you just ran the battery low while you were installing the lights. I know when I did my install, I ran the lights for about 20 minutes without the engine running. Then I went for just a short hop with the lights on to see how visibility was increased. A short drive won't be enough to charge the battery back up.

    A relay is just a heavy duty switch with automatic control. If your lights turn off when the switches are off, you have no draw on your high current loops. If there is a problem, it would have to be on the switch loops. As I mentioned in my PM, possible current drain on the switch side could be the illumination bulbs or a reverse current diode. I think you have probably eliminated the bulbs by now- make sure they are off when they should be. Reverse current diodes are installed in some relays to dissipate a reverse current flow that is generated by the relay coil as it shuts off (when you turn the lights off). I doubt this is the problem, because your battery would be completely dead by now if you had a diode draining power for several days. Also, the switch itself should shut off all power to the relay coil circuit, so even if the diode was in backwards- it would have no effect on battery life.

    I am not even sure there is a problem. We have a saying when we are troubleshooting a problem circuit at my work- "Let it develop". If there is a problem, it will get worse and make it easier to pinpoint. If there is not a problem- right on!
     
  10. Jan 9, 2011 at 1:20 PM
    #10
    wing103

    wing103 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2008
    Member:
    #7807
    Messages:
    1,044
    Gender:
    Male
    Boston
    Vehicle:
    Tacoma TRD Sport / Dark Gray
    Grill Craft upper & Lower Grill WetOK Seat Cover, Devil Horn, Bug, Windows Deflector, Side step Bar, HID 55W 8000K Headlight, HID 35W 4000K Foglight, Fog Light Mod, Interior LED Map Light Mod, Electric Tail Gate Lock, Leer Cab, Key ring light, Bed LED lights Mod, Kenwood DNX5120, Signal Mirror with Heat
    Please check the battery when your truck is in off position, use a voltage tester to check how much voltage you have, you should read 14v to 15v under normal condition, than turn on the truck, and do the reading again, if it remaind the same, than it should be fine.
    But my guess is the add on fuse that you install, what is the orginal fuse for what function? that may casue the problem. Since the first time I have the fuse install on the fog light fuse location, as soon as I turn on the (HID 35w) fog light with the (HID 55w) Hella, it will blow the fuse out. And than I relocate the fuse to another location with 30A, and it work fine for me.
    I hope this can help you out.
     
  11. Jan 9, 2011 at 1:26 PM
    #11
    84Hilux

    84Hilux Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2010
    Member:
    #39877
    Messages:
    543
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Gary
    Vancouver, Canada
    Vehicle:
    09 SR5 Access Cab V6 4X4
    Stock Fog Lights, Camera Mirror, Arrow Canopy, Lighted 4x4switch, Weathertech Mats (Black), Wet Okoles- Black/Charcoal, Alpine CDA117 Headunit/ Alpine PDX4150 Amp/Alpine PDX M6 Amp/ Hybrid Legatia SE Components/ JL 10W6V2 Subwoofer/ Prototype MR Marv Sub Enclosure
    BTW- your drawing looks fine. Should work OK.
     
  12. Jan 9, 2011 at 11:10 PM
    #12
    JTanner

    JTanner Misplaced Texan

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2010
    Member:
    #41958
    Messages:
    105
    Gender:
    Male
    Temecula, CA
    Vehicle:
    09 DC TRD OR MGM
    stock..for now

    make sure you have the right positions on the switch... it matters.
     
  13. Jan 9, 2011 at 11:38 PM
    #13
    holeinone604

    holeinone604 [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Member:
    #36862
    Messages:
    50
    Gender:
    Male
    Great White North
    Vehicle:
    09 SR5 Black 4x4
    Thanks again!
    Power to the switch and relay is re-connected so we will see if this problem continues or was a one off freak occurrence.
    Yeah the illumination of the switch I am using is only on when the switch is turned on. If the switch is off, illumination is off.

    I followed this guide to the three pins on the back of the rocker switch:
    http://www.tacomaworld.com/forum/2nd-gen-tacomas/15476-oem-style-switch-3.html
    Terminal #2 - to power (+)
    Terminal #3 - to lights or relay (depending how your lights are wired up)
    Terminal #4 - ground (-)

    Can anyone with knowledge of this switch confirm this is correct?
    Would it even work if I had them on the wrong pins?
     
  14. Jan 10, 2011 at 3:15 AM
    #14
    84Hilux

    84Hilux Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2010
    Member:
    #39877
    Messages:
    543
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Gary
    Vancouver, Canada
    Vehicle:
    09 SR5 Access Cab V6 4X4
    Stock Fog Lights, Camera Mirror, Arrow Canopy, Lighted 4x4switch, Weathertech Mats (Black), Wet Okoles- Black/Charcoal, Alpine CDA117 Headunit/ Alpine PDX4150 Amp/Alpine PDX M6 Amp/ Hybrid Legatia SE Components/ JL 10W6V2 Subwoofer/ Prototype MR Marv Sub Enclosure
    You can tell by looking at the way the switch moves that pushing in the top causes the contact plate to slide across the bottom 2 terminals. Those are the main contacts of the switch- the top terminal is just ground for the light bulb. I don't think it really matters which wire is going to the bottom 2 terminals(except not ground)- you could swap them with no ill effects. One way might cause the light to be on all the time though. As long as ground is the top terminal, you should be OK.
     
  15. Jan 10, 2011 at 12:22 PM
    #15
    holeinone604

    holeinone604 [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Member:
    #36862
    Messages:
    50
    Gender:
    Male
    Great White North
    Vehicle:
    09 SR5 Black 4x4
    Yep pretty sure top was ground. Will check tonight.
    So far so good and the problem hasn't resurfaced so I will keep my fingers crossed. Don't think it was due to install of the lights that framed battery as I had them in and running for a couple weeks with no issues. Just a couple days after adding the oem fogs with ddm kit.

    I will dig out the voltmeter and check the battery tonight.
     
  16. Jan 10, 2011 at 12:52 PM
    #16
    epa4wd

    epa4wd Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2009
    Member:
    #14828
    Messages:
    2,066
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Eduardo
    Vehicle:
    2015 TRD Sport 2WD
    Clazzio Seat Covers Extang Tri-Fold Soft Tonneau Cover TRD Skid Plate Side Steps 43% Front Tint Pop and Lock TRD Exhaust
    It should have around 12.6V with the truck off
    It should have about 13.4-14.X V with the truck on
     
  17. Jan 10, 2011 at 7:11 PM
    #17
    holeinone604

    holeinone604 [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Member:
    #36862
    Messages:
    50
    Gender:
    Male
    Great White North
    Vehicle:
    09 SR5 Black 4x4
    Double and triple checked everything again and hooked all the power lines to the hellas back up.

    So far so good (knock on wood) and the problem has not resurfaced over the last day and a bit...

    [​IMG]
     
To Top