Is the Tacoma union made?

Let me add one little tidbit to this. IF your new truck was built at the Mexico plant, then the tailgate came from Toyota's Long Beach plant. They are unionized there. Longshoremen's union I believe, not UAW. That was Toyota's first plant in the U.S. they bought out another company that had it and it was unionized already.

Don't ask me why they make the tailgates there instead of at the Mexico plant, I don't understand it either.

 

UAW is the reason for the domestics failure.

 

Funny, I thought this was the 3rd Generation Tacoma forum.

Labor discussions for Toyotas are not unique to 3rd generation trucks, and are as applicable to 2nd generation Tacomas as well.

So how about taking it there? Or maybe, dunno, off topic or something.

 

The OP topic was regarding 3rd gen non-unionized production plants. This isn't the first time a thread went down the rabbit hole, and it won't be the last. Welcome to TacomaWorld!

 

Very Well put! Ive been union/non-union, business owner and now after 40 years in the transportation work force I am in a white collar position. I made my bones from the ditches all the way up. The union here and most places as folks have said is they protect the poor performers more than anything, Ive seen the biggest pro union people where I work and elsewhere have always been the lazy and poor performers. Im not saying that's everywhere but Ive seen it first hand at the same company for over 30 years.
Does anyone remember what Reagan did to the air traffic controllers back in the 70's? That's about the time the wind was starting to be let out of the unions sails. Id suggest watch the movie Gung Ho with Michael Keaton, that clearly shows the American labor mentality in the auto industry compared to the passion in the Japanese style of management and how they treat their workers. Middle class work is more brawn over brain, which the body cant keep up when a worker is turning 60. How often do you see these old salty workers in a shop too old to produce and do the brawny work anymore and you see them basically doing nothing until retirement? FWIW In myHO its sorry to say the American product has gone to shit in the 70s and early 80's, its getting better again but its going to be hella hard to take work back into this country, after its been produced for so cheap and for so long overseas, and overseas doesn't have all the safety factors and laws as the US (many way over complicated). My $.02

 

But easily could come back as coporations gain more power, buy off politicians and create new laws, or delete and amend old ones that protected workers. Trust me you dont want a race to the bottom by comparing to costs to produce over in China. They treat their employees like crap over there and dont even talk to me about the laughable environmental and OH&S laws. You want to work and live in those conditions? You want your kids to?

There needs to be a balance of power. Thats the only way things work effectively - give one side too much power and the corruption sets in and they run roughshod over everyone else.

This is coming from a person who was a union member for 20 years and now in management (non union) for the past 5.

 

Or blame the newb for being pissed he's NOT a mod (his text quoted).

Reminds me of the grade school narc.

 

Eh, I like SNR and non-truck stuff really doesn't help much.

 

USW Local 675 I've been in both Union and Non Union jobs. They have their draws and drawbacks and neither is perfect.

I got caught in the first strike in my industry in 35 years shortly after I hired in. For probably a month or so it was foreman and other supervisors showing the replacement workers our job. These are people who haven't been taught or qualified on any of the equipment for years showing people who are completely new this stuff. They claimed they were "qualified" like we were and skirted regulations. I wouldn't be caught dead anywhere near that refinery with how few people knew what they were doing inside. They ended up having a 5 day refinery wide shut down as well and took them a few tries to get it back up and running.

In the end we got most of what we wanted, but the damage caused by the strike will last a very, very long time. It got very personal and there's still a ton of resentment. Management is mad at us for walking out, but if we wanted to keep being supported by national, we had to go.

 

Actually sedentary people with desk jobs have a much higher risk of heart attacks and health issues. UPS drivers get exercise each and everyday, IMO they are healthier than desk jockeys

 

Can you imagine what homes would cost if they were built with union labor?

 

Have a few buds who are delivery guys at UPS (as opposed to OTR drivers) and I can tell you they earn every penny working for big brown....and stay in shape.

 

If that were the case we would see rapid inflation so it would probably balance out. The dollar would be worth shit though.

 

Lets not forget all the desk people that died on 911. But with out executives the middle class wouldnt have many stable jobs. Think of it as a naval ship you have workers (middle class) and the officers. The hieracy is basically the same. Those that lead and make decisions and those that carry out the job.

 

no. just hire more illegal's who work for 1970 wages and get r done!

 

I'm going to jump in to make a few points from a different perspective, and then probably forget to revisit the thread. I work for the government, and in doing my job I contract out construction projects which includes a very mixed bag of contractors and consultants both union and non-union. In addition I have educational background in union/labor relations including both the business and legal sides, as well as the political interactions they have. I do not claim to be an expert, but just a few themes I've picked up on.

-Unions like everything, are a mixed bag that gets generalized far to broadly. There are good effective unions that are fair, there are weak unions that have little effect, and there are unions that are overbearing and controlling. Regardless of which category they fall into, it is important to note that unions make up ~6% of the private workforce.

-This 6% number is interesting, because the portrait media sources paint imply they make up a much larger portion of the workforce. Naturally some sources (Fox news for example) will explain them more on the overbearing evil nature, while another source (CNN for example) will talk about what they have done that is positive. However you slice it, you are likely to get largely anecdotal evidence that isn't conclusive, but rather makes people talk & watch the source providing the information. These media sources want to make money, and will reinforce what their listeners want to hear (echo chamber), and often times what they say is directly related to what their sponsors want them to cover in order to build public perception the way they want it (ie. business thinks unions cost money, so unions are bad). Those same sponsors that have both political & economic interest - which of course overlap nearly always. Public sector is around 30% and non-profits are in the 20's somewhere, I haven't checked in a while (they do have other restrictions that private unions do not have - ie. pay is determined by a elected legislative body rather than hired management). Remember, that in the few jobs any of you may have had, you are seeing a highly-localized situation - I'd question is it fair to broadly apply that to a larger group. Is it fair to say all millennials are unmotivated because you saw one sitting on a street corner, or all Jeep owners are awful people because you saw one with a pho-hawk and skinny jeans (Jeep owners are questionable).

-Left unchecked comment - everything will stray over time. Unions are not unique in this regard. Sometimes we have an issue, for instance there was a time when rivers were starting on fire because industry was dumping into them. The EPA was one of the long term results of addressing this problem and they did very successfully I might add. Sure, this was at the determent to business who had to dispose of waste differently, but the benefits were the river wasn't on fire (I'm sure someone would argue burning rivers creates more jobs!). They are still around as new problems were identified, and naturally the argument of if it is a problem that needs addressed is political, and I want to avoid that as my discussion. Unions did something similar, they created the 40 hour work week many of us enjoy, they generated much safer working conditions in a time when 10 year old's would be working a 24-hour shift and lose body parts was considered acceptable, they generated a dialog between business owners and workers which I think we can all agree should exist. Some of these problems don't exist anymore, do problems still exist? Yes, should they be addressed of course is opinion. So if we had no unions, would these problems return, would new problems be made, would we just end up with unions again solving the same problems? It's cold outside so I got a blanket, now that I'm hot I don't need the blanket anymore so I take it off. Some problems are on-going, and checks will always be needed, and who will do those checks?

-Times are different, this cannot be understated. Unions formed when we were a much more industrious society and now we are a much more information based society. More workers are white collar than ever before. This had shifted the majority opinion since it isn't typically white collar that are unionized. I would like to make the argument that whatever their argument is, unions still generate a needed dialog because an effective business model is one that effectively addresses issues with their entire organization, not just one group. Most business owners would agree, you don't want to let problems linger - and unions are one means of solving problems, or the alternative is to just have individual sit down meetings with all 9,000 employees rather than 2-3 people representing everyone... yeah, have fun champ.

-The comments about firing union workers. Government also gets attacked for leaving under performers in place, and I ask what the actual issue is. Are these workers not being removed because management isn't willing to go through the process of removal, is the process broken and not being fixed, is the worker really an under-performer? Since no worker is perfect, even the guys who "bust their ass" have a drawback that is often times overlooked - the question becomes what culture are you building in your workers and your management? I've had workers who work so hard they miss the big picture, I've had workers that seem really lazy and uncaring but then produce some amazing innovation. Since workers are an investment and not an expense, if you spent time investing in those workers shouldn't they be coached up to be successful, you've already made a down-payment right? Sometimes dismissal is the only option, no disagreement, but there aren't only two types of workers (ass-busters & slackers), it's a spectrum that people move around on throughout their lives, hell, day to day my productivity changes based on coffee consumption. Justification to destroy all unions, nah, just because you got bad service at one 7-11 doesn't mean they are all bad (well, they are but that's besides the point).

-Just an observation of modern culture these days as unions (and many other things) are almost perceived as sports teams. I'm not on team union so they are all bad, or I'm with team union so they can do no wrong. Team Obama, Team Trump, Team Edward, Team Hawkeyes (yeah, I'm going to the Rose Bowl, Go Hawks!). I understand hating on the Dallas Cowboys because they won a lot in the 90's or cheering them on because they were your team in the 90's - while you are correct to say that their uniforms are ugly, that doesn't mean every NFL team is evil (maybe a little, but the NFL is unionized *wink*).

My closing comment will be remember that every piece of information you get or hear is likely biased in some way. "The cops tackled and beat up a poor homeless man who was trying to put peanut butter on his bread" vs. "The suspect ran away with stolen bread and a knife in hand was apprehended" - So what have you heard about unions and who told you it?

A long read I know, but I truly believe in seeing all perspectives is key in any issue - and taking one side entirely and unwaiveringly (probably not a word) is usually a position of the uninformed. I tried to keep this as politically neutral as possible.

 

I do not. Please share with us what Reagan did to the ATC folks in the 70s....the 1970s???

Btw, I'm just bustin balls....

 

I believe Toyota's are non-union made. That is a huge reason I bought one. Don't get me started on government unions. Just watch the news and see what is happening at the VA. And look at how well our schools are performing. Also, take a look at what FDR said about public sector unions. He was not a fan. George Meany was no fan, either. If it works, it most likely is not union made.

 

I'm done here, I'll go back to talking tacomas....

 

I just read all 8 pages of this thread at my non union blue collar job