HOLD EVERYTHING ! 8 CYL COMING TO TACOMA ??

Yes, it goes full otto, but any improvements allow the extremely variable valve timing to have more of an effect. After reading the spec on how much variable timing this engine has I can see how it improves power. That variable timing created for the atkinson cycle actually helps in performance addons.

I am with you, I would much rather have a larger displacement, less efficient engine that produces more low end power, but that stuff is gone, so hybrids are the solution.

 

not just an engine upgrade
the frame +
complete driveline would have to be upgraded

they could give a bigger better V6
that would still require beefier parts

dually Tundra was rumored years ago......

diesel Rav4 ( some n europe )

diesel Taco.........id buy 1 !!

has been a diesel jeep in limited quanties years ago
Gladiator is supposed to get a 3 liter Diesel nxt year ........BIG torque

new models & BIG changes usually take years

 

Just do an LS swap and get it over with already.

 

More face palm.

 

Either you're pulling everyone's leg with this (tale) or that man was on crack or was about to lose a bet. Toyota is very eager to abandon V8 in mainstream products, but will retain in pet projects for CEO Akio Toyoda, if it's off the shelf.

LOL, that pretty much has Akio Toyoda all over it. Problem I have with that guy, is he couldn't care less about trucks and SUVs. Only if they are bread and butter, as well as very low investment. These trucks are not very low investment, hence he has no problem kicking the can further down the road. Y'all (buyers) saved the 4Runner from extinction, by paying it forward since 2013 and justifying its continued existence. It took until 2015 to decide to continue producing the Sequoia, GX, and 4Runner. Because of TNGA, they had to wait even longer and the hiccups with that, it's becoming a nearly 1 decade affair since that decision was made in 2015.

So well written and accurate, because that is exactly what it is. No offense to Sweers, but I really didn't appreciate him doing marketing speak and pretending as if the vehicle was entirely new from the ground up for 2016. A few product planners at Toyota, told the truth in private to me and mentioned so many concessions made during 3rd generation development from 2011 to 2014.

Was supposed to have power seats at launch and fix the seating position, to better accommodate taller drivers. As well as adopt a 4Runner and Tundra-like power rear window. It was ultimately vetoed of course. By the time the return of the GM twins proved successful in 2015, development was already done and the necessary fixes had to wait or were too much work to execute without a full redesign.

Likely, pay attention to the likely turbocharged 2022 Lexus NX350 = 2.4/2.5T. I also wouldn't count out the GR yet, as Land Cruiser will keep using 1GR-FE. LS 350 uses 8GR-FKS, seen as a renaming if 2GR-FKS.

Exactly, good point. Very pointless to do right now and as 99% know, it isn't happening, except for maybe a one-off concept at best. At best, TTV6 could be offered as a nice gesture for top trims or Turbo I4 w/hybrid.

Haha, just rich.

Toyota exec (translated): We are so disappointed in Tundra compared to Tacoma, we decide to honor Tacoma with great V8, handbuilt in Tahara-only, for affordable price of $69,999 in American money. Tundra no good, only get V6.

Although I can't answer this one reliably, it is much closer to what's happening on the Tacoma front. As for Tundra? 100% accurate. However, don't count out the GR V6 block yet in the midsizers (Taco & 4R).

Me too, but we can't always have what we want can we? There's a good change of the former, provided it's for a halo offering. We'll see.

Exactly LOL. This is one area I struggle to know more, because aside from an eager to share clay modeller in design, only a few friends within Toyota, who they won't even answer many of my questions as someone who even works in this industry. Toyota was NOT happy about some leaks early last year and made no comment. I learn what I do, because of what is left around in limited access areas or servers, accessible to industry members only.

A lot of what I even see at times, will disappear quickly or become password-protected. (and no I don't hack) To be honest, the Tacoma is more hush-hush, due to its market position and the threat of giving away advance info, being riskier than the Tundra, that is closer to the bottom in sales.

Exactly, this is quite true. However, dealer conferences are a very big deal. I learned about the engine lineup for the 2022 Tundra in 2019, because of the Fall 2019 dealer conference, which discussed the future of the Land Cruiser beyond 200-Series and Tundra. Tacoma wasn't mentioned there, in being 4 years away and not an icon like the TLC.

A diesel for the next Tundra was mentioned by 2 Toyota people in 2018 and January 2019. I trusted them, but a lot of what they suggested seems to be wrong. One of them was in between Japan and USA, the other was in marketing at Toyota. You can see that in one of my first posts, in being confident about diesel. I only tend to parrot what Toyota personnel state, but got misled. So I am very careful now and won't even share the inconsistent mentions by Toyota friends, that manual will continue in generation 4, because I don't trust it as much hearing about launch dates from them or development milestones.

Haha, thanks. The minute I heard about TTV6 related to V35A-FTS about 2 to 2.5 years ago, I knew instantly it was our 3.5EB.

Yes, it did happen. I rolled my eyes at so many people automatically expecting info to leak out from it, as that is NEVER guaranteed. It's a heavily embargoed, private function. Not a free-for-all, to disclose info. I don't think they're going to be discussing Toyota yet, as the final design has barely been set. Generally at these functions, they prefer to have a physical representation present or something of the sort, which is the final design on display. In 2008, they weren't able to fly in the production LFA for a dealer conference, because the final design had just been frozen and they didn't want to bring the earlier version by plane.

Don't count that out actually, because it won't be the 70-Series, but maybe something newer. Take that with a grain of salt.

Pay attention to the 2022 Lexus NX350 and see what that is. NX300 is a turbocharged I4, but some say NX350 is a 2.4T or 2.5T (could easily be 2GR-FKS too). GR V6 may not be gone yet, as Land Cruiser retains 1GR-FE in some markets for 2022. That's a 19 year old engine. 2024MY will be interesting for Tacoma.

That will be $69,999 + $2k destination and TT&L please. Oh and don't forget our $30k ADM.

Well, thank you.

LMAOThis is just gold.

Two Toyota personnel hinted at diesel Tundra in 2018 and I brought this up over 2 years ago, but that seems to be going nowhere. I think they mistook the new TTV6+hybrid and then passed it along. They weren't liars, but it shows how easily things can get lost in translation across departments.

Yes, very true. Just helps to look around the cracks for hidden info and beat press relations to it.

Tundra is no longer going to be offered with V8, so that won't even happen.

2UR has been used in all car applications since 2007 and will die in the LC 500, although the IS 500 is getting it.

As for the Tundra, you would be wrong. V8 is being replaced by that high output mating of TTV6 to hybrid. Although I believe the nomenclature is V35A-FXS, I don't want to run with that yet, as I haven't fully confirmed it.

V8 is gone and I first heard about it from a Toyota conference in fall 2019. Within 1 year, it became definitive. I did my best, to make that public last year by reaching out to the media last February, as did a few people at Toyota. Last V8 Toyota (brand) sold in USA, will be the 2022 Sequoia, which enters production soon. Lexus will hold onto V8s in both NA and FI form for a few years.

Toyota: We are soooo disappointed in that thing we call a "Tundra", that we decided to honor our "Tacoma" with our new 2025 Tacoma TRD Pro with a fitting all-new Dynamic Force twin-turbo V8 to maintain sales leadership. New V40A-FTS will be available on Limited and TRD Pro and is borrowed from our 2025 FJ-180 Land Cruiser.(Disclaimer: Will NEVER be offered in 4Runner nor Tundra)

And that has less of a chance happening, than it raining asteroids.

One hopes, but like with today not even offering a V8, will things be kept within tiers? TT6 for large, while TT4 for midsize? Let's hope not.

Well, that is exactly how a lot of people both Plano and Torrance play with words. It's a favorite past time of theirs, judging by the "world-beater" comments.

Both are being done for the first time.

Yep

A few idiots are running with that, simply because the Tacoma uses a "car" engine in the 2GR-FKS. Well, yes & no. The 2UR is on its way out, where only IS 500, RC-F, and LC 500 get this engine. 2UR has no business being in a truck at all, when 3UR exists and so does 1UR. Way too popular amongst YouTube clout hoes to yammer about and misguide people with false hopes. Easy to put 2UR in IS 500, because it's off the shelf and can borrow a lot from existing models, plus serve for Akio's personal interests. He loves sportscars, hates trucks.

But damn, these salesmen...

Excuse me, but that is absolutely inaccurate. This can change in the future (not that I'll disclose to you what's being planned), but as it stands right now, NO. U725 program has no V8 offering for the current time, that I have no idea where you got that from. It's absolute fallacy, if someone told you that. Everything T6 I am very, very keyed in on and that's just not in the near future. Jeep did that to fend the threat off, as it was no longer going to be paradise island for them when we joined the segment.

Likely, but I think we should wait. 2022 Lexus NX350 should give some clues. If a V6, ignore it. If the newest Dynamic Force Turbo I4, that's coming to the next Tacoma.

GR family replaced the FZ and JZ engines. We'll see what's happening, because it's too soon to tell about I6 until 2023 or 2024.

Just too golden.

Yep, the Tundra sells so poorly, we've decided to reward the Tacoma nameplate with a better engine range than our "Tundra".

The engine being used is not from the Tacoma, it's definitely the LS 500. I wanted to believe, that like 1UZ (4.0) versus 2UZ (4.7), it would be bored differently, but Land Cruiser will use V35A-FTS, already in Lexus LS 500. Still waiting on that one, to be sure.

As for the Tacoma, I can see a desire for differentiation between the large class vs midsize offerings, by not offering TTV6. Might just retain a NA V6 and add Turbo I4, as well as NA I4. Big mistake, as P703 Ranger gets Ecoboost V6.

Hey, good point in the first sentence, however the second sentence is a little bit off. 2023 Ranger P703 will be offering Ecoboost V6s, in addition to I4. Just like Bronco U725. T6 previously could not fit V-configuration engines for Gen 1 T6 (P375, U375), so it was fixed for the second generation of T6 with Bronco and next for Ranger (P703) and new Everest (U704). That information is very close to home for me, but I generally don't like to make that obvious here.

The V35A-FTS seems to be fine as it's not the same family as GR V6 and will probably do just fine in Tundra (still not even sure).

It's very likely, but at 30 months away, I have yet to know the story behind the scenes. The diesel rumor was a credible about 2 years ago, but it seems like it was only briefly on the table and then dropped quietly. I heard this from two individuals from Toyota corporate in 2018, but it seems to have been abandoned. We'll see what happens.

Tundra being delayed has nothing to do with this, but more so the hybrid aspect, just like how 2021 Sienna went from March 2020 to late 2020 start, after 4 delays. In October 2016, next Sienna and Tundra were earmarked for March 2, 2020 and August 3, 2020 Job 1. They fell behind, while Sienna was tumbling from quarter to quarter in delays, Tundra just was 14 months to October 4, 2021. Right now, it's about Q1 2022 launch.

Correct as always Jeff. If any V8 is coming to a Tacoma ever, it will NEVER be 2UR. On YouTube, a few clowns with a camera and WiFi connection, cannot seem to understand that.

There is a distinct possibility, that the Mazda I6 will be in a Toyota Motor Company product by 2024. Probably not suitable for a BOF application though.

That XK30 Tundra always felt like a reskin of the T100 with dual airbags, as the original name was T-150 and not Tundra. Trademark lawsuit threat in 1998, led to rename to Tundra by 1999 launch. The current Tundra, was first truly ground-up redesign and so will be the next one.

Excellent points made, as this is happening going forward. Raptor R and TRX are the exception.

Exactly LOL, as any dumbass claiming anything new is coming for this generation, has nothing going on upstairs. After 2022MY's minor updates, nothing is happening for this iteration again. It will be redesigned in 30 months and start appearing in spy shots next year.

Easier to pass certain standards, especially during testing and also get away with displacement penalties/taxation.

Well, you do get the Y62 under the Armada nameplate. It's just watered-down, to lower the price of entry. As a former shareholder, I told them making a Pro-4X or Nismo special with all the lockers and goodies of the Patrol would make sense for a higher price, but they deemed it redundant.

 

Holy multi-quote!

 

Yeah, I am quoting you because I was scared of quoting him.

 

Wait, so you wanna replace a car engine with another car engine?

 

Yes and he is wanting to do it with the ancient less efficient pushrod technology.

 

Haha!

 

@Carmaker1

I'd love to see a diesel. However, the main issue why I don't think we will actually see one is the R&D in making a reliable diesel that also complies with EPA standards in the US. GM brought the 2.8L Duramax over from Thailand and that took some time. The DEF system is the least reliable part of the truck. The largest complaints I see about those trucks has to do with the DEF system. They all seem to agree that the engine itself is solid.

I just don't see Toyota finding it very cost effective to try and create that reliability AND to do the R&D needed to bring a diesel to the US market. I think their money will probably go to existing hybrid technology. But that's my 100% speculation.

Also, that is good news regarding the V6 EB for the Ranger/Bronco platform. I've always felt Ford kind of half-assed bringing the Ranger back to the US market. It particularly annoyed me when they insisted it was "all new" when it seemed to largely be the same truck as the international folks have had with a different power plant. Then there was only one engine choice on top of that. However, I also knew this was likely just a place holder to guage interest in the US market while something else was developed. Speculation was that Ford was very afraid to hurt F-series sales. Here's my question: if you're so worried, why not bring back the F100 name badge?

With my references to the Tundra: in my research of the truck market, I've often been lead to the F150 as the best choice in full size pickups for me. So it makes me feel good to see Toyota, who is well known for reliability, taking a page out of Ford's book and developing their own version. It tells me Ford must be on to something.

Also, when referencing the delay. My theory on it all came back to Toyota reliability. I took the delay as a sign something wasn't quite right and they wanted to get it right before they put it on the market.

 

This is very likely, from what I have been hearing. The only thing is a larger turbo I4 launching in the 2022 Lexus NX350. Could be 2GR-FKS too, but we'll see.

At best for a TRD Pro special, but I feel it would be too expensive for the Tacoma in most cases? The little knowledge I have so far, strictly pertains to timeline and not much else.

One would hope, but only Hino would have involvement and I think the diesel proposal for Tundra, has now been abandoned. My information came from a very credible Toyota insider, but it looks like that never panned out. I limit the amount of questions I ask them, because of the nature of my own work and my employment.

You would be very, very wrong with that first sentence. Toyota were supposed to revolutionize the TTV6 with added hybrid, but allowed us to beat them to it with Powerboost for MY 2021. Tundra was originally a MY 2021, for October 2020 launch. Now it's probably Q1 2022.

Toyota: "That would $69,999 please."
Toyota salesman: Oh and you better not forget that ADM.

I almost had to pay a $7k ADM on my 2020 Pro in AG because it was 6MT, let alone a V8? Ha, that would be a disaster.

Absolutely true, but even in 2018 it was on the table for Tundra. What happened with that, I don't know.

Hmm, are you sure about that? Turbo I4 w/hybrid might be better...

Yes, pretty much the truth. However, a diesel like in most product planning cases, was said to have been studied for Tundra. I also heard for Tacoma, over 2 years ago and mentioned it here. That went silent. Working in the capacity I do, I never listen to journalists or the average person. It has to come from company personnel, not dealers or service centers. This had come from an engineer based out of both USA and Toyota City. Some of you might know them from elsewhere.

What mule? Probably not related, but the earliest of next gen Tacoma mules are barely being designed for testing rounds and will probably wear current sheetmetal, until bodies for the new truck finish hand assembly later this year or early 2022.

You must be referring to something else?

Once again, good point. As I had mentioned somewhere, the ICE Tacoma dies on TNGA-F in the 2030s and the closer we get to launch, somewhere will list the End of Production date for the next Tacoma. Current truck's EOP was leaked 5-6 years ago, when production began. Back then it was 6/30/2022, but that was pushed back some 14-15 months and change a little again.

For instance, back in 2016 I found out the Job 1 date for the 2020 Highlander to be 11/25/2019. Toyota did very well keeping to that Job 1 date, only having a minor variance of entering production earlier in November 2019 and went on sale in December 2019.

Haha, well I wouldn't agree with underpowered. But overcomplicated? Most likely, but Toyota is very good at develop subsystems and powertrains independent of a vehicle program to ensure reliability. An engine that might take 7 years to develop, might be used in a vehicle that took 4-5 years to create and launch.

And it's not even the chief engineer, but CEO and heir of Toyota, Mr. Akio Toyoda. He couldn't even get his board and shareholders to approve a business case, that created a direct successor to the JZ and maybe FZ Inline-6s. Which is why, BMW factored in.

Do you work in the industry? Very keen observation, because that is what the difference is. Mass production of such a vehicle, requires so much more and thus billions versus a $1 million concept, which takes a few months to a year to make versus 5-6 years and hundred millions to billions. Just one new engine costs $100M or more. The 1UZ V8 was nearly $1 billion in today's money, not including 4.7L 2UZ and 4.3L 3UZ.

It shouldn't be, but I wouldn't be shocked if Toyota designed TNGA-F to be able to accommodate 3UR still. 1GR-FE will be available in entry level 300-Series.

I get very tired of that bunch, as they're wishing on a dead ended hope. If you think 4Runner folks are as bad as those on Broncos about V8, well you'd be shocked. 2UZ 4Runner was a single generation offering, while Bronco offered a V8 for 30 years out of 31 years.

I am a huge V8 enthusiast, owning 2 6.2L SVT Raptors and one of them is high mileage. Plus a restored ML Bronco 5.0, GT350, and 3 V8 BMWs (E90 M3, E92 M3, E39 M5). I've been forced to accept, V8 is becoming limited to the upper end of nearly every segment as an engineer.

I knew back in 2016, even before I moved to MI, that Bronco would not offer a V8. I warned them back in February 2019, that it would not offer a V8 at all and to get it out of their system. Some clearly haven't listened to this day unfortunately and keep whining.

Perfect post. I am weirded out that they will use V35A-FTS and what might be called for the hybrid application, V35A-FXS. Would've made more sense to bore it out maybe 3.7/3.8 or 4.0L, but they know what works for them.

I strongly disagree and wonder who those Ford Certified Master Technicians are making such claims. Perhaps they need to no longer be working in such capacities, if one gets in touch with their dealer principals. Nano Ecoboost 2.7L is one of the best and most stout applications. Reason why it was chosen for Bronco.

The 2UR will continue in the Sequoia for the 2022 model year, which goes on sale in late August (ideally). Job 1 is apparently July 5, 2021, the last MY to be built in Princeton, Indiana. Production will move to TMMTX outside of San Antonio ny mid-2022.

I have been very closely studying that one. GX is very, very successful and was as good as dead by 2016 back in 2013 product planning. They have rethought that stance, but Prado as you know is Q4 2022 like 4Runner. Sequoia comes first.

Bear in mind, that the 2007 Tundra (late January 2007) launched 10-11 months apart from the 2008 Sequoia (December 2007), which could hopefully be narrowed down to 6-9 months apart in December 2021/Q1 2022 against summer/early fall 2022 for 2022 Tundra and 2023 Sequoia, allowing room for new 4Runner and Prado by January 2023 (cuz of chip shortage and COVID).

Yup! Even though that's not good for my employer, it's nice to see Toyota make an impact for once.

1GR-FE oddly enough, continues in the 300-Series. I didn't expect that, it's still there along with the new 3.3 diesel and V35A-FTS TTV6. But yes, the V8 is gone in the Toyota SUVs for USA.

Yes, the 200-Series is going away and the 300-Series won't be offered, but at Fall 2019 conference, they have a broader plan for USA and had no date set yet. This has nothing to do with the new 300-Series. I originated the 5-seater rumor, based on a private discussion from a very informed source, who is also an admin for a Lexus Forum and works in the industry too.

Sorry, but even if this is a good post, I must point out the MY is now 2024 and no longer 2023 like was intended when the current truck went into production in 2015. TNGA delayed it and because the 4Runner, Prado, and Sequoia need room to debut, Tacoma and Hilux are automatically the year after. Tundra and Land Cruiser are 2021, SUVs in 2022, and Tacoma late 2023.

Toyota themselves mentioned at March 2019 debut of the 2020 Tacoma in Denver (auto show), that the next truck "should" be redesigned for 2022 or 2023 MY. They slipped by 1 year, to MY 2024.

Can't remember why I quoted this, but if it has to do with the Land Cruiser or 5.7L, they are definitely gone. The Land Cruiser might return, but this is based on a Toyota conference from September 2019, which discussed the future of Toyota through 2024. 3UR is dead.

For now yes, but the LX is being redesigned by Q1 2022. LX 500h and LX 600, as well as LX500d for the 3.3V6 turbodiesel. Should be 300-Series.

Dead accurate, but we'll see about a TTV6 for Tacoma, which isn't very likely.

Very well written, because this spells out a lot of realities behind product planning and marketing across different vehicle classes. 2GR might go away, but GR block could stay and maybe adopt 8GR or 9GR (for new application).

Exactly, let's see what the 2022 Lexus NX 350 brings. Might be a 2500cc turbo I4.

It will be here by November 2021 and the 2UR application for a Lexus sports sedan on an old platform, has no bearing on BOF TNGA programs for Toyota brand.

I believe that V35A-FTS doesn't fit in the dated "New N" platform/architecture of the Lexus XE30 IS and XC10 RC coupe. So, no FI V6 for them ever. Next generation IS sounded like 2023 for UK back in 2019, but since they don't use model years, that could easily mean MY 2024. This current update for MY 2021, sounds like a 3 year run, but really should be longer for ROI.

Jeff, thanks for listing all of that for us here.

There were no plans for a redesigned 4Runner in 2014-15, meaning a domino effect resulted in years of no substantial changes. They didn't pay any attention to it until 2015 and even then, just made it a case study, because their hands were so full with other TNGA redesigns and didn't even expect to keep it beyond 2016. 2020MY is probably the only improvement the 4Runner has seen since MY 2014. It's heavy redo of the 120-Series architecture that debuted in October 2002 on the N210 4Runner. Anything like this, they are waiting until N350 4Runner end of next year.

According to a former Toyota product planner who was a TW member, he stated that the 5G 4Runner was as good as dead back when it was facelifted in 2013 and Toyota planners took a cynical approach with updating it as a swansong, but their subordinate teams gave it their best shot with the limited resources during 2010 and 2013. It paid off so handsomely, because profits shot up through the roof after reviewing sale numbers after September 2013 and through December 2014.

They were so dumbfounded back in Japan, they had to scramble and greenlight a next generation 4Runner instead of canceling it in 2016-17. For 2018 they updated the Prado significantly, while the 4Runner waited until MY 2020.

The real prize for them seems to be the Land Cruiser Prado, since it is sold in nearly every country on earth and is a prestige vehicle in many of those markets, often driven by upper middle and upper class (plus dignitaries & politicians). I own one myself (which is a manual too) and so do many family members of mine. 4Runner doesn't work for me over here, so I ordered a Bronco (and so did my fiance).

At this point, they're holding it all for the next one, due in 18-21 months. By 2015-16, primary focus was Land Cruiser 300-Series and Tundra. No matter what, those had to come first in terms of everything BOF and that set any Prado and 4Runner redesign far into the future.

I will let you know when I see launch info (by month) on that 6G 4Runner, as it's bound to surface soon.

 

I think I would prefer the straight 6 Supra engine in the next gen Tacoma.

 

I understand your perspective on the diesel conversation and it makes great sense, which is why I am certain it fell through. The new twin-turbo 3.3L F33A-FTV is about the only Dynamic Force diesel Toyota is coming out with. Would that be too much engine for the Tacoma and too expensive? Quite likely and not even for North America anyway, due to the realities of DEF. I believe in the hybrid approach, as seen by Tundra and Land Cruiser, as well as 660B Sequoia development program.

As for Ford, I'll try to say as little as possible, for professional reasons. Under Mark Fields (ex-CEO), the return of the Ranger and Bronco was brought up in 2014, after he took over from Alan Mulally (Ford CEO from 2006 to 2014). Like a kid in a candy store, Mark Fields wanted to do everything at once. Make Lincoln Great Again (forgive me for using this LOL), make a RWD comeback in the car and crossover segments, world-class Mustang for 2021, but at the expense of FWD offerings and compacts. If he could make the whole company RWD or 4WD (with few FWD cars), that was his goal. A lot of stuff went wrong or took forever, so he was forced out on May 19, 2017. I never worked under him, but he had good intentions.

For the Ranger and Bronco, took awhile to figure it all out. Much of 2015 and 2016 was spent securing things for T6 (internal platform code) in the USA, in terms of domestic production and suppliers. The P375 global Ranger was due for its 2nd refresh in 2017/2018, so North America was added to that for a federalized version P375N, for Job 1 in November 2018 and launch in January 2019. The next generation vehicle P703, which could fit a V-configuration engine, was yet to enter formal planning. That is the rival to the 2024 Tacoma and Hilux. It's a big effort and I do my best to stay neutral, but the stakes are very high on this one and quite impressed with it too.

I couldn't care less about what GM is doing nor Nissan's Frontier (took curiosity as former shareholder, but...zzz). U725 Bronco debuted the 2nd generation of T6, which is P703 as well. T6 replacement is 2028/2029. I think I've said enough on that front, so let's turn it back to Yota.

Like the new Sienna, that was earmarked either for March 2020 launch or May 2020 launch originally, Tundra is running BEHIND. The Sienna ended up going into production last September and barely went on sale in November 2020.

Back in 2016, I swear I saw a March 2, 2020 Job 1 date. In fact, I will review my library of info...

This was listed for Tundra, which of course changed:


Why? I image the advanced THS aspect, so the Sienna kept slipping from quarter to quarter, while Tundra more than 1 year.

 

Late to the soap opera, still Absolutely preposterous.

 

This thread reminds me of all the bukkake people were spewing just before the 3rd Gen was unveiled.

 

It would look more at home on a Dodge or Chevy...

 

I'm a big fan of the truck market in general so I'm not afraid to look into other models. Definitely jealous of the more in depth information you get, though. Mine just amounts to research on already public information and rumors. I greatly considered the diesel Colorado/Canyon. However, my last truck was a 2008 Canyon and I had my final straws with GM that pushed me to Ford and Toyota (I still trust GM more than FCA). However, I just plain didn't like the new Ranger. I do like the new Frontier. There are a couple of changes I'd make, but overall I think they nailed it.

I do love the new Bronco as well and it really felt like Ford took its time and did things right with it, contrary to how they did the Ranger (or, rather, how it felt). As for being the rival of the Hilux/Tacoma, I say "good luck." Toyota will likely be outdated coming out of the gate because they make their name on reliability. That means tried and true tech and not fancy bells and whistles. (I.e. finally power seats and android auto in 2020). Ford, on the other hand, isn't afraid to try new things. Ultimately they each corner a little different part of the market. However, after Ford comes out with their new model, I think we'll see them truly give Toyota sales a run for their money.

Edit: funny story: I met a guy on the same camping trip that I took my profile photo. He works for Ford on the Bronco/Ranger stuff. He, however, drives a Tacoma TRD OR.

 

Ford can be the only real competition in this market segment. The F150 is the best looking full size truck on the market and I have not met anyone who doesn't love the looks of the raptor. Imagine a mid size raptor that looks more like the full size truck.
The Taco is still the nicest and best looking mid size truck. Maybe this will change for 2022.

 

Agreed. I was all set to get an F150, but I became drawn to the Tacoma and realized I didn't really need a full size pickup at this point in my life. I love the 1st and 3rd gen Tacomas. Not the biggest fan of the second gen, but what can I say? I like the bolder lines and the fender flares on the 3rd gens and the 1st gens just look classic.